My Woodstock Progress method for a slow burn

ciccio · Dec 20, 2011

The last two days have not been to cold here in new jersey so I tried something a little different with the progress. After I established a small coal bed from a cold start I loaded about four to five splits in the stove with the damper about 60% closed, after the wood begins to char up a bit and my stove top temp is over 250 or my flue is 300 I engaged the cat and wait about 5 minutes or so then I close the damper all the way and open it up just about a quarter inch or so. What I have found out is with the stove not that hot,when I close the damper down you see the flames just lift off the logs and the secondaries just kick in for a short time,then the stove will sometimes go just black with that occasionally flame going up and you see that nice light show from the gases burning, then eventually you start to see the flames coming off the bottom of the wood and going up the fire box with out those secondaries really kicking in, that lasts for for a good amount of time before you just see the stove just settle down with that red glow from the bottom of the wood and then begins the long slow burn. My temperature during this peak time reached about 475 with about four to five splits and just cruzed at about 400 to 425 for a long time before I went to bed. What I came to conclude is I think you canâ€™t get that fire box cranking with that damper open for a long time before you engage that cat because if you do the secondaries will go like crazy for a long time ( about 3 plus hours) and the stove will throw out a ton of heat from the glass and will roast people out with a small to medium house, with the way I just explained the stove did get to about 475 but i did not feel that strong heat from the glass like you do when the secondaries are going strong. So yes I think you can get that uniform steady heat from this stove, I will try this method and report back if you all like, I donâ€™t need much heat right now with temperature in the forties and tomorrow in the fifties..
Iâ€™m liking this stove more and more every day !!!

Sorry if I went on to long Iâ€™m just trying to explain myself the best I can, hope this will help other folks with the Progress.

ciccio

Waulie · Dec 20, 2011

Thanks for the info! I will be giving this a try in a couple days. What kind of burn time did you get with the 4/5 splits?

ciccio · Dec 20, 2011

Waulie said:
Thanks for the info! I will be giving this a try in a couple days. What kind of burn time did you get with the 4/5 splits?

Well with the splits I put in around 10PM last night I got up around 6AM and I had a good amount coals with a partial piece of wood left in the back of the stove, I did not reload before work because they were calling for temperatures in the upper forties when I did get home at 3PM I did have 2 or 3 small coals still burning in after raking the fire box.

Todd · Dec 20, 2011

Interesting info. That's kind a what I was thinking after hearing some early failed attempts for a longer low output burn. Once that non cat mode kicks in it's hard to get it to stop and regulate the output. I think it would be better if there was a way to completely cut off the air to the secondary baffle if you wanted to but I'm sure the EPA wouldn't let that happen. I'd probably find a way to jury rig something.

Does the manual say anything about different operating techniques? Still waiting on Woodstock to post the manual on their site.

HollowHill · Dec 20, 2011

Thank you, ciccio, for posting this. As a fellow Progressor, I really appreciate the information and I think if we pool what we are finding out, all will benefit. What size splits are you talking about (if you could give an inches size that would be helpful as I'm uncertain if my medium is really what is referred to by others as medium)? I have been loading 4 - 6 med to large splits, but I do get the fire going more before engaging the cat and get a lot of secondaries at first. I'm not sure how involved the wood has to be before engaging the cat. My stove top gets in the 450 - 470 range and it is heating my large, drafty house amazingly well. No complaints there, at all. But my burn times tend to be 3, 4 hours of good heat, then she starts to drop off. It's been colder here than in NJ (15 to 30 Â°F ).

ciccio · Dec 21, 2011

Todd said:
Interesting info. That's kind a what I was thinking after hearing some early failed attempts for a longer low output burn. Once that non cat mode kicks in it's hard to get it to stop and regulate the output. I think it would be better if there was a way to completely cut off the air to the secondary baffle if you wanted to but I'm sure the EPA wouldn't let that happen. I'd probably find a way to jury rig something.

Does the manual say anything about different operating techniques? Still waiting on Woodstock to post the manual on their site.

Todd I believe the manual explains it like it did for the fireview if I'm not mistaken..

ciccio · Dec 21, 2011

HollowHill said:
Thank you, ciccio, for posting this. As a fellow Progressor, I really appreciate the information and I think if we pool what we are finding out, all will benefit. What size splits are you talking about (if you could give an inches size that would be helpful as I'm uncertain if my medium is really what is referred to by others as medium)? I have been loading 4 - 6 med to large splits, but I do get the fire going more before engaging the cat and get a lot of secondaries at first. I'm not sure how involved the wood has to be before engaging the cat. My stove top gets in the 450 - 470 range and it is heating my large, drafty house amazingly well. No complaints there, at all. But my burn times tend to be 3, 4 hours of good heat, then she starts to drop off. It's been colder here than in NJ (15 to 30 Â°F ).

