Being closer to the dogs level makes it better for the guy on the bike. Start growling at them. Throws their whole scheme all out of kilter. Funny, I got bit by a dog for the first time last year...on my road bike, before I got the recumbent. Rode all summer long and never had one problem on the bike. That really surprised me because we have lots of dogs around here, but honestly, I had zero problems. I do keep pepper spray handy though, just in case. And a 4’ length of rubber hose. Not vinyl hose, but rubber. Works much better. At my age you can’t outrun the dogs any more.
A dog handling tactic that is taught in Motorcycle safety classes MIGHT be useful on a pedal bike, I’m not sure - it works like a charm on an M/C, but not sure if a pedal bike can manage the needed speed change… It also takes a bit of pre-planning and advance looking - doesn’t work on the “ambush mutts” that spring out of hiding. However most dogs are visible, and they have a readily observable “windup” behaviour pattern if they are inclined to chase - visible tracking, and going into a crouch, etc., clearly a different behavior from the dog that has no evil intent.
What the motorcycle safety people say is that as soon as you see a dog doing the “windup”, you should SLOW DOWN slightly, just back off the throttle 3-5mph and then maintain a steady speed. Then as soon as Rover starts to make his dash, accelerate back up the same 3-5mph. It is amazingly effective - Rover ends up about 20 feet behind you, in a tremendously confused state. First time I tried it, I nearly fell off the bike laughing at the expression on the dog’s face as he tried to figure out where I’d vanished to…
The theory is that dogs have been chasing things for eons, and have evolved a very efficient “intercept calculator” to tell them when and how fast to run in order to catch a meal moving at speed X, but it only works while they are stationary, they can’t recalculate “on the fly”. If you slow down while they are planning their move, then speed up once they commit, you screw up their calculations and they end up well behind you, in a serious state of mental bafflement that you aren’t where you were supposed to be…
The advantage over “encounter” tactics is that you never get close to the dog, thus there is no risk of him grabbing whatever you are trying to hit him with and taking you down, or otherwise disturbing your stability - also doesn’t have the risk of the irresponsible dog owner seeing you attempt to “damage precious Muttley” and doing something unkind in return…
Goose, may work but I don’t think the speed difference and max speed of a bicyclist vrs a dog would make that trick effective for long. Would throw them off for a bit but a decent large sized german shepherd like dog is probably going to have a higher max speed over long periods than a cyclist on a straight and level road.
What is useful on cyclists and on motorcycles that folks should learn (not just for dogs) is how to countersteer. You’ll be able to turn a lot quicker once you gain the skill and habit. Countersteering is similar to a motorcycle in that you turn your handlebar a split second in the opposite direction you want to turn, it naturally puts the momentum of the bike in the direction you want to turn, unlike if you are going any speed and simply turn the direction you want to go. Works like a charm.
Once, I ran over the back of a groundhog on my bike commute, although I slowed down enough so that I didn’t literally run him over but my front tire put a mark on the guy’s backside and he took off to my left…
I think goose may be on to something. Seems a lot like football when a defender has got the angle on a running-back but then the back kicks it into a higher gear. I’ve seen many a Viking defender looked dazed, confused and totally baffled when this happens to them.. Personally I would not want to give up my momentum on a pedal bike and prefer to accelerate as soon as the evil entent was verified, or to be perfectly honest, slow acceleration begins with me and continues until it is clear the dog has no interest. But… If he’s up there waiting for me then the water bottle comes out. Flicking water at them always works. It’s like they assume there is going to be big trouble if any of that unidentified stuff gets on them. Now it takes a leap of faith on the cyclists part to yell and flick water with authority.LOL But it’s worked for me every-time. Except for that one time....... I had no time to do any of the above. That dog was clearly faster, quicker, and more intelligent than me. Ambushed on a hill......
Getting off the bike is still probably the best. I’ve seen very few dogs that you can’t make back down. However, there was one time that I did have a problem getting back on the bike. Every time I turned my back the dog would come at me. I finally did get away and also called the sheriff when I got home. No more problem with that dog.
Had another neighbor who had a mean one. One day I went by, or tried, and the dog came right out and I could tell making friends was not on his mind. I wasted no time getting off the bike and had the dog backing up when someone came out of the house. Well, at least they stuck their head out the door. I not so politely informed them they would be missing a dog shortly if that continued as I would personally take care of the matter. But I also did call the sheriff again. No more problem with that dog either.
If you do get off the bike they say the best thing is to keep the bike between you and the dog. I probably would if it required but as stated, I’ve not had much problem backing down a dog....and I’ve had lots of experience because of the type of work I used to do which required going into lots of people’s driveways. You meet all sorts. Only two types I was afraid of; dobermans and St. Bernards. Dobermans are so fast and usually circle you and St. Bernards are just plain stupid and you have to knock them out before they will stop.
