New Jotul 500 install - should I put in a pipe butterfly damper?
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I hear you Logger, and yeah, I know that. I came to this realization the hard way, starting by burning with wetter wood, and just came up dissapointed with the performance.
I should also state that the 10% figure I'm quoting is a surface reading (or as deep a reading as my Ryobi meter will register) If you split one of my bigger splits and took that reading on a fresh surface, you may be gettting something 50% higher or maybe even more...I'm just guessing, because I don't ever do that. My observations were geared toward the typical burner, who is not likely to re-split a log before deciding if it meets his/her criteria either. Jotul's blanket recommendation for ALL stoves is 20%, which I imagine is a through-and-through average. They don't say.(Their wood species examples are decidedly...umm..Nordic as well) Nor do they break it down as to what is best for each individual stove. Given the large range in sizes and configurations they build, I don't see how one m.c. would be optimal for all.
I'm not one of those who feel that 0% m.c. is the ideal, no. My experience with the Castine has also been (and we weren't discussing this aspect of it) that if you get much drier than 10%, your risk for overfire rises dramatically. A wetter log will burn longer, but the heat return is a longer tail too, we know that. You've got to burn that water off as vapor, no way around that and water cools fire. At some critical point for each individual stove, you reach a tipping point. It is like a recent discussion about just throwing a whole unseasoned round into your firebox. Well yeah, you'll get an "all day" burn, no doubt. If I'm tending my stove the way I should, I want to get the heat out and I don't mind reloading more frequently to do that. If your goal is to just see how long you can keep a fire, there are ways to do that for sure.
What I'm really responding to in all of this is the idea that my setup is somehow abnormal....it ain't. If somebody wants to run the Castine at it's peak output, my experience has shown me that it takes a little drier wood than you might think, that's all. I'm going to see if other Castine owners feel that as well.
I should also state that the 10% figure I'm quoting is a surface reading (or as deep a reading as my Ryobi meter will register) If you split one of my bigger splits and took that reading on a fresh surface, you may be gettting something 50% higher or maybe even more...I'm just guessing, because I don't ever do that. My observations were geared toward the typical burner, who is not likely to re-split a log before deciding if it meets his/her criteria either. Jotul's blanket recommendation for ALL stoves is 20%, which I imagine is a through-and-through average. They don't say.(Their wood species examples are decidedly...umm..Nordic as well) Nor do they break it down as to what is best for each individual stove. Given the large range in sizes and configurations they build, I don't see how one m.c. would be optimal for all.
I'm not one of those who feel that 0% m.c. is the ideal, no. My experience with the Castine has also been (and we weren't discussing this aspect of it) that if you get much drier than 10%, your risk for overfire rises dramatically. A wetter log will burn longer, but the heat return is a longer tail too, we know that. You've got to burn that water off as vapor, no way around that and water cools fire. At some critical point for each individual stove, you reach a tipping point. It is like a recent discussion about just throwing a whole unseasoned round into your firebox. Well yeah, you'll get an "all day" burn, no doubt. If I'm tending my stove the way I should, I want to get the heat out and I don't mind reloading more frequently to do that. If your goal is to just see how long you can keep a fire, there are ways to do that for sure.
What I'm really responding to in all of this is the idea that my setup is somehow abnormal....it ain't. If somebody wants to run the Castine at it's peak output, my experience has shown me that it takes a little drier wood than you might think, that's all. I'm going to see if other Castine owners feel that as well.
If you have 10% on the OUTSIDE they I understand what you are saying, we (people on this site) make it a point to tell people to check on a fresh split. I dont agree with some of statements about moisture content on this forum but I dont think you are out in left field or your system is abnormal now that you explained how you get your reading.
Simple misunderstanding, and my fault for not being more specific.
Can't believe I can spend this much time discussing wood and water. I need to get out more.
Can't believe I can spend this much time discussing wood and water. I need to get out more.
