Hearth.com Home - The leading source of information on fireplaces, wood stoves, gas stoves, chimneys and pellet stoves

 

.... ...Or, Search entire Hearth.com Site by clicking here......

   
 
Classic E 2300
Posted: 14 May 2008 10:28 AM   [ Ignore ]
Burning Chunk
RankRank
Fowlerville MI
Total Posts:  24
Joined  2008-03-11

Is the Classic E 2300 a gassifier OWB or how are they meeting a EPA rating? I am wanting a gassifier but am having trouble with where to put it do to insurance restrictions.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 May 2008 11:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
Moderator
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRank
Clinton, NY
Total Posts:  4684
Joined  2005-11-18

There were a couple at the show in Essex Jct. last weekend. I looked them over pretty good. Craig has some nice photos of the inside and outside in the Logging Expo HUGE thread.

I talked to one of the dealers and a factory rep at the show. I was not impressed with their knowledge of the product, or at least their willingness to share whatever knowledge they might have had. They claim that slot at the bottom of the firebox is not a nozzle. The steel assembly they likened to a grate. The dealer had never seen one operate. He said that his understanding was that you get some smoke, though a lot less than a conventional OWB. Both the factory rep and the dealer claimed that it’s not a gasifier. But when I pointed out that the cutaway is basically a European-style downdraft gasifier, they pretty much confirmed that it’s supposed to work like one.

So I don’t know. I sure wouldn’t buy one before they had been in the field for a couple of years and I could find out how they work. Or if they work.

I think the only fan is a draft induction unit.

I hope they work, because we really do need some good outdoor gasifiers on the market. It looks to be well built and presumably, well designed.

 Signature 

Orlan EKO 60
1,000 gallons of hot water storage (pending).

I like a source of fuel where the price, supply and quality are controlled by one guy: me.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 May 2008 08:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
firestarter
Rank
Southwest MIchigan
Total Posts:  16
Joined  2008-01-01

Eric, point and a question. When I talked to one of the salesmen at CB, he told me pretty much the same thing as you were told. But when I pressed him about how it works, it pretty much sounds like a downdraft gasifier to me. So I’m thinking that the reason they don’t want to call the nozzle a nozzle, ans the reaction chamber a gasification chamber is to use the psycology of bigger, badder, and more extreme must be better? If they use the same terminalogy as a foreign/cheaper unit then what would they have to brag about to make their unit the best buy?

Secondly, did you see or hear anything about the unit needing a 20lb propane cylinder attached to it to help burn the gasses at idle? I heard something about that on another site/forum a while back and cannot find the site again.

Thanks!

Chris

Edit ~ this is another reason why I am wanting to see the Woodmaster gasifier coming out this summer. When I talked to the owner of woodmaster, right off the bat he told me their unit was a downdraft gasifier, and talked in terminology that the layman can understand to make an informed decision. I didn’t get pumped up full of BS like I did with CB, and in this day and age when a dollar doesn’t go very far, the last place I’m going to spend my money is with a salesman who doesn’t know their product, nor the actual names of the parts within their design. Central would get alot farther if they get rid of the ex used car salesmen, and get some technically competent salesmen on their team. Just my opinion of course.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 May 2008 11:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
Moderator
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRank
Clinton, NY
Total Posts:  4684
Joined  2005-11-18

A valid one, IMO.

The E has a “dual fuel” option, which I don’t quite understand, but that’s what it says on their website.

 Signature 

Orlan EKO 60
1,000 gallons of hot water storage (pending).

I like a source of fuel where the price, supply and quality are controlled by one guy: me.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 01:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
Fire Honor Society
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
Starksboro, Vermont
Total Posts:  89
Joined  2008-03-04

Hi all -

the dual fuel model lets the unit run on propane if the wood fire goes out and the house calls for heat. It also gives you the option of using propane to start a fire and for the propane to fire for a short burst when the unit comes out of idle to help get the temp back up and minimize smoke. This is an option package and makes the unit more expensive. The wood only model uses no fossil fuels - just electricity for the fan, lights, and pumps.

Pete

 Signature 

Central Boiler E-Classic 2300

“If you don’t know the ground, you are probably wrong about nearly everything else” - Norman Maclean

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 01:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
Fire Honor Society
Avatar
RankRankRankRank
NY
Total Posts:  420
Joined  2007-11-07

I must be doing something wrong, ‘cause with the GW, to make it ‘smoke free’, I make sure to load it appropriatly (just enough fuel to sustain heat production for the time required, and use dry, solid fuel). I guess I need to hook up some propane to it to make it smoke free instead of actually being responsible about the way I load it.