What I will try to do next time I load the stove, I will take a picture of the wood so you can see the size of my splits they vary a bit in size, then I can post how long of a burn time I got using this method that I am trying. Hope this will help..

fire_man · Dec 21, 2011

Ciccio: Great post and some good info. My Progress install is scheduled for Thursday morning- I'm lighting the last fire in the FV tonight, kind of sad, its been a good stove, just not enough when it gets cold.

ciccio · Dec 21, 2011

fire_man said:
Ciccio: Great post and some good info. My Progress install is scheduled for Thursday morning- I'm lighting the last fire in the FV tonight, kind of sad, its been a good stove, just not enough when it gets cold.

Thanks Tony, let us know how its working for you and please give us your input, I remember you at the open house you had a lot of good questions for the folks at woodstock.

fire_man · Dec 21, 2011

Ciccio:

Some of those numerous questions I asked at the Pig Roast actually led to the development of the new Progress ashlip that's being used to reduce Hearth "R" value and front clearance requirements. I likely would have had to cancel the stove if it were not for that lip. They were calling it the "Tony Lip" and boy am I honored!

One really good thing about Woodstock is they listen to real world user concerns and take them into consideration. This is just one of the ways this company stands out. Hey, I just thought of an advertising slogan for them: "Woodstock Rocks!"

I will definitely be posting my experiences, glad to hear you are doing well with the stove, I remember you at the Roast.

fire_man · Dec 21, 2011

Todd said:
Interesting info. That's kind a what I was thinking after hearing some early failed attempts for a longer low output burn. Once that non cat mode kicks in it's hard to get it to stop and regulate the output. I think it would be better if there was a way to completely cut off the air to the secondary baffle if you wanted to but I'm sure the EPA wouldn't let that happen. I'd probably find a way to jury rig something.

Does the manual say anything about different operating techniques? Still waiting on Woodstock to post the manual on their site.

Todd:

I think you nailed it regarding getting the long slow burn out of this stove, and Ciccio seems to be confirming it. I have a feeling since this is such a new technology (Hybrid) in wood stoves there will be new tricks to burning it to get the desired results. It took me a while to realize that lowering the draft too much on the FV actually caused the stovetop temp to rise, and that you needed to get those secondaries going to take the load off the cat for a while. Undoubtedly the Progress will have some tricks up its sleeve, it might take a while to learn it's secrets.

The manual really does not say much more than the FV manual about operating techniques - it was updated to make sense for the Progress, but other than that, not a lot of detail. I will ask WS if its ok for me to post a couple of the important pages, I don't see why it would not be.

mliiiwit · Feb 21, 2012

Todd said:
Interesting info. That's kind a what I was thinking after hearing some early failed attempts for a longer low output burn. Once that non cat mode kicks in it's hard to get it to stop and regulate the output. I think it would be better if there was a way to completely cut off the air to the secondary baffle if you wanted to but I'm sure the EPA wouldn't let that happen. I'd probably find a way to jury rig something.

Does the manual say anything about different operating techniques? Still waiting on Woodstock to post the manual on their site.

I've been burning my stove for 1 week now and just tonight learned something on the draft control. Before tonight, I had closed my draft until I felt moderate resistance to rotation and assumed that was "closed". Every time I was frustrated with continued primary and secondary flames and felt the draft control was less than optimal and that I wasn't achieving a high efficiency "cat" burn. Tonight, after getting the stove to min cat engage temp from a cold start, I quickly added 1 small round and a med split of pecan at full draft but without disengaging the cat. I immediately closed the draft and I put a little more force in the closing direction and the draft audibly protested a bit but rotated a bit further. All flame in the firebox extinguished almost immediately. A couple hours later now and the stove is cruising on the cat at 450 top temp and there has been NO flame in the firebox. Shining a flashlight into the firebox, I can see the round and split I added last and see just some charring on the round (beneath the split) and the split looks unaffected. I believe I've finally got the stove into the highest efficiency mode to date. If your firebox doesn't go black almost immediately, try rotating your draft control a little more towards closed and see what happens.

WarmInIowa · Feb 21, 2012

roundoak16 said:
If your firebox doesn't go black almost immediately, try rotating your draft control a little more towards closed and see what happens.

If your handle breaks, then that was too far, and back off just a little. ;-) Just kidding. My stove acts similar, I'm not sure, but I think it is because the draft control which is square hangs up on the slot cut into the rear heat shield for it. Is your the same way?

mliiiwit · Feb 23, 2012

Although I got a long low burn by doing this, I also woke up to a VERY dirty glass and firebox coated with creosote. Evidently, getting into this mode kept the cat engaged but slowed total gas flow through the stove so much that the firebox cooled enough at some point for the smoke to condense on the glass and walls. A subsequent 550+ top temp burn cleaned the glass pretty well but I'll still need to do some manual cleaning in the lower corners and along the bottom in front of the andirons.

rideau · Feb 25, 2012

Don't you find it a pain cleaning the glass at the base in front of the andirons? Anyone have a really good solution?