I didn't think your setup was abnormal. Just thought the idea that wood needs to be under 10% was a big overstatement. I dont think an outside moisture reading will be too accurate as to the moisture in the middle of a split, but thats a diff topic. This got me to thinking of a question I really dont know the answer to. Im sure its diff with various species of wood, but for some common ones (oak, maple, locust, cherry, ash, etc), I wonder at what point in the moisture reading does a split starts to lose its heating value. As I mentioned, I know too much seasoning isn't a good thing either, but does anyone know the actaul moisture % when wood has actually begun to lose its full capability of heat output? Reminds me of the shelf life of wine. When does wood start to go "bad..." any input?
IIRC, Wood never "loses heat" when it goes down to 0% MC. What happens is at moisture levels probably under 15%, definitely under 10%, the rate of pyrolysis (smoke production) can get out of hand--and if your stove is not designed to deal with this, i.e. it doesn't provide sufficient secondary air to combust the smoke being produced, then you are "losing heat" because you'll be burning slightly dirty--lively secondaries or glowing catalyst, but still some smoke making its way up the chimney. I'm willing to bet most EPA stoves fall in this category because they weren't specifically designed to work with <15% wood. It's probably not as dramatic a problem as I'm making it sound though.
Pellet stoves are a good example of an appliance designed to burn wood this dry--pellets usually well under 10% MC, but as you know a pellet stove burns a small amount of fuel with a good quantity of combustion air being fed at all times. Filling up a non-catalytic woodstove with wood at 0% MC, by comparison, would probably result in secondaries so out of hand the stove will go nuclear and overfire easily. Pallet wood, i.e. from demolishing old shipping pallets (especially softwood ones), would be a good example of this.
Although one point I've come to understand is that compressed sawdust products, like pellets and biobricks, tame this fast pyrolysis effect a bit (IMO, it's because there's no contiguous grain going through the piece where smoke can find its way out easily) but not completely. There are some stoves where the mfr has specifically blessed the use of compressed sawdust bricks though (Jotul's F370, that vertical euro-looking stove, I think Morso has one that's rated for them, etc)
Pellet stoves are a good example of an appliance designed to burn wood this dry--pellets usually well under 10% MC, but as you know a pellet stove burns a small amount of fuel with a good quantity of combustion air being fed at all times. Filling up a non-catalytic woodstove with wood at 0% MC, by comparison, would probably result in secondaries so out of hand the stove will go nuclear and overfire easily. Pallet wood, i.e. from demolishing old shipping pallets (especially softwood ones), would be a good example of this.
Although one point I've come to understand is that compressed sawdust products, like pellets and biobricks, tame this fast pyrolysis effect a bit (IMO, it's because there's no contiguous grain going through the piece where smoke can find its way out easily) but not completely. There are some stoves where the mfr has specifically blessed the use of compressed sawdust bricks though (Jotul's F370, that vertical euro-looking stove, I think Morso has one that's rated for them, etc)
Well, glad to know a fellow Dead Head thinks I'm not abnormal....err....I guess. Got on the bus in '74 ;-)
Tough question, and mabe above my pay grade. I'm more of a "push it to the point of failure" type of guy. I can tell you what tree works in my stove, and possibly somebody could extrapolate that to help themselves.
But, with that caveat, I will take a stab at it.
Your wood of course has to reach a point of ignition before it will give off any heat at all. The more water, the highter the ignition temp needs to be. I'll assume that the ignition source is good and hot (like a thick bed of coals) and ignition is not an issue, but there is of course wood too wet to light by any reasonable method. My understanding then is that once it does start to combust, the moisture content is only going to limit how fast the fuel gives off the energy locked inside. Two different splits, exactly alike but for the comparative moisture content of each, hold the same amount of heat energy. The only difference being the rate at which it gives it off. But (and here's where it gets a little complicated) a wet burn is an inefficient burn, and by that I mean a more incomplete burn with fuel literally going up in smoke....too much smoke for even an efficient EPA stove to capture and re-burn. So, really, as long as you can get it hot enought to light, any wood has heating value.
Me-my-own-personal-self, I've never seen the point in not burning the most energy dense, hottest fuel you can. (Nobody ever says: "Find me some punky pine because I want to have a long burning, smokey fire...")The point being to get as warm as possible, in the shortest amount of time possible, while not over firing your stove. Even when you do want a longer burn, use your air control to do that and you'll burn much efficiently and cleaner than relying on the moisture to be your "governor." Does this make sense?
