New Home - Heating Options

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jimeez

New Member
Sep 11, 2011
2
South Central PA
I wasn't quite sure where to post this, but chose The Boiler Room because circulated hot water and/or radiant heat is my preference. I've been a long-time lurker, short-time member, and now first-time poster here at Hearth.com. Good community to say the least. Looking for some advice and input from the members.

I am in the very fortunate (or unfortunate...depending on how you look at it) position of designing and building my own home. The structural design is complete, we're waiting for the permitting process to complete. 2139 sq ft single-story rancher with a full basement and additional 300 sq ft of conditioned attic space. As you can imagine, the design of the HVAC system as been my biggest hurdle. There are far too many options out there for my brain to fully comprehend. I have access to an unending supply of good hard wood (oak, hickory, ash, locust, ect.). I plan on heating with wood in some fashion. In fact, I've already got 11 cord cut, split, and stacked just from the lumber we cleared for the building site. And there is no end in sight to amount of fallen and standing dead wood on my property.

We were originally going to place an old Baker Double Eagle woodstove smack in the middle of the main living space and use a variable speed air handler to circulate the air for even heat distribution. But as the house design progressed we decided that we wanted that real estate for other things. So we then decided on a Yukon Eagle; connecting it to the ductwork that we're going to have to install anyway for central air. We were so much sold on this method that we designed a walk-in basement access (as opposed to Bilco doors) in order to make bringing wood into the basement that much easier. Honeslty though, neither my wife or I are particularily fond of hot forced air heat and would really like to avoid it if at all possible. But of course cost will be the biggest detrmining factor, and the Yukon married with a heat pump appears to be the cheapest option that I could come up with.

I have been reading a lot about different wood boilers, specifically wood gassification systems. I'm sort of at an impasse right now. I'd like to find the most efficient use of my available hard wood. I like being in the woods, cutting, splitting, etc. I am in good physical shape and expect to be able to continue using wood for at least the next 25 years. I'd love to hear your thoughts and opinions. Looking for a way to use wood for heating and domestic hot water while avoiding a hot-forced air solution. I'm sure I missed something and will monitor this thread for any questions.

Many thanks in advance.
 
Welcome aboard Jimeez. You will likely get alot of people that will recommend gassification boilers. Hands down they seem to be the most efficient. My system is not complete yet but you will get plenty of answers from people in the know. Oh, and the rules for new members include posting a picture of your wife. Again, welcome.
 
When I built my place, I installed radiant heat. For me, it is tubing in the concrete floor, and eventually some staple-up. Now that I have done it, and lived with it for a few years, I can't imagine EVER heating with a different method. It is an amazingly uniform, constant, and wonderful feeling of warmth. I haven't installed the staple up yet upstairs...but the heat in the slab is just incredible.

Since you haven't built yet....you can do a gypcrete pour on top of your subfloor and have similar results...just without as much thermal mass as concrete. I consider doing this upstairs...though I might be beyond that possibility, even with my incredible snails pace!

I was just telling my wife this morning, I don't think I could ever live without radiant now that I have experienced it....

It can be pricey, the more you do yourself the more you will save....and it really is pretty straight foward. Most certainly investigate and consider radiant!
 
I wish I could have done the radiant in slab in the basement but I had to go with a custom home contractor who had no experience in that area and didn't want to learn. Going with a builder was stress enough and I'm glad we did because my wife barely survived those 12 months as it was. Even though it may become difficult at times, it will be very rewarding for you to have full control of the process. You could even write a book about it when you are done.

All that said, I think you are on the right path. If you are working with an acreage and plan to have a shop or barn, a gasser located there might be a good option. I'm a big fan of keeping the mess outside of the house but since you are designing it yourself, you may be able to make your own boiler room separate from the living area in your basement which would be just as good. Insulation is the key. I'm insulated with R19 fiberglass in walls and R19 fiberglass + R30 equivalent blown in the ceilings. The windows and patio doors are all the Pellas with the integrated blinds mainly for that feature but they seem to do OK energy wise too. Other companies actually make true triple panes that would even be more efficient. Our home sounds similar to yours 2200 sq. ft. walkout ranch. If you do go the gasser route, you could go with a water to air HX in the air handler relatively inexpensively initially and finish later with staple up radiant/plates. I would still put pex in your basement floor however since that is relatively cheap even with the 2" pinkboard. Many swear by the heat given off the by new Euro style radiant panels that work well with lower temp water from a gasser/storage or Garn setup. My wife would not go for having something like that in the room because we live in "forced air heating territory". If you have no desire to heat DHW with wood or don't mind burning a little electricity when your firebox burns out then the Yukon or KummaVapor wood furnace might be all you need. They are certainly easier to install than a boiler. If you go that route make sure you have a proven damper method in your ductwork that prevents air from flowing back through which ever appliance is not running. My FIL has to manually switch his from wood furnace to heat pump or vise versa which is less than ideal.
 
