No house is completely tight. My feelings is that outside an air vent in 90% of cases is overkill and hurts more then helps. The exception would be in a mobile home which is real tight and would require an outside vent. If you have a chimney, dryer, bathroom vent, etc etc etc, it will find the air from these sources.
Quite possible , but you are now creating a forced draft by sucking in unnecessary infiltrated air . Doesn`t make any sense to me to install a pellet stove to save money and then create forced drafts.
Didn`t you read the post from FredJ?
OK, so now I’m totally confused. I’m getting a Summer’s Heat stove mid-August. All of the stoves from ESW state that the OAK is mandatory when installing one of there stoves. Why would the manufacturer make it mandatory? Is this for legal reasons???
Thanks,
Greg
in order to certify stove, testing of specific conditions are involved & it cost more per situation so i’m guessing englander simply didnt test for non OAK condition due to extra costs. Insurance co. will demand OAK if so specified by mfr. i think
Thanks for all your replies. So what I’m gathering from all this info is that there really is not a true answer. everyone has their own philosophies I guess. The only thing I can tell you guys is that my house was built in 2007, was wrapped in Tyvec wrap, and that my install will be in a corner where there are already three windows (which is why I need to do a vertical install). Would this, then, change the equation?
But there is a true answer , it`s just rarely obvious . Just from reading the many forum posts on this subject it`s easy to conclude that the absence of an OAK will seldom (rarely) cause a stove to function abnormally but that doesn`t mean it isn`t creating cold air drafts and adding to your heating demands not to mention the possibility of altering the pressurization of the house on occasions.
OK, so now I’m totally confused. I’m getting a Summer’s Heat stove mid-August. All of the stoves from ESW state that the OAK is mandatory when installing one of there stoves. Why would the manufacturer make it mandatory? Is this for legal reasons???
Thanks,
Greg
in order to certify stove, testing of specific conditions are involved & it cost more per situation so i’m guessing englander simply didnt test for non OAK condition due to extra costs. Insurance co. will demand OAK if so specified by mfr. i think
Let`s assume ESW`s mandatory OAK requirement is in fact for legal reasons (protection against lawsuits). Do you think they would add this potential expense where other competitors ignore the same?
The reason is obvious. The potential does in fact exist.
so air displacement heat loss @ 100K btu/day would be a nice manageable figure.
So a 30kbtu stove would burn an extra 3hours and 20 minutes a day more than the same stove with an OAK right?
so i guess that 12lbs of pellets would be max heatloss due to air infiltration for unit running constantly with 50* temp differential. [16Mbtu/ton @ 10% humidity content of pellets]
Thats about 1 extra bag every 3 days at $5/bag ( prices vary alot- so figuring $250 a ton) which equals $50 a month then add the 3hrs20 min a day to that for the extra running time of 100 hours (or 4 days) extra/month--- too much for me to literally put up the smoke stack....
so air displacement heat loss @ 100K btu/day would be a nice manageable figure.
So a 30kbtu stove would burn an extra 3hours and 20 minutes a day more than the same stove with an OAK right?
so i guess that 12lbs of pellets would be max heatloss due to air infiltration for unit running constantly with 50* temp differential. [16Mbtu/ton @ 10% humidity content of pellets]
Thats about 1 extra bag every 3 days at $5/bag ( prices vary alot- so figuring $250 a ton) which equals $50 a month then add the 3hrs20 min a day to that for the extra running time of 100 hours (or 4 days) extra/month--- too much for me to literally put up the smoke stack....
GOTTA HAVE FRESH AIR TO BREATHE! do a little research on “indoor air pollution” from EPA sites.
Lets see now, my Harman user manual states OAK as optional (mandatory in small homes and mobilehomes) but claims that an OAK increases efficiency. I assume this benefit has to be the same when installed with any stove brand.
Doesn`t it make good sense to install an OAK to have the stove operate with as much efficiency as possible? Why else go thru all the expense and work of utilizing a stove if not to benefit to the max?
Installing a pellet stove with an OAK does not in any way change the quantity of available air you breath in your home.
If you are OK without a stove why would that volume change with a stove and an OAK?
GOTTA HAVE FRESH AIR TO BREATHE! do a little research on “indoor air pollution” from EPA sites.
I am confused..
Why wouldnt you have fresh air to breath? Without an OAK yes you are pulling in fresh air, but WITH an OAK its like not even having the stove installed.. either way there isnt any air contamination ( unless of course you are pulling in the smokey exhaust when NOT using a OAK- wouldnt happen with an OAK) .
So why this statement?
Installing a pellet stove with an OAK does not in any way change the quantity of available air you breath in your home.