Tough question, and mabe above my pay grade. I'm more of a "push it to the point of failure" type of guy. I can tell you what tree works in my stove, and possibly somebody could extrapolate that to help themselves.
But, with that caveat, I will take a stab at it.
Your wood of course has to reach a point of ignition before it will give off any heat at all. The more water, the highter the ignition temp needs to be. I'll assume that the ignition source is good and hot (like a thick bed of coals) and ignition is not an issue, but there is of course wood too wet to light by any reasonable method. My understanding then is that once it does start to combust, the moisture content is only going to limit how fast the fuel gives off the energy locked inside. Two different splits, exactly alike but for the comparative moisture content of each, hold the same amount of heat energy. The only difference being the rate at which it gives it off. But (and here's where it gets a little complicated) a wet burn is an inefficient burn, and by that I mean a more incomplete burn with fuel literally going up in smoke....too much smoke for even an efficient EPA stove to capture and re-burn. So, really, as long as you can get it hot enought to light, any wood has heating value.
Me-my-own-personal-self, I've never seen the point in not burning the most energy dense, hottest fuel you can. (Nobody ever says: "Find me some punky pine because I want to have a long burning, smokey fire...")The point being to get as warm as possible, in the shortest amount of time possible, while not over firing your stove. Even when you do want a longer burn, use your air control to do that and you'll burn much efficiently and cleaner than relying on the moisture to be your "governor." Does this make sense?
Just FYI--From my experience and information gathered from owning a house in Colorado, you cannot have "wood" at 0% moisture. It shrinks and starts to go to dust at around 5%. How I know this is that the folks in Woodmoor, who had wood exterior houses had to oil their exposed surfaces about every 3, maybe 5 years to keep 'em from going to powder. Darndest thing I evey saw. Our next door neighbors had pine shiplap siding and it shrank up so much in only 3 years that you could feel cold air moving through the walls when the wind got up a little. Their outside wall boards would actually warp and pop loose! The guys who did the house oiling told me that they have moisture probes that they check houses with and that at 10%, start saving your money, at 7% you should have 75% of it and at 5% you're at critical. Go below that and your wood wouldn't recover. I watched painted window sills on the next door house, dry, splinter and fall off, collecting in a pile under the window. I thought they had termites, but they didn't. SO, we built a stucco house with metal clad windows. No exterior wood at all.
Why, just think of all that KINDLING!
Seriously, I'd never heard of such, but in my necka, you never could get it that dry. Ambient humidity is always pretty high. I have camped in deserts and found wood close to that dry, now that I think about it. Has the consitency of old styrofoam, and yeah, burns like it was soaked in gasoline. I chalked it up more to sun bleaching and UV degradation, but could just be the dry.
Seriously, I'd never heard of such, but in my necka, you never could get it that dry. Ambient humidity is always pretty high. I have camped in deserts and found wood close to that dry, now that I think about it. Has the consitency of old styrofoam, and yeah, burns like it was soaked in gasoline. I chalked it up more to sun bleaching and UV degradation, but could just be the dry.
Spirills-----great information. I've always felt that too dry can tilt you over to the other side of an inefficient burn, as most of us have always heard, but I've never known why, exactly. The part that is deceptive, I think, is that a super hot burn releases gases so light and volatile that you don't perceive them to be waste. OTOH, water vapor and/or incomplete combustion is readily noticeable.
O.K., I now have no choice but to re-split some splits and take a fresh inside moisture reading. What I call 10% m.c., on an outside reading, are not that through-and-through, obviously. This of course begs the question if you can EVER get a true moisture reading except by grounding it up to sawdust. I mean, if it is 10% on the outside surface, and 20% inside, is it then a true 15%? 20%? Points out the confusion that can result in just trying to describe what kind of fuel you're working with, and what results you are getting. Makes me realize that I'll always need to ask, "Outside m.c., or inside?"
(CT burner turning off "email alert" button now....)
