Wood Heat vs. single-digit temps, are you winning?

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raybonz said:
Flatbedford said:
raybonz said:
That's a big house to heat with a fireview Steve.. If I remember right Woodstock says that stove is good up to around 1500 sq. ft. I bet the PH would get the job done nicely..

Ray

Yeah yeah. The single digits are tough. 20s and 30s we are fine. I don't know if the PH could do much better. I know it makes more heat longer, but I'm not sure I could get any of that heat into the far end of the main floor. As I said above, insulation and air sealing what I really need now. Or, maybe a second small stove in the dining room.

That sounds like the best solution to me to prevent cooking yourself out of the stove room..

Ray

+1

Even though technically the Republic is WAY oversized for us (it's rated for 1200-2000 sq ft), the layout we have in addition to location (open fields and lake), older cottage with questionable insulation, leaky windows (two are definately original and we will recaulk them but I'm not replacing them even if they are single pane) and two 6' sliding doors, we still installed a backup ventfree in the dining room to help that part of the Cottage stay warm when it gets really cold. Additionally, I like knowing it's there just in case, since we don't have any other heat source (no furnace).
 
-3 to 3 above here and haven't had to run the stove over 400 yet.I do stoke her a little harder than i was though.Was running around 300 till now.Still having trouble moving the air though i'm pushing the cold and have done the tissue in doorways i still have to heat other rooms a little better.Insulation and these double paned windows suck but will work on it.Livingroom is 2 rooms away and at 72 degrees,birdroom is next to stove room and at 69 and stoveroom is 80.All air is moving the right direction but would like to move it a little harder,for now will just have to run a lil hotter.Not sure just what was put under the vinyl siding.Burning my 6"s of coals down right now.WINNING! and very happy,haen't even had to run her hard.
 
Been winning quite easily. With this as the first winter with this stove and house this has been the first time I have got to really test it out. with a little over 1400 sq ft with 10' ceilings and 3 cu ft of stove it has been easy. Been down to 4-6*F the last two nights with highs in the teens and have had no problems keeping in the 70's. Friday night I was gone for a while and set the stove real low when I left so I was down to coals and about 66* in the house when I returned. It was 8* outside and falling so I decided it was time to see what she's got. Loaded her about 3/4 with 6 - 6-8" cherry and maple splits. Let her rip and got it up to 650* stove top in about a half hour, turned the blower on high, set the air at about 15-20% and she settled right in between 650-700*. Started doing some work around the house and an hour or two later I realized I was almost starting to get light headed. Went and checked on the stove and was still crusing about 650 but the house was up to 84* and it was down to 4* outside. By my calculations the stove should have been pushing close to 60K BTU for 3-4 hours to accomplish that rise at that outside temp. I now wish I would have weighed the load of wood so I could have had more accurate measurements. The best I can guess that was 50-60 pound load. So I am very happy as we normally do get -0F temps and sometimes as low as -20F. I wanted a stove that could keep the house up to temp as needed since the electric to the house is run overhead and we are the only house on the end of the line for a quarter mile. Of course this year I have got to work on perfecting my shoulder season heating techniques for the last three months.
 
Also in Massachusetts and am losing the single-degree battle. The Fireview kept the first floor at about 62-64 degrees this past weekend but never could get it to rise beyond that. Seemed like it was pumping out just as many BTUs as were leaving the building envelope. Running fast just to stay in place so to speak.

Last night I had to open the doors to the upstairs bedrooms and turn on the oil heat in the upstairs zone for fear that the baseboard pipes would freeze. My IR thermometer said the outside corner of the furthest upstairs bedroom wall was 36F last night, which got my attention.

But I recognize that a single Fireview was never inetnded to be the sole heat for a big house (2500+sf).
 
In CT and losing...

Jotul 450 keeping the inside temp around 66 max on both floors. (generally between 66 and 64 degrees). Over night and in the morning before reload the boiler kicks in at around 3 am to keep either floor at least at 62.

I am heating an area larger than the recommended space (approx 2400 sq feet, but good layout for it). When the temp is above 35, the 450 has no problems.

Wish I had gotten a larger stove, but this was the biggest one that fit the space I had without other alterations ($$$). I am considering getting another stove down the road for the 2nd fireplace on the same floor.

The other battle with the inserts is that I need to allow time in the wee morning hours for the stove to cool so I can clean it and fill it before work...
 
I have mentioned in other posts that I am in the middle of making a family room down stairs in the basement which is also my garage at the other end.
I have not got the divider wall up or a ceiling. I tore down all the old aluminum foil looking floor joist coverings that was used as an insulating barrier. House was built in the late 60's.
What I noticed was taking that barrier down the heat comes up thru the floors as upstairs is all wood floors. Feels like I got cable heating in the floors.
Maybe I will delay getting that ceiling put up in the basement.

What I do have completed down stairs are the priority things:
New Wood Stove
New 50" TV
NewCarpet flooring
Recliner
Couch
Futon
New Ping Pong Table
Fire wood Box.
Small Fridge with the beer
Of Course the kids have the play station 3

Did I miss anything?
 