If you are OK without a stove why would that volume change with a stove and an OAK?
without the OAK fresh air will be brought into house for breathing purposes. too much is a waste of heat but too little can create health consequences. 1/3 indoor volume/ hr. exchange is ideal figure, i think, & inline with 72CFM figure.
Installing a pellet stove with an OAK does not in any way change the quantity of available air you breath in your home.
If you are OK without a stove why would that volume change with a stove and an OAK?
without the OAK fresh air will be brought into house for breathing purposes. too much is a waste of heat but too little can create health consequences. 1/3 indoor volume/ hr. exchange is ideal figure, i think, & inline with 72CFM figure.
Because the air from an OAK is specifically directed into the combustion and up the chimney. It shouldn`t affect the equation of the normal household air.
The purpose, function, design , or effect of a pellet stove should not be for drawing in fresh air to breath.
I have tried to post the page dealing with Outside Air Requirements from my 13NC Englander Stove Manuel.(file was too large) If you read it, it is says outside air is required for mobile homes and double-wides and tightly weather sealed homes.
I did do a lot of complaining about this requirement because my mobile home is a hybrid, 600 sq. ft is stick built (2X6 walls) and 500 sq. ft.is the original trailer, plus it has a trussed roof installed over the original roof and additions and it has gable end vents and soffit vents. It also has an attic access stairway. 2 of the walls of the original trailer have been cut away to provide for the stick built portions. My mobile is 40 years old. For such small square footage I did burn 750 gallons of K-1 last year. I also run a full size dryer in my moble. Do i think i need an outside air hook-up. No way. But code requires me to put one in so I will.
I’m just wondering how much this cold outside air is costing me in lost BTU’s required to heat this cold air?
Much of this stuff is regional based on climate and building standards....I think the state of MN, for instance, has requirements for tight construction and outside air.
Using a more simple guide, folks who live in cold climates should usually consider OAKs for pellet stoves.
Note that John seems to not suggest OAK on regular natural draft stoves and fireplaces........but on forced draft systems it may be required.
Personally, I would decide based on a number of factors - what the maker says, the tightness of my home, the ease of installing it, how often I was going to use the stove....and especially how open the room was to other areas of the home. I would definitely attempt to use OAK in smaller rooms and areas not open to most of the house.
I have tried to post the page dealing with Outside Air Requirements from my 13NC Englander Stove Manuel.(file was too large) If you read it, it is says outside air is required for mobile homes and double-wides and tightly weather sealed homes.
I did do a lot of complaining about this requirement because my mobile home is a hybrid, 600 sq. ft is stick built (2X6 walls) and 500 sq. ft.is the original trailer, plus it has a trussed roof installed over the original roof and additions and it has gable end vents and soffit vents. It also has an attic access stairway. 2 of the walls of the original trailer have been cut away to provide for the stick built portions. My mobile is 40 years old. For such small square footage I did burn 750 gallons of K-1 last year. I also run a full size dryer in my moble. Do i think i need an outside air hook-up. No way. But code requires me to put one in so I will.
yes & eng. sells stoves, not ventilation systems. air to air heat recovery ventilators have evolved because tight houses require fresh air for breathing.
Yes, Ok for breathing, but doesn’t my clothes dryer that I used all winter with a 4” hose to the outside have the same potential to suffocate one?
Please ellucidate Glowball? (Damn there’s that big word again, I’m sure to get some nasty posts about it like I did the last time I used it....about 20) Are you saying by spending a bunch of money I don’t have, I can buy some gizmo to mitigate my heat loss?
I’m just still miffed after all these months that I still have to heat my stove with cold air. I’ll get over it in 2 or 3 years.
Very much so, JP....in fact, Gulland was called into many houses where woodstoves were not working correctly because of the dryer and other such ventilation. The combination of all these things can add up.
But I somewhat agree that a powered unit - like a pellet stove...in most cases will simply end up sucking more air into the house through cracks (as opposed to misbehaving)........
I spoke to some experts about this years ago and learned all kinds of things...for instance, there were lawsuits against woodstove makers because of soot covering the walls in a house. After investigation, the culprit in this (and many other) situations turned out to be.....attached garages. Think about it - when you start your car it spews exhaust into your garage. If the house is depressurized, the house pulls in this exhaust though seals in the door, etc. -
Another big culprit was candles.
The important thing is to keep in mind all of the various systems at work. Personally, I almost never use candles....and I pull out of the garage immediately.
Geez, we never had these problems 40 years ago. All we did was knock out a window pane and replace it with a piece of tin and cut a hole for our stove pipe and we never died.
And yes Fred I run my dryer 24/7 as I have stock in a couple of Power companies… He He