O.K., I now have no choice but to re-split some splits and take a fresh inside moisture reading. What I call 10% m.c., on an outside reading, are not that through-and-through, obviously. This of course begs the question if you can EVER get a true moisture reading except by grounding it up to sawdust. I mean, if it is 10% on the outside surface, and 20% inside, is it then a true 15%? 20%? Points out the confusion that can result in just trying to describe what kind of fuel you're working with, and what results you are getting. Makes me realize that I'll always need to ask, "Outside m.c., or inside?"
(CT burner turning off "email alert" button now....)
ploughboy said:
Yikes.. you're definately abnormal. '74 was a rocking year. Here she is from Cow Palace in '74:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zs68ZhW84xk
Poor CT burner
MarkC
New Member
I am very new to this forum but my work is in materials testing and I believe I can add some insight into the moisture debate. If that is not taking away from the damper question...
For the record: I did add a damper section to my brand new Oslo install just because I've always had one. So far I have not seen a great need for it but I still tweak it about 22.5 degrees at night when I go to bed, out of habit.
Moisture readings on the surface are not really representative of the overall piece of wood being burned, only the outside 1/8th inch in some cases. If you split a piece and test the new face - that tells you what you are dealing with. I have 2 year old Ash that burns like the devil that tests 14-16% in the middle while 1 year seasoned Oak that tests at 15-18% on the surface of a 6 inch split tests 25-28% on a fresh split face.
Each species also has a different optimum MC and denser wood like Oak will take longer to reach this level. Lastly, unless you have a kiln, I doubt seriously you are burning 10% wood. It reaches an equilibrium based on moisture in the air, even if stacked indoors it would be rare to have that low an ambient humidity (moisture). I have a Timber-frame house with an exposed, rough hewn Pine frame that has been exposed to the joys of wood heat for nearly 30 years and those surface moisture's are approximately 7%...
Also it is doubtful that the moisture meters that most of us have are totally accurate. They should be considered a tool to monitor the wood as we use, cure and compare similar materials. Actual moisture's of the items I just described could easily vary from true moisture by several percentage points and again if you are not testing the fresh split face of any piece bigger than 3 inches you are only testing a thin surface that is likely not representative.
My 2 cents,
Mark
For the record: I did add a damper section to my brand new Oslo install just because I've always had one. So far I have not seen a great need for it but I still tweak it about 22.5 degrees at night when I go to bed, out of habit.
Moisture readings on the surface are not really representative of the overall piece of wood being burned, only the outside 1/8th inch in some cases. If you split a piece and test the new face - that tells you what you are dealing with. I have 2 year old Ash that burns like the devil that tests 14-16% in the middle while 1 year seasoned Oak that tests at 15-18% on the surface of a 6 inch split tests 25-28% on a fresh split face.
Each species also has a different optimum MC and denser wood like Oak will take longer to reach this level. Lastly, unless you have a kiln, I doubt seriously you are burning 10% wood. It reaches an equilibrium based on moisture in the air, even if stacked indoors it would be rare to have that low an ambient humidity (moisture). I have a Timber-frame house with an exposed, rough hewn Pine frame that has been exposed to the joys of wood heat for nearly 30 years and those surface moisture's are approximately 7%...
Also it is doubtful that the moisture meters that most of us have are totally accurate. They should be considered a tool to monitor the wood as we use, cure and compare similar materials. Actual moisture's of the items I just described could easily vary from true moisture by several percentage points and again if you are not testing the fresh split face of any piece bigger than 3 inches you are only testing a thin surface that is likely not representative.
My 2 cents,
Mark
Thanks for the info Mark. I knew there was an optimum %, just wasnt sure what it was for each species of wood. Welcome to the forums by the way.
Thanks all. Although I'm not a Gerry fan, I do appreciate reading up on people's thoughts/experiences with MC in their wood.
We have so much wood here from the massive storm in late October (we ourselves were without power for 8 days...and that little resolute kept us toasty warm the entire time.) any wood I buy for next year I will have to watch closely for mc. People are selling green hardwood right now for about $150 chord. Or if you want, people are still giving away cords of hardwood logs for free!
