Oak - the story of frustration.

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fishingpol

Minister of Fire
Jul 13, 2010
2,049
Merrimack Valley, MA
I will start off by saying this is a story of a friend of mine who burns exclusively oak. He is a good guy, and am I not here to bash him, and please, no bad comments towards him. This is just a simple story of why oak needs to be put up for more than a year. Sure, it can be cut smaller and split small, but just as regular splits, it needs time.

He burns just over a cord and a half every year. Every spring two cords are delivered and put up in stacks, double rows, butted up no air space. These stacks are covered top and southern side right after stacking, under large maple trees.

I got on the discussion of buying mixed hardwoods like I do, and saving the oak for the coldest days. He said his wood that he is currently burning is dry and proceeded to knock to splits together like bowling pins. We settled the issue by re-splitting random splits and measuring the moisture content. My meter is not digital, but it read 28-30% and my meter only goes to 30%. I explained that I am burning 12-15% MC on maple, cherry, locust and oak and I have zero issues on running a clean burn.

So he is basically burning 30% MC oak. I try to explain that much energy is used boiling the moisture out, and he is not getting anywhere the potential BTU's out of the wood. His cost is actually more than I am paying for seasoned wood. His window glass is usually dark and they have to leave the door ajar to get it to light off well. Many days the fires are smokey and his house on many occassions has a smoke odor in it. His last liner clean had some glazed creosote at the top as his liner is not insulated in a brick chimney, which is another story in itself.
 
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Does he ever have leftover wood that he burns when it is two years old? Does it make a difference in the way his wood burns? Why not give him some of your dry wood to try so he can see the difference.
 
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Give him a few sticks of seasoned wood and show him how properly seasoned wood burns. Some people are just stubborn and won't listen no matter what evidence is shown them though.
 
Give him a few sticks of seasoned wood and show him how properly seasoned wood burns. Some people are just stubborn and won't listen no matter what evidence is shown them though.

+1
If he sees it burn better, you have a better chance of convincing him :)
 
All great advice.

The offer has been made to try dry seasoned wood, but declined.

All the wood is burned before 2 years. The last 1/2 cord leftover from this current season is the fall/early winter wood this coming season.

I try not to venture in how to run his domain. I do offer friendly advice and my experiences with seasoned wood though.
 
Tell him about this site...
 
I did James. Too much crap on the net for him to bother with than this informative stuff...
 
I was once like your buddy before I got onto this site. I know first hand now how long it takes for oak to dry and will let it sit while I burn the maple and ash next year. I did get a nice white oak tree from one of my wifes co workers and I will maybe burn that in two years from now if it's ready. I am really looking forward to burning it.
 
It's too bad....he's buying great wood, but burning it with a high mc. He would be so much better off with ash. At least it would be drier.
 
Ive had the same experiences with my neighbors, they get green wood delivered in Sept/Oct and burn it that year, I mentioned it once, thats enough, its their business.
 
It is almost like that weatherguy. None of my business. BUT, I don't the smoke that blows down into my yard, and the creosote issue is a chimney fire waiting to happen.
 
I will start off by saying this is a story of a friend of mine who burns exclusively oak. He is a good guy, and am I not here to bash him, and please, no bad comments towards him. This is just a simple story of why oak needs to be put up for more than a year. Sure, it can be cut smaller and split small, but just as regular splits, it needs time.

He burns just over a cord and a half every year. Every spring two cords are delivered and put up in stacks, double rows, butted up no air space. These stacks are covered top and southern side right after stacking, under large maple trees.

I got on the discussion of buying mixed hardwoods like I do, and saving the oak for the coldest days. He said his wood that he is currently burning is dry and proceeded to knock to splits together like bowling pins. We settled the issue by re-splitting random splits and measuring the moisture content. My meter is not digital, but it read 28-30% and my meter only goes to 30%. I explained that I am burning 12-15% MC on maple, cherry, locust and oak and I have zero issues on running a clean burn.

So he is basically burning 30% MC oak. I try to explain that much energy is used boiling the moisture out, and he is not getting anywhere the potential BTU's out of the wood. His cost is actually more than I am paying for seasoned wood. His window glass is usually dark and they have to leave the door ajar to get it to light off well. Many days the fires are smokey and his house on many occassions has a smoke odor in it. His last liner clean had some glazed creosote at the top as his liner is not insulated in a brick chimney, which is another story in itself.