Glad to hear I'm not the only one with this struggle :gulp:


Huntindog1 said:
If your struggling to keep the house warm in single digits remember your house has thermal mass. You have to time this right but in the evening load up a load of small 2-3" splits to burn hot. Let the house get a little warm for a while it will store some of that heat. Then load up for the night. That gives your stove a head start for keeping your house temps up.

Great point. I was calling it "momentum" in my head - several hot fire cycles seemed to help me catch up and stay ahead. One slip where the restart takes too long and you can then only maintain ~5deg less than what you were before. My slip happened right before bed, so I didn't dump as much heat into my thermal mass as I would have liked, but with a 2:30am reload I was still at 72 when I got to it again at 6:30.

So basically, I can keep up if I try real hard and don't make any mistakes. Insulation refinements and a block off plate should help that.


AndrewInCT said:
The other battle with the inserts is that I need to allow time in the wee morning hours for the stove to cool so I can clean it and fill it before work...

That is kind of surprising that you have to clean it out every day. I clean mine Saturday afternoons once too much ash and nails (I burn pallets some) build up on the bottom and start limiting the amount of wood I can shove in. On these hot restarts I have been doing during the single digit fight, I have found that under my bed of hot coals is a bed of unburnt, cold (not red) coals that all need to be stirred up and burned down before I can effectively reload. That one is new by me, the bottom of the stove looked as full Sunday night as it did Friday night even though I cleaned it Saturday! But luckily everything in there is burnable and I just have to stir it up some to finish burning it to ash.
 
FGZ said:
That is kind of surprising that you have to clean it out every day. I clean mine Saturday afternoons once too much ash and nails (I burn pallets some) build up on the bottom and start limiting the amount of wood I can shove in. On these hot restarts I have been doing during the single digit fight, I have found that under my bed of hot coals is a bed of unburnt, cold (not red) coals that all need to be stirred up and burned down before I can effectively reload. That one is new by me, the bottom of the stove looked as full Sunday night as it did Friday night even though I cleaned it Saturday! But luckily everything in there is burnable and I just have to stir it up some to finish burning it to ash.

Well, I neglected to mention that I am mainly burning bio bricks this year, which could be contributing. I've found that I need to clean more often with these than when I burn splits (maybe I need to handle them different than cord wood - or at least moreso than I am doing now.).. On a given cold day like we have today, I'd burn 40-50 bio bricks (about 2-3 packages).
 
That's weird, I find less ash from burning ecobricks, which I thought were basically the same except bigger (I think they are about 3lb per brick).
 
No ! losing miserable. Underpowered stove for house.
 
Well, I think we are winning. The 3rd floor, our bedroom, drops to about 59-62 with this cold snap. But we only sleep up there, so really perfect sleeping temps. Yesterday we sealed nearly all the windows, and put pink insulation around the floor boards, all of which really helped. This house has NO insulation between the stucco and plaster walls. The plaster has a nice warm heating effect so I don't want to rip the walls open and replace with sheetrock. Plaster just gives off a lovely warmth it retains. The main floor is warm. Last night we fed the stove at 5:00am and had an easy morning. I am refusing to put on the burner and give money to the local gas utility company. And will make sure the next bill reflects that it wasn't being used because I don't trust them! (ORU). There meter readings are really screwy. I can't figure that one out.
 
eclecticcottage said:
That's weird, I find less ash from burning ecobricks, which I thought were basically the same except bigger (I think they are about 3lb per brick).

ditto very little ash from the few I have burned.. I would not burn just Ecobricks as they could overfire a stove easily..

Ray
 
It doesn't seem to get as cold as it used to in Pgh. As a kid in the 60s I remember many subzero winters. Now we get an occasional teens or a single digit but we don't seem to be able to crack zero much lately.

Thanks for the help Mr Gore, but I actually enjoy watching my stoves defy sub zero temps :=)
 
We had 9 degrees last night and the house never went below 69........put three medium locust splits on a bed of coals at 11:00pm and took the 69 degree reading at 6:25am before I left for work. House is around 2800 sq. ft. and it's MEGA-insulated from my recent remodel, that made a world of difference.
 
I think that my stove not being able to keep up with single digit temps is about the same as my central A/C not being able to keep up with triple digit temps. These are rare conditions for where I live. My setup is pretty good with the usual temps and needs some help with the extremes. A stove that could keep my house comfy in single digits would roast us out most of the heating season. I have a furnace and I am not afraid to use it from time to time if need be. I do like to not use it, but I will if I have to.
 
One good thing about these cold snaps is, it's really easy to locate infiltration points, just move your hand around and feel for cold air. I spent my sunday in the basement insulating and sealing up drafts, every little bit helps!

Regarding the battle of the delta T? I'm winning but if I had to be away for more than 5 hours or so the oil man would be winning, it was cold up here the last few nights. Truth be told, we use the furnace when it gets cold like this.........it's just so nice to have hot floors (radiant in floor heat) when it's so cold out. My Equinox can keep us warm in our living space but does little for the basement so being able to suppliment with some oil heat is a nice thing and I don't mind spending the money. I just dropped below 3/4's full on my one tank (275 gallon) of oil for the year. I'd dare say the heating season is half over so we are doing just fine. I'm running a little better than expected on wood use, I'm less than half way thru my January wood row, it was 19 feet long and 5 feet high and it is mostly oak!