Still through it all, I’ve been bit by only one dog in my life...and that was last spring. Had some times though that certainly had me a bit scared, but still managed to get out of the situations.
As a bike commuter and tourer I’ve haven’t had much incedents with dogs, been chased lazily by a few but they were more of the playful kind, nothing like teeth bare, growling, etc. etc. I have had numerous insane squirrels and one deer in Maine that crossed my path and the said groundhog I barely hit… I, however, think that most of the unleashed dog population would be found in more rural parts of the nation, not NJ where there are cars everywhere. Cars, here in NJ, do a good enough job to cull the leashless pets enough that I don’t worry about leashleg dogs too much, most everybody rightfully uses a leash.
The few times I’ve dealt with dogs is when I’m in nowhere, Maine or places like in rural VT, etc.
Getting off the bike is still probably the best. I’ve seen very few dogs that you can’t make back down. However, there was one time that I did have a problem getting back on the bike. Every time I turned my back the dog would come at me. I finally did get away and also called the sheriff when I got home. No more problem with that dog.
Had another neighbor who had a mean one. One day I went by, or tried, and the dog came right out and I could tell making friends was not on his mind. I wasted no time getting off the bike and had the dog backing up when someone came out of the house. Well, at least they stuck their head out the door. I not so politely informed them they would be missing a dog shortly if that continued as I would personally take care of the matter. But I also did call the sheriff again. No more problem with that dog either.
If you do get off the bike they say the best thing is to keep the bike between you and the dog. I probably would if it required but as stated, I’ve not had much problem backing down a dog....and I’ve had lots of experience because of the type of work I used to do which required going into lots of people’s driveways. You meet all sorts. Only two types I was afraid of; dobermans and St. Bernards. Dobermans are so fast and usually circle you and St. Bernards are just plain stupid and you have to knock them out before they will stop.
Still through it all, I’ve been bit by only one dog in my life...and that was last spring. Had some times though that certainly had me a bit scared, but still managed to get out of the situations.
Actually my experience was the opposite - when I was doing delivery stuff, I always found the dogs to be scared about were the little “drop-kickable” psycho-mutts - toy poodles, chihuahas, etc… People with big dogs mostly realize that their dogs are potentially dangerous and control them, plus big dogs “advertise” when they have hostile intent… (Biggest problem with big dogs is when they are FRIENDLY - they are likely to knock you over, especially something like a Bernie tries to put his paws on your shoulders and give you a welcoming “doggie kiss” it’s a bit of a load… ) The (mostly ladies) with psycho-mutts think of them as “cute” and don’t try as hard to control them, and it is hard to tell the hostile behaviour pattern from the general yap-o-matic bouncing around until they come up and try to take a chunk out of your ankle. Most delivery guys I’ve mentioned this to say the same thing, little dogs are NUTS and thus unpredictable. I figure it’s just an inferiority complex, they figure they have to do somethng just to make sure you notice them....
Goose, may work but I don’t think the speed difference and max speed of a bicyclist vrs a dog would make that trick effective for long. Would throw them off for a bit but a decent large sized german shepherd like dog is probably going to have a higher max speed over long periods than a cyclist on a straight and level road.
What is useful on cyclists and on motorcycles that folks should learn (not just for dogs) is how to countersteer. You’ll be able to turn a lot quicker once you gain the skill and habit. Countersteering is similar to a motorcycle in that you turn your handlebar a split second in the opposite direction you want to turn, it naturally puts the momentum of the bike in the direction you want to turn, unlike if you are going any speed and simply turn the direction you want to go. Works like a charm.
Once, I ran over the back of a groundhog on my bike commute, although I slowed down enough so that I didn’t literally run him over but my front tire put a mark on the guy’s backside and he took off to my left…
Jay
I agree on the virtues of countersteering, it is good for evading all sorts of issues. The trouble is turning in the direction the dog isn’t… What the MSF teaches w/ regard to dogs, and other living obstacles like wildlife and pedestrians is to steer straight at them as long as possible while slowing, at the last moment, AFTER they have started to make their break for it, countersteer to avoid… Theory being that they can be hard to predict as to what they will do for evasive manuveurs - will they break straight ahead, or turn around and try to make it back to the sidewalk? By waiting for them to make their move you avoid the risk of dodging the same way they make their break…
I did run over a dog once - medium small size, somewhere between a beagle and small collie size. Was a chronic chaser, and lived at the intersection of two streets where I had to make a corner, so had to slow to his speed for the corner and couldn’t do the usual accellerate trick. I’d gotten him once with a steel toe, so he mostly kept his distance, but was still an annoyance. However one day I was accelerating as he was running along side and about 10’ ahead of me. We approached the back of a parked car, so he did a jog to dodge the car and ended up right in front of me - I used the standard “obstacle surmounting” tactics (also taught by safety classes) and gave it the gas while pulling back on the handlebars - got three bumps, so I’m pretty sure I got him with both wheels and the frame. Found a big gob of hair hanging off the kickstand return spring when I got to work, but the bike never even wobbled. Saw the dog scrabbling for the curb in the rearview but couldn’t stop as I would have been late for work.