Classic case of the old addage "You can lead a horse to water". If he would only take a few minutes on these forums! Firewood seasoned to a low enough moisture content is the first commandment of efficient wood burning.
Take care,
Tim
 
Sad, but we hear of cases like this all the time. Not many that can be taught though so they will just continue on their struggling ways.
 
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I get a lot of free wood from Craigslist I always ask how long it has been sitting, but it is usually big chunks of stump. It is hot here in the summer, and low humidity. Many say firewood will season in the hot Sacramento Valley sun in in a month or two. I need to find one of those moisture meters myself before I believe it .
 
It still amazes me that some folks are so set in their ways that they refuse to change despite being shown the "light".
I saw the light after just a few fires, and made up my mind that something was wrong, then set about making a change. Finding the Hearth just reinforced what I experienced.
Making more work for myself, or spending more than I need in time, effort, and money, just doesn't work.
Life's too short to continue that way.
It's taken me about 4 years to get it into my Neanderthal brother's head that burning wet wood is hard, and burning dry wood is easier. He still doesn't completely get it, but I keep at him. After all, what are brothers for, if not to bother siblings? :cool:
Next......new stove time. His is older than mine.!!
 
Don't confuse me with the facts . . . I live living in my fantasy land of denial and ignorance.
 
Give him a few sticks of seasoned wood and show him how properly seasoned wood burns. Some people are just stubborn and won't listen no matter what evidence is shown them though.

true.

and even if they did, would they be willing to work as hard as necessary to get at least 2 years ahead? might mean a log splitter, a good saw, scrounging, hauling, maybe a woodshed. that's a ton of work for someone who is content to burn wet wood.
 
true.

and even if they did, would they be willing to work as hard as necessary to get at least 2 years ahead? might mean a log splitter, a good saw, scrounging, hauling, maybe a woodshed. that's a ton of work for someone who is content to burn wet wood.

Their wood is cut and delivered. Small house lot, not much room for more than two cords without getting crammed. Splitter gets rented on scrounges. Short on storage space and time to get wood.
 
This winter was my first with really dry, as in 2 summers c/s/s wood and wow what a difference! Especially with all the fires we had to light during the mild winter. Just a few sheets of newspaper and a couple sticks of kindling and the smaller splits were an inferno in a few minutes! Not even much smoke on startup either. Next year will be even better with 3 summer seasoned Red Oak! I would never go back to poorly seasoned wood again.
 
This winter was my first with really dry, as in 2 summers c/s/s wood and wow what a difference! Especially with all the fires we had to light during the mild winter. Just a few sheets of newspaper and a couple sticks of kindling and the smaller splits were an inferno in a few minutes!
For years I never could make myself cut more than a few months before I needed the wood. Always ended up fighting that wet Red Oak, trying to keep a fire burning. A few months ago, I demoed the stove for a buddy of mine who used to burn an old pot belly stove years ago. I just loaded up, lit one match, and closed the door. At one point he said "You didn't mess with the fire at all." I said "Yeah, that's dry wood, it burns itself." ==c That was wood stacked less than a year, that was dead standing when cut. The burning only gets better from here on out. Problem is, I've gone overboard and I'm now stacking wood to the sky! :oops:
 
This winter was my first with really dry, as in 2 summers c/s/s wood and wow what a difference! Especially with all the fires we had to light during the mild winter. Just a few sheets of newspaper and a couple sticks of kindling and the smaller splits were an inferno in a few minutes! Not even much smoke on startup either. Next year will be even better with 3 summer seasoned Red Oak! I would never go back to poorly seasoned wood again.

Agreed Steve. A few years ago I bought wood at 22-25% MC. It was ok, a little fussy. I have a new wood supplier, actually a neighbor of mine. The wood is 12-15% MC at burn time. It is a huge difference, morning starts from coals take right off.

That should be some good oak for you on year 3. Let us know the MC at 3 years if you can.
 
I don't have a moisture meter. After three years split and stacked, I don't think I have measure. If I go to Woodstock '12, I'll bring some.
 
I get a lot of free wood from Craigslist I always ask how long it has been sitting, but it is usually big chunks of stump. It is hot here in the summer, and low humidity. Many say firewood will season in the hot Sacramento Valley sun in in a month or two. I need to find one of those moisture meters myself before I believe it .

I've always noticed it is either people who don't burn wood or those who have not been burning long who claim short drying times. In other words, they heard it somewhere and are repeating it. We call them the twins: Pete and repeat.
 
I just came in from splitting my white oak,hoping that by splitting it small in May I'll be able to burn it in October.This discussion reminded me of how