Install of the Oslo takes place on Monday.
Will report back then.
Thx again, have a good weekend all.
Doug
We have so much wood here from the massive storm in late October (we ourselves were without power for 8 days...and that little resolute kept us toasty warm the entire time.) any wood I buy for next year I will have to watch closely for mc. People are selling green hardwood right now for about $150 chord. Or if you want, people are still giving away cords of hardwood logs for free!
Install of the Oslo takes place on Monday.
Will report back then.
Thx again, have a good weekend all.
Doug
Random thoughts . . .
Welcome to the forum.
Welcome to the Order of the Oslo Oddfellows . . . this truly is a great stove. Sometimes I find my eye wandering to some of those sexy soapstove stoves, but I always come back to my always faithful (and quite hot) Oslo.
Definitely take pics of the final install . . . we're very visually oriented here . . . some of us more than others.
Damper in the stove pipe . . . normally I would say this is not needed . . . but I suspect that with a long run inside the home you may find it worthwhile to have . . . as for run-away fires or over-fires . . . the only time I have had an issue is when I stupidly loaded a bunch of wood on to the fire before it was in the late coaling stage . . . burning in cycles is important.
Chord = musical term. Cord = unit of measurement for firewood. There will be a surprise quiz on these two different terms in the near future. Study well.
Welcome to the forum.
Welcome to the Order of the Oslo Oddfellows . . . this truly is a great stove. Sometimes I find my eye wandering to some of those sexy soapstove stoves, but I always come back to my always faithful (and quite hot) Oslo.
Definitely take pics of the final install . . . we're very visually oriented here . . . some of us more than others.
Damper in the stove pipe . . . normally I would say this is not needed . . . but I suspect that with a long run inside the home you may find it worthwhile to have . . . as for run-away fires or over-fires . . . the only time I have had an issue is when I stupidly loaded a bunch of wood on to the fire before it was in the late coaling stage . . . burning in cycles is important.
Chord = musical term. Cord = unit of measurement for firewood. There will be a surprise quiz on these two different terms in the near future. Study well.
CT,
Welcome aboard. I'm on my third season with the Olso and am happy for the most part with it. This forum community has been especially helpful in providing a wealth of information, experience, and fellowship. It really helps to have a community with this much knowledge and experience.
On the question of the butterfly damper, I have a 25' 6" insulated flue liner with a Tee at the bottom. Once the draft is "going the right direction," it draws more than enough. I have not had a damper, but you have me thinking. So with 10 extra feet, I would say it is probably worth the little extra that costs to add that additional control. You may not use it, but there was a few times where the draw was pulling, and the stove was north of 600, that I would have used it. For overnight burns, you certainly want good secondaries, but you can do this with 400 -450 F stove top temp. If you are getting 600 F or higher, you will shorten your burn time.
On the moisture content, I spent my first year struggling with oak that was 25% MC. You can burn it, but it is a pain. The first hour is spent "seasoning" the wood with the side door open. Not very efficient and a pain. So I followed the advice of those helping me and got enough wood to get a season or two ahead. As I am burning oak, I still have 17 -20% MC (as measured in the center of a fresh re-split). Sometimes I'll have a split that steams a little. But for the most part, it starts up and gets to cruising temp pretty quickly, usually ~ 30 mins. On reloads with a bed of coals even faster. Not sure what the problem is with the poster who said that they have problems with not enough air, but on a reload with coals, I can't keep my side door open for more than a few minutes or else I will have a raging inferno going.
As FFJake said, we like pics!r
Welcome aboard. I'm on my third season with the Olso and am happy for the most part with it. This forum community has been especially helpful in providing a wealth of information, experience, and fellowship. It really helps to have a community with this much knowledge and experience.
On the question of the butterfly damper, I have a 25' 6" insulated flue liner with a Tee at the bottom. Once the draft is "going the right direction," it draws more than enough. I have not had a damper, but you have me thinking. So with 10 extra feet, I would say it is probably worth the little extra that costs to add that additional control. You may not use it, but there was a few times where the draw was pulling, and the stove was north of 600, that I would have used it. For overnight burns, you certainly want good secondaries, but you can do this with 400 -450 F stove top temp. If you are getting 600 F or higher, you will shorten your burn time.