Keep warm out there!
 
No problem here,there's nothing that mother nature can hit us with here that me and the King cannot handle,house never goes below 72 and I'm not running him hard,haven't even brought out the real serious wood yet. Been burning mostly white oak some cherry a little ash. When it really gets cold got a chit load of BL,Hickory,and Hedge he will be fed,coldest here this year -3 wind chill.
 
raybonz said:
eclecticcottage said:
That's weird, I find less ash from burning ecobricks, which I thought were basically the same except bigger (I think they are about 3lb per brick).

ditto very little ash from the few I have burned.. I would not burn just Ecobricks as they could overfire a stove easily..

Ray

We have, but we usually throw in two splits, one on each side n/s. You definately need to use them when you're home for a few times to get to know how your stove will react. I usually use between 2-5 depending on the weather and burn time we need, and they usually max the stove top temp out at 750, although it tried to creep past that last night on a hot reload with three (I just popped on the blower). You really need to learn where the air control needs to be-they do burn hot.
 
We kept up fairly well for not having oh so great wood this year. Was in the mid single digits last night and our furnace never came on but was about 62 upstairs. Lil chilly but my oil tank gauge didnt move so im happy :)
 
We normally have milder winters than you might expect, but punctuated with a few intense cold snaps, with temps -5 to -15 f. It was hard to stay comfortable with just wood, but we could manage with lots of reloads.

Then we got additional attic insulation, up to... I'm not sure... R55? It's deep. We also got new, very tight windows.

Before= about 4.33 to 4.5 cords per winter

Now= about 3 to 3.33 cords per winter, and the overnight burn is sufficient during cold snaps. (Don't have to reload in the middle of the night, even at -10. Upstairs bedroom at 60, downstairs at 64 in the morning -- but that's ok, it warms up fast.) I'm convinced that most improvement came from the attic insulation.

regards,
 
Oh yeah, I'm winning. Not Charlie Sheen winning, but actually winning.

That is the beauty of an oversized stove. It's hell (or, at least it feels like it) in mild weather though. Hard to get just a little bit of heat.

-SF
 
With both stoves going we beat this short cold snap. Temps are forecast to rise through the night to the mid 40's tomorrow. Main living area (Kit, LR, DR & Study) stayed in the low 70's. The coal stove kept downstairs in the mid to upper 70's and the bedrooms stayed in the upper 60's.

We have a "cat gauge" to let us know how well we are doing. If they are on the rug opposite the wood stove all is perfect. If they are on the wood floor right near the hearth the stove is cooling down. When they are on the hearth there is probably not enough coals to re-start the stove. If they jump into the bed looking for a warm place to sleep then the weather has won this round...

KaptJaq
 
FGZ said:
Tonight is our second night of ~9deg F here in NE MA. We've only had one other night of single digit temps and I had a similar experience: I can't keep the house up to temp like I can above 20. So I'm at about "single digit temps - 3, Jotul C450 - 0"

This year is much better than last, with several insulation improvements including rim joists in the basement and insulating the attic fold-down stairs. My energy audit told me about those. I have some further refinements in the insulation dept but these were the biggest. Also I have a lot better store of wood, dryer and more of it. These have all added up to very little oil used since our tank was filled in Oct, and the mild winter has helped a lot too. Single digits have me beat though.

Today I have burned hot and heavy trying to catch back up, and finally got the bedroom temps to go from 62 to 64. Reloading quicker than usual and keeping the fan on high have helped. Here are some future updates that are sure to help: need a block of plate, OAK might keep the outside air out better, and plug more small insulation holes.

I've been wrestling with whether or not I have a big enough insert (Jotul C450), and am fairly convinced I'm big enough once I incorporate the rest of my projects. My house is only about 1200 sq ft and not the greatest layout for wood heat. But I can hit 80* if it's over 20* out, and not drop below 65 during the overnight burn, so a bigger stove would just be too hot and eat more wood. The longer overnight burn would be nice, but I'm steadily getting the trick of extending my overnights.

How well are you fairing? What tricks have helped you overcome those handful of REALLY cold nights, when otherwise your stove keeps up just fine?

That is strange that you can't heat a 1200 sq ft house better than you are even if you get below zero. So far this year we've not had any below zero but have seen zero. I do not have an indoor temperature gauge but we have checked and we keep the house above 80 degrees. On the coldest night this year I did fill the stove (only filled it a few times so far this winter) and the house stayed nice and warm all night. Stove down to coals in the morning but it quickly started back up when we added wood. If memory serves me (sometimes it doesn't) that was an 11 hour burn and I am certain the house never got below 80 degrees except perhaps the far bedroom but we prefer it a bit cooler there.
 
That a boy Dennis,keep her warm but maybe just a tad cooler. %-P
 
Hey Bub, I do have a physical problem that requires some extra heat. The wife suffers a bit and seems to run a fan a lot but the best part is it forces the females to remove more clothing. Nope. We'll keep it warm. lol
 
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