HollowHill · Feb 25, 2012

rideau said:
Don't you find it a pain cleaning the glass at the base in front of the andirons? Anyone have a really good solution?

+1. I'm thinking of hiring a child with really small hands. I use the really fine steel wool recommended in the manual to clean. I read on another thread that hard water can "stain" the glass over time and my water is very hard. But, with my large hands, it's difficult to get in front of the andirons. A tool would be nice...

Waulie · Feb 25, 2012

I just use damp paper towel. I roll it up to where it fits snug in between the andirons and the glass and snake it through from on side to the other. It works fine and is simple. The only problem is it's always pretty darn warm in there!

WarmInIowa · Feb 25, 2012

That's my problem, with the Fireview, it was cool enough in the morning to work in there. This stove is too hot all the time and I don't like to let it cool off. The damp paper towel is what I use too, it' just too hot in there!

mliiiwit · Feb 25, 2012

rideau said:
Don't you find it a pain cleaning the glass at the base in front of the andirons? Anyone have a really good solution?

A good hot fire will clean the upper and middle parts of the glass but forward and outboard of the andirons seems to be a dead zone for heat circulation. I'm wondering if the creosote could be burnt off of those areas with a paint-stripping heat gun. Has anybody tried that?

Backwoods Savage · Feb 25, 2012

Roundoak, most folks are not speaking of creosote on the glass. In this case, they are talking about fly ash on the glass and a hot fire will do nothing for that. If you are getting creosote then that is usually the fault of the wood or perhaps an air leak somewhere; usually the gasket behind the glass.

mliiiwit · Feb 28, 2012

Backwoods Savage said:
Roundoak, most folks are not speaking of creosote on the glass. In this case, they are talking about fly ash on the glass and a hot fire will do nothing for that. If you are getting creosote then that is usually the fault of the wood or perhaps an air leak somewhere; usually the gasket behind the glass.

Hi Dennis,
Thanks for your input, but please do help me understand a few things. Do you have a PH or a Fireview? Are you burning pecan that you cut and have seasoned for 2.5 years? In your experience, is steel wool required to clean flyash from the glass, as mentioned in previous posts on this thread? What is the objective of a cat or tube stove, if not to produce smoke (creosote) from primary combustion to be burnt by secondary combustion or the cat?

RoundOak 16 (Mike)

BrowningBAR · Feb 28, 2012

roundoak16 said:
Backwoods Savage said:

Roundoak, most folks are not speaking of creosote on the glass. In this case, they are talking about fly ash on the glass and a hot fire will do nothing for that. If you are getting creosote then that is usually the fault of the wood or perhaps an air leak somewhere; usually the gasket behind the glass.

Click to expand...

Hi Dennis,
Thanks for your input, but please do help me understand a few things. Do you have a PH or a Fireview? Are you burning pecan that you cut and have seasoned for 2.5 years? In your experience, is steel wool required to clean flyash from the glass, as mentioned in previous posts on this thread? What is the objective of a cat or tube stove, if not to produce smoke (creosote) from primary combustion to be burnt by secondary combustion or the cat?

RoundOak 16 (Mike)

I would not use steel wool on stove glass. Fly ash washes off with a damp paper towel. Creosote can be removed with damp paper towel dipped in some ash.

Nater · Feb 28, 2012

Does everyone also get the pile of ash at the bottom of the glass? I get about 1/2 inch thick layer of ash between the glass and the cast iron frame. After cleaning the glass, I take an old paintbrush and clean all the ash from the bottom of the glass. After a few days, the ash is back and is unsightly to look at. I was thinking about stuffing a gasket or something in there to stop it, but can't decide which is worse, the look of the ash or the gasket.

Backwoods Savage · Feb 28, 2012

roundoak16 said:
Backwoods Savage said:

Roundoak, most folks are not speaking of creosote on the glass. In this case, they are talking about fly ash on the glass and a hot fire will do nothing for that. If you are getting creosote then that is usually the fault of the wood or perhaps an air leak somewhere; usually the gasket behind the glass.

Click to expand...

Hi Dennis,
Thanks for your input, but please do help me understand a few things. Do you have a PH or a Fireview? Are you burning pecan that you cut and have seasoned for 2.5 years? In your experience, is steel wool required to clean flyash from the glass, as mentioned in previous posts on this thread? What is the objective of a cat or tube stove, if not to produce smoke (creosote) from primary combustion to be burnt by secondary combustion or the cat?

RoundOak 16 (Mike)

Mike, we have the Fireview with a Progress on order. No experience with pecan wood as you would expect. They just don't grow here. I would not use steel wool to clean the glass. For the fly ash on the glass, a simple damp paper towel works great. The objective of any stove is simply to give heat; not to produce smoke. The idea of a cat is to burn the unburned so you get heat from it and not put the dirty air outside.

My Woodstock Progress method for a slow burn

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