On the moisture content, I spent my first year struggling with oak that was 25% MC. You can burn it, but it is a pain. The first hour is spent "seasoning" the wood with the side door open. Not very efficient and a pain. So I followed the advice of those helping me and got enough wood to get a season or two ahead. As I am burning oak, I still have 17 -20% MC (as measured in the center of a fresh re-split). Sometimes I'll have a split that steams a little. But for the most part, it starts up and gets to cruising temp pretty quickly, usually ~ 30 mins. On reloads with a bed of coals even faster. Not sure what the problem is with the poster who said that they have problems with not enough air, but on a reload with coals, I can't keep my side door open for more than a few minutes or else I will have a raging inferno going.
As FFJake said, we like pics!r
Thanks gents. Ill post what the installer suggests re: BFM.
On a side note, and suggestions for calibrating my magnet stove thermometer? Stick in the oven at 400F and then adjust the needle accordingly?
Also, are the MC meters worth their price?
Thank all!
Doug
On a side note, and suggestions for calibrating my magnet stove thermometer? Stick in the oven at 400F and then adjust the needle accordingly?
Also, are the MC meters worth their price?
Thank all!
Doug
I was wondering the same thing about haveing a pipe damper installed on my oslo and have recieived different answers from different sources. I have a double wall insullated pipe about 3 feet off the back of stove and and elbow out to about 25 feel of class A pipe. I am looking for advice on this as well.
However, my issue is i cant get my stove temps above 450 and once it hits 450- 500 it comes back to 350 fast...
any thoughts???
However, my issue is i cant get my stove temps above 450 and once it hits 450- 500 it comes back to 350 fast...
any thoughts???
new-burner said:
Is the Class A inside or outside of the house?
In either case you should be able to get the temp easily to 400-600 and beyond . . . providing the wood is well seasoned, the stove is run correctly and the draft is good.
More info would be useful . . . when was the wood cut, split and stacked or have you tested its moisture? . . . how do you run the stove (assuming you know to bring the stove up to temp, let it sit there for a while and then slowly start to cut back on the air control.)
Oh yeah . . . almost forgot . . . welcome to hearth.com.
ahhhh... the wood what a challenge this has been. I have been burning red oak that was dropped in my yard in October - we were told it was down and split for about a year. I think is a fair estimate because i live down the street from the wood guy and his piles have been there, and he has a good reputation. However is this well seasoned wood with only a year, I am not sure. I just had one more cord delieved of oak that has been split for 15 months. The wood guy came in to look at my set up and questioned why this stove does not have a damper and thought perhaps all my heat was going up and out the chimmney. I did more research and spoke to the dealer where i bought the stove and a chimmney installer both told me this stove does not require a damper - it is desiged to work wothout one. I have not tested moisture content yet but i will be doing that once i purchase a monitor.
I have been burning daily since the weather in NE changed, but this has been a warm winter so far. It just seems like my stove likes to stay around 350 - which is not giving enough heat for my house. The house is about 2200 sq feet 2 floor colonial with a fairly open floor plan. The thermostat in the room with the stove stays between 71- 74 degrees. I door an occasion get to 500 but i cant maintain that temp. In order for me to get that temp i fill the box slide the air flow to open and open the side door a bit to get more air into the box.
I see other posts of folks not being able to get the temp down, I cant get it hot enough... The class A chimney is out side and shoots straight up with a good 3-4 foot clearance above the roof.
thoughts?
thanks for the welcome....i have been doing a lot of research on this site and it has been so helpfull
I have been burning daily since the weather in NE changed, but this has been a warm winter so far. It just seems like my stove likes to stay around 350 - which is not giving enough heat for my house. The house is about 2200 sq feet 2 floor colonial with a fairly open floor plan. The thermostat in the room with the stove stays between 71- 74 degrees. I door an occasion get to 500 but i cant maintain that temp. In order for me to get that temp i fill the box slide the air flow to open and open the side door a bit to get more air into the box.