Did go to the house I thought he belonged to that evening, apologized to the lady, but told her that her dog should have been trained right in the first place. She claimed it wasn’t their dog, only a stray that they fed, but that she would have her husband look for it. I did see the dog a few weeks later, so he did live through it, but I never got chased by him again - in fact all I ever saw of him was the back end as he high-tailed it the other way any time he heard me coming. (I’m not complaining....)
Along the lines of slowing down, then speeding up to confuse a chasing dog, I’ve been told to slow down, speed up over and over again until the dog loses interest. If the dog is committed to the chase, you get a fantastic workout. I’ve only had a couple chances to try it on my pedal bike, thankfully, and it’s been successful. I want to learn more about this counter steering. Could have come in handy a couple of years ago in Maine as I rounded a bend going to 35 mph on my road bike to see a gray squirrel undecided if he should dart back into the woods or cross the road. He chose the latter and I squarely ran him over at the front shoulders with both wheels. Tough little guy, no sooner than my back wheel was off him, he was scurrying back into the woods.
I’d recommend Trek bikes and have had two mtn. bikes by Jamis. Made in NJ, I believe. Solid frames.
As a former bike shops manager for 4 years and a experienced rider I would recomend (for your intended use) nothing else other than a 29” MT bike. 29” is not the frame size, it is the wheel diameter. A normal MT bike has a 26” wheel diameter. This 29” wheel size will allow you to have a more user friendly and comfortable frame geometry. It will also handle your weight substantially better than a traditional 26” MTB frame. The link I am posting is for the frame only but I could help you with the specs on building it up. Web cyclery also offers this bike as a compelte build but you have to call for a price. PS, this is a great price for this frame. Surly is a top notch manufacturer! MADE IN THE USA.
I won’t comment on the bike selection because there has been some great suggestions already.
I got a kick out of the dog comments though!
I used to race bikes. This meant often I would train between 250-500 miles per week on County Roads here in Iowa.
Dogs can be dangerous for many reasons. The main one being they can chase you with intent to bite but then make you swerve into traffic and get hit.
If I had a dog that was a chaser-bitter on one of my routes I would pack a conventional squirt gun with some Ammonia in it. I would let the dog get close to me then give it a shot towards the snout.
Man they would yelp!
It always worked. A dog learns a lesson fast. They would see me comming and start to come to the road and I would show them the squirt gun and they would promptly turn around and run to the barn.
[quote author="Gooserider" date="1206050602]
Actually my experience was the opposite - when I was doing delivery stuff, I always found the dogs to be scared about were the little “drop-kickable” psycho-mutts - toy poodles, chihuahas, etc… People with big dogs mostly realize that their dogs are potentially dangerous and control them, plus big dogs “advertise” when they have hostile intent… (Biggest problem with big dogs is when they are FRIENDLY - they are likely to knock you over, especially something like a Bernie tries to put his paws on your shoulders and give you a welcoming “doggie kiss” it’s a bit of a load… ) The (mostly ladies) with psycho-mutts think of them as “cute” and don’t try as hard to control them, and it is hard to tell the hostile behaviour pattern from the general yap-o-matic bouncing around until they come up and try to take a chunk out of your ankle. Most delivery guys I’ve mentioned this to say the same thing, little dogs are NUTS and thus unpredictable. I figure it’s just an inferiority complex, they figure they have to do somethng just to make sure you notice them....
I agree that you are more likely to have trouble with small dogs, but large dogs may be more likely to hurt you if they actually bite you. I haven’t ridden for a number of years, but back when I was in training for a couple thousand mile ride, I carried a BB pistol that looked (from a distance) like a real gun. It didn’t really work very well on the dogs, but it scared the owners badly (pointed at the dogs, not the owners). Might not be able to get away with that today.
For walks with my dog, I now carry a Dazer (emits a high-pitched noise that dogs can hear, but not people). So far, it has stopped all dogs (eventually), but is clearly more effective on some dogs than others. It seems to be less effective on small dogs with high-pitched barks (my personal observation only). My dog is mostly deaf, so it doesn’t bother her at all.
I’ve only had a couple chances to try it on my pedal bike, thankfully, and it’s been successful. I want to learn more about this counter steering. Could have come in handy a couple of years ago in Maine as I rounded a bend going to 35 mph on my road bike to see a gray squirrel undecided if he should dart back into the woods or cross the road. He chose the latter and I squarely ran him over at the front shoulders with both wheels. Tough little guy, no sooner than my back wheel was off him, he was scurrying back into the woods.