Hmmm, I wonder if I could burn tires in it smoke free if I added enough propane?

 Signature 

cheese

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 02:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
firestarter
Rank
N.W Wisconsin
Total Posts:  19
Joined  2008-02-25

http://www.epa.gov/woodheaters/models.htm Looking at the site for cleaner owb the 2300 is the best out there.  does anyone know if these are independent tests???  If so it looks like I may have found my stove.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 02:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
Pyro Extraordinaire
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRank
Addison County, Vermont
Total Posts:  1367
Joined  2007-10-04
Johnny Ringo - 15 May 2008 02:27 PM

http://www.epa.gov/woodheaters/models.htm Looking at the site for cleaner owb the 2300 is the best out there.  does anyone know if these are independent tests???  If so it looks like I may have found my stove.

The Central is measured at .31 lbs of particulate emissions per million BTU of heat output. That makes it clean for an OWB, and much better than some of the others. This is progress,

By comparison, the EKO 80 measured 2.3 grams per hour, or .018 lbs/million BTU in European certified independent tests. I suspect that other true gasifiers would be in the same range. This shows just how far it’s possible to go in terms of burning wood cleanly. There are even cleaner models being built in Europe now.

 Signature 

Orlan EKO 25, 880 gallon storage
Passive solar hot water
Homebrew controller
http://www.nofossil.org
Be a voyeur - see live graph of last two hours system performance

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 03:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
Pyro Extraordinaire
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRank
Maine
Total Posts:  1085
Joined  2007-11-30

looks like the GW 100 burns adequately at 18k btu/hr.
imprressed me if i read it right.

 Signature 

Axis develops from circle learning shortcuts.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 04:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
Pyro Extraordinaire
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRank
Addison County, Vermont
Total Posts:  1367
Joined  2007-10-04
Pook - 15 May 2008 03:05 PM

looks like the GW 100 burns adequately at 18k btu/hr.
imprressed me if i read it right.

What’s it rated for? 18k is pretty low output.

It’s more than 6 times the particulate pollution of the Central 2300, and 113 times as much as the EKO 80.

 Signature 

Orlan EKO 25, 880 gallon storage
Passive solar hot water
Homebrew controller
http://www.nofossil.org
Be a voyeur - see live graph of last two hours system performance

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 May 2008 09:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
Fire Honor Society
RankRankRankRank
NoLoMich
Total Posts:  326
Joined  2007-10-15

RE: EPA test.

Once again our dear friends in the federal gubmint have come up with a rating system that has little relationship to real world conditions. The test procedure is about as far from real life as you can get. From what I have read/heard the wood used is sawn into rectangular blocks and is kiln dried to less than 20% moisture. The wood is then stacked, crib style in the firebox and burned at 25%, 50% and 100% load. The results are averaged which really helps out the units that idle a lot because the cleanest burn is always at full throttle. If they had to pass solely at 25% or 50% they wouldn’t be able to meet the standard. (That is the reason BTW that you do not see Garn on the EPA list even though it is reputed to be cleaner than anything else tested. It can’t burn at 25 or 50% load.) This test bears about as much resemblance to real world conditions as the stupid AFUE rating found on gas and oil appliances.

I’ll say it once again, I wouldn’t trust anything said or any claim made by CB or their salesmen regarding their product. I’ve seen way too many people get burned by misleading statements, false claims or outright lies to recommend a CB product to anyone. My experience with CB has mainly been when a frustrated homeowner calls me to try and pin down what is “wrong” with their system after the CB guys quit returning phone calls. In most cases there is nothing “wrong” with the boiler other than the fact that it’s working as designed.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 17 May 2008 10:30 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
Pyro Extraordinaire
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRank
Maine
Total Posts:  1085
Joined  2007-11-30
nofossil - 15 May 2008 04:55 PM
Pook - 15 May 2008 03:05 PM

looks like the GW 100 burns adequately at 18k btu/hr.
imprressed me if i read it right.

What’s it rated for? 18k is pretty low output.

It’s more than 6 times the particulate pollution of the Central 2300, and 113 times as much as the EKO 80.

GW 100 rated @100k btu. seems emmissions would reduce at higher output. it passed the testing @ 18k btu which to me says less hassle with firefeeding,prolonged burn, & maybe no need for heat storage.

 Signature 

Axis develops from circle learning shortcuts.

Profile