I see other posts of folks not being able to get the temp down, I cant get it hot enough... The class A chimney is out side and shoots straight up with a good 3-4 foot clearance above the roof.
thoughts?
thanks for the welcome....i have been doing a lot of research on this site and it has been so helpfull
Oldhippie
Minister of Fire
- Dec 18, 2011
- 570
I think that is a good idea to at least have one on hand. They are easy to install if you can use a drill and don't mind taking your flue pipe apart and putting it back together.
Personally I don't see the down side, they are inexpensive and non-intrusive in the vertical position. If you have a strong draft they can help manage overfiring, which you hear so much about on here.
Personally I don't see the down side, they are inexpensive and non-intrusive in the vertical position. If you have a strong draft they can help manage overfiring, which you hear so much about on here.
Great discussion on MC readings, inside and out....
What it brings to light for me is , given the wide variety of different wood species, as well as the variations in moisture meter capabilities, it is very difficult to draw any valid observation about what m.c. is working best for me, which might be more than nominally useful for anyone else. There just is no common language to use, and without that you're proably not going to draw valid conclusions.
My Ryobi, a 9v surface conductivity meter, does a pretty good job of giving me a down and dirty check. It is not a pin meter, as I used to use when selecting hardwood for furniture, but that one gave up the ghost years ago and a replacement was not in the budget. And yeah, I realize that it only reads a relatively small amount of the total wood moisture content, near the surface. Still, it gives me fairly good prediction of how a stick will burn. My current batch of red oak was cut green in March, stacked loose with plenty of sun and wind eposure and and it consistently reads 10% +/- on the outside of the splits. So I never had a reason to open a split up and check that reading, to see how the two compare. I have done that now, on several splits. Actually, it showed not too wide a gap between the two. 10-12% outside moisture seems to translate to an average of about 15-17% inside. So what does is the actual through-and-through m.c. of these splits? Beats me. Really, I don't care because I've proven to myself that a 10% outside reading, with this meter, with this wood=burns well.
I do know that when my outside surface moisture gets north of 10%, the performance of my F400 suffers remarkably. Jotul recommends wood (for all of their stoves) to be 20% for optimum performance. None of the wood I burn is that wet I don't think. I can't account for why this is true for me. My stove set-up is fairly typical, even above average as far as conditions for good draft go. I can only say that my experience has shown that for the species I am burning, 20% is not the best for my stove. Your mileage may vary.
What it brings to light for me is , given the wide variety of different wood species, as well as the variations in moisture meter capabilities, it is very difficult to draw any valid observation about what m.c. is working best for me, which might be more than nominally useful for anyone else. There just is no common language to use, and without that you're proably not going to draw valid conclusions.
My Ryobi, a 9v surface conductivity meter, does a pretty good job of giving me a down and dirty check. It is not a pin meter, as I used to use when selecting hardwood for furniture, but that one gave up the ghost years ago and a replacement was not in the budget. And yeah, I realize that it only reads a relatively small amount of the total wood moisture content, near the surface. Still, it gives me fairly good prediction of how a stick will burn. My current batch of red oak was cut green in March, stacked loose with plenty of sun and wind eposure and and it consistently reads 10% +/- on the outside of the splits. So I never had a reason to open a split up and check that reading, to see how the two compare. I have done that now, on several splits. Actually, it showed not too wide a gap between the two. 10-12% outside moisture seems to translate to an average of about 15-17% inside. So what does is the actual through-and-through m.c. of these splits? Beats me. Really, I don't care because I've proven to myself that a 10% outside reading, with this meter, with this wood=burns well.
I do know that when my outside surface moisture gets north of 10%, the performance of my F400 suffers remarkably. Jotul recommends wood (for all of their stoves) to be 20% for optimum performance. None of the wood I burn is that wet I don't think. I can't account for why this is true for me. My stove set-up is fairly typical, even above average as far as conditions for good draft go. I can only say that my experience has shown that for the species I am burning, 20% is not the best for my stove. Your mileage may vary.
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