Was this install done properly??

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,Hi momof2, as a dad of 5, I sure am glad you got your $ back and never burned in that set up!

A proper class A chimney would be easy to install so you can just go up and through the roof and have a much better set up. I would also try to make sure that the new flue meets the height requirement of your specific stove. It is an easy mistake to make the chimney too short. As far as the old chimney, you just don't know if it is useless. The beam under it may very well support it just fine. It all depends on how it is built. A tear down may not b e necessary. Although lining that chimney would have been the best way to use it for a wood stove, there are some stove manuals that allow you to go up to the clay liner with a vent pipe and not all the way up. Clay liners have been used in chimneys for a long time and are indeed a safe way to vent a fire. That said, the other set up was a joke. Even if the chimney is safe it probably would have been too short and wide(8x12) to draw properly and make up for all the single wall turning pipes.
From the sounds of it the flue was not inspected properly. However, there is no way for any of us to tell from your pictures that the chimney is not usable. Unless someone knows of a specific code violation it is speculation. I may come under fire here, in no way am I saying it would be better or safer to use the old chimney with the set up that was installed. There just may not be a need to tear down the old chimney. You should just make sure that the effort is put into making a safe hearth and class A chimney with all the clearance to combustible concerns addressed.

There are lots of knowledgeable people here who will help you through the process. If you get another pro to do the job have him draw up the proposed chimney and post it here before you agree to anything. There is no reason why they can't give you a plan that you will approve, just like any other construction project in your house!
Good luck!
 
"High efficency stoves are made to run much hotter on the flue than older box stoves and they do. For example my Harman runs at 800 normally which is common with epa stoves however my old smoke dragon would stop at 550 usually unless I over fired. 1) The liner protects the house from heat transfer to combustibles. In the NBS tests, unlined chimneys allowed heat to move through the chimney so rapidly that the adjacent woodwork caught fire in only 3 1/2 hours. This is a reason that liners are made of stainless steel it can handle extreme heat and not crack or melt under the heat which is also why most cities require a liner through a clay chimney."
Pete 1983, I really dont disagree with you for the most part but a clay lined chimney is class A pipe with the correct rating for wood burner use, I had a clay lined chimney for over 30 years and it ran through the middle of the house and it never got hot on the outside even with the stove pipe at 700 or so. Not sure what kind of test they were doing, one of the problems with clay liners is heat trasfer and the tiles cracking but if in good shape they can take the high flue temps. Not everyone is reporting high flue temps with these new stoves but I am and I guess you are also. My old stove had much cooler flue temps.
 
Pete1983 said:
High efficency stoves are made to run much hotter on the flue than older box stoves and they do.
What!?
I could not disagree more, in fact I could quote a stove designer who is also a member, stating exactly the opposite!
 
Glad to see that it will be done right!

200 years ago, when that room was built as the kitchen, the brick chimney probably went straight down to a wood or coal cook stove in the center of the room. The cook stoves did not burn too hot so the limited clearance to combustibles was not that much of an issue. Back then, if you were not rich enough to have a summer and a winter kitchen, the main kitchen usually stuck out from the back of the house. That way in the summer you could open windows on three sides and not bake the whole house every time you cooked. In the winter you opened the doors to the house and closed the windows to save some heat. My parents house, built in the 1830's, was very similar. Wood beams passed through notches in the stone chimney. Sometime you find very surprising things in pre-building code houses and wonder how they survived...

Good luck with the new install, post some pictures.

KaptJaq
 
firefighterjake said:
Also, FYI . . . I find myself not trusting the Better Business Bureau and their ratings much these days. One company I have had professional dealings with in the past is very highly rated . . . even though they sell over-priced products and use scare tactics to sell their stuff.

Rant= On

Not to get too far off track but it is my opinion that the BBB is garbage. It is far to easy to have an A+ rating. My father owns an auto repair business and has an A+ rating. He has been in business for 25 and is one of the few that deserves it but there have been no reviews, no comments, no complaints with the BBB and he has an A+. You have to have tons of complaints to drop below an A.

Also, to be an "Accredited Member" you have to pay the BBB a "fee" for the service. Long story short it is not in the BBB's best interest to make companies look bad. They make it easy to look good.

Its kind of like ISO certification for many commercial businesses. Its a country club. We pay ISO a fee to certify us to a certain standard. Its not in thier best interests to make it hard to be certified. The company I work for is run by a bunch of monkeys and we should absolutely not be ISO certified. The day before the ISO guy comes in we run around like mad to get things in order. After he passes us we go back to operating like monkeys for another year.