Insulate. Seal infiltration off. Do more than you see recommended, especially on the infiltration. This is an investment that works winter and summer. Doesn't need to be turned on or off. Needs no maintenance. Runs silent. Allows a stove in one room to heat the whole house more evenly. Allows you to buy a smaller stove, smaller air conditioner, and be more comfortable in all seasons.

Our house exterior dimensions are 50' x 42'. The basement has 9' ceilings and the first floor 10' in most areas. Design winter temp 0 °F. Twenty years heated by a 34,000 Btu/hour 40 gallon water heater that also provided domestic hot water for the family. Hydronic radiant floors in concrete. Air conditioner is 18,000 Btu/hour central system.

All because of insulation and minimal passive solar. I didn't go overboard on passive solar, because didn't want an overheated main room.

This winter was the first heated exclusively by the wood stove. Wife loved the radiant floor, but she grew up without central heat and really liked the hot stove this past winter. I didn't save much money, since our bills were always low and we have natural gas. However, I say again, the wife really liked the hot stove. So a super insulated house gives you a lot of options, not to mention never having to buy a furnace or boiler.
 
I'm with jimbom, air seal and insulate, way beyond what is code. You are building a reasonable sized house that with some attention and a few extra bucks thrown at the insulation & windows should not be too hard to heat. I would make the extra insulation investment (it is an investment with good returns forever) and go with a good heat pump and ac., and make the provisions for radiant, (put the pex in the bsmt slab) and you can do the staple up later. The radiant is as a wonderful heat as every one says. I will witness to that! The heat pump will prolly give you satisfactory results until a wood heat decision is made and will nicely fill in the "shoulder seasons" before you need full time heating. (when you add some type of wood heating) It sounds like you may be doing all this yourself ? The radiant is a breeze. All common sense stuff, I hired a radiant Co. to do the design work, and did my own installation. You prolly be OK with just doing some research on line and installing the pex (bsmt. slab) yourself, and don't forget the 2" of rigid foam under the slab.
In short, make the extra investment in your thermal "envelope" , see how the relatively "free" heat pump works. And reassess your needs after a winter or 2.
Check out http://www.greenbuildingtalk.com/Forums.aspx for some good info.
 
You will get more advice and recommendations than you can shake a stick at, I am sure. For what it's worth, I would strongly echo several of the points made. We built our own home in the Yukon bush, totally off-grid, so needed to be very carefully thought through. There are two buildings--main house with 1829 sq. ft., all one level, great room with 20' vaulted ceiling, windows facing south, with a wrap around veranda which allows direct sunlight in the winter but provides shade in the summer--passive solar and light concerns. We also have in-floor radiant heat, using a product called Warmboard (www.warmboard.com). I was and am extremely pleased with the ease of install (did it all myself--no special framing or other considerations) and absolutely love the in-floor heat!

There is a second building, storey and a half garage/shop/mechanical room on the bottom, games room, bedroom, bathroom on the top, with 37' by 34' footprint. On the ground floor, besides the garage/shop, there is an electrical room (batteries and inverters and charge controllers), a water storage room (1800 gallons of potable water with pump and pressure tank) and then the boiler room (two boilers--one wood, one oil, plus 850 gallon heat storage tank).

Entire system was designed to cope with -60C winter temps, with double exterior wall construction--outer 2x6 with R20 and off-set inner 2x4 with R12 insulation. R60 blown in ceiling. At the time (10 years ago) I was at the extreme edge of insulation. Some new construction now going in with R60 in the walls and R100 in the ceilings. We have a Vermont Castings wood stove in the Great Room which we occasionally use for romance and for redundancy. (We have lots of redundancies in the system--don't want to be left without heat or power at -40.)

You cannot beat in-floor radiant heat--whatever your heat source--a geothermal heat pump, wood boiler, etc. And it is always nice to have the option of a wood stove for its unique warmth as well as for back-up. Increasing your insulation and eliminating infiltration are undoubtedly the most cost-effective ways to save heat $$ down the road--though you need to be very sure that you have an effective HVAC system or you will be working against yourself. My two-cents.
 
I want to thank everyone for their responses so far. I am still digesting a lot of it, so my 1st response will be brief. Just wanted to let you all know that I am reading this and it has done two things:

1. Reaffirmed our desire to have radiant heat.
2. Given me too damn much more to think about.

Oh....my wife said she'd let me post some pictures of her after we get the house built and she's cozy warm in the new house. ;)


EDIT: Oh I forgot a third thing....I should have started this research years ago.
 
Welcome to hearth.com

My wife is a nurse at a long term care home where the temperature is always 75 F or so.

We keep our house at 73F, DHW at 130 and hot tub at 104F all with our wood gasification boiler and we love it.

We burn about 16-17 faces cords per season and average (1) Five hour fire per day.

We use a combination of 2/3 radiant floor heat (staple up) and 1/3 baseboard.

I would highly recommend a good quality gasifier with approx. 1,000 gallons of storage.

Hope this helps point you in the right direction.

Brian
 
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