Glad I got that off my chest :)

Rant=Off
 
momof2nutlings said:
WoodpileOCD said:
By the way momof2, what are nutlings?

The children. :) The nut doesn't fall far from... the bigger nuts. LOL


Attached a few quick pics - I think. If any more are needed I can snap them.

I'm guessing here but that is probably a good sized wood trimmed steel beam supporting a masonry chimney. Now I'm not a structural engineer but, beams can support all kinds of loads including point loads. Just say'n.
 
oldspark said:
Pete 1983, I really dont disagree with you for the most part but a clay lined chimney is class A pipe with the correct rating for wood burner use, I had a clay lined chimney for over 30 years and it ran through the middle of the house and it never got hot on the outside even with the stove pipe at 700 or so. Not sure what kind of test they were doing, one of the problems with clay liners is heat trasfer and the tiles cracking but if in good shape they can take the high flue temps. Not everyone is reporting high flue temps with these new stoves but I am and I guess you are also. My old stove had much cooler flue temps.

Hes' quoting from the CSIA.org website, http://www.csia.org/HomeownerResources/ChimneySafetyInfo/AboutChimneyLiners/tabid/117/Default.aspx
the only problem is a couple paragraphs down they list clay tile as a chimney liner "1) Clay tiles are the most common type of masonry chimney liners. They are inexpensive, readily available, and perform quite well for open fireplace chimneys that are properly maintained. There are two disadvantages to clay tiles. The first is that, being a ceramic product, they cannot rapidly absorb and evenly distribute heat during the rapid temperature rise that occurs during a chimney fire. This uneven heating produces an unequal expansion which in turn causes the flue tiles to crack and split apart. This is similar to immersing a cold drinking glass in very hot water. It will instantly shatter. A chimney with cracked chimney liners must be repaired before use. The second disadvantage is that tiles cannot adequately contain the liquid combustion byproducts produced by modern gas appliances."
 
Osburning said:
oldspark said:
Pete 1983, I really dont disagree with you for the most part but a clay lined chimney is class A pipe with the correct rating for wood burner use, I had a clay lined chimney for over 30 years and it ran through the middle of the house and it never got hot on the outside even with the stove pipe at 700 or so. Not sure what kind of test they were doing, one of the problems with clay liners is heat trasfer and the tiles cracking but if in good shape they can take the high flue temps. Not everyone is reporting high flue temps with these new stoves but I am and I guess you are also. My old stove had much cooler flue temps.

Hes' quoting from the CSIA.org website, http://www.csia.org/HomeownerResources/ChimneySafetyInfo/AboutChimneyLiners/tabid/117/Default.aspx
the only problem is a couple paragraphs down they list clay tile as a chimney liner "1) Clay tiles are the most common type of masonry chimney liners. They are inexpensive, readily available, and perform quite well for open fireplace chimneys that are properly maintained. There are two disadvantages to clay tiles. The first is that, being a ceramic product, they cannot rapidly absorb and evenly distribute heat during the rapid temperature rise that occurs during a chimney fire. This uneven heating produces an unequal expansion which in turn causes the flue tiles to crack and split apart. This is similar to immersing a cold drinking glass in very hot water. It will instantly shatter. A chimney with cracked chimney liners must be repaired before use. The second disadvantage is that tiles cannot adequately contain the liquid combustion byproducts produced by modern gas appliances."
That's what I said and we are talking about wood burners here not modern gas appliances. :lol:
 
regarding your question as to why a straight up/through house chimney is best: it draws better. Every turn inpeeds flow of hot air wanting to get out!

Heat wants to rise so straight will provide the best for your stove. Running it through the house is best as well. Not everyone can or wants to have a through house chimney for a ton of good reasons but having the air around the chimney warmer than the outside air will improve the eficiancy of the stove and chimney - especially with cold starts.

Another benefit is the pipe has heat so it is continuing to heat your home as it travels to it's final destination above the roof.

It is also easier to clean and keep clean for many reasons. All things being equal it will build less creasote due to eficiancy, continued heat thoughout and less turns/bends for crasote to build up. Cleaning is easier due to the straight shot. I just pull my telescoping stove pipe down and run a brush up from the inside. Turns can make this tougher. If you go out and up there will be a cleanout on the outside so it is a straight shot from there but cleaning the stove pipe and horizontal can be tricky. There are tools to make it easier but not as easy as a straight shot.

Negatives: Takes up living space, holes cut in the floor if you have muliple levels to go through, adds a hole to your roof for possible future roof issues.

For me the + outways the - but opinions vary. although I do not think many will argue, all things being equal, straight up will provide the best possible performance of your wood heating appliance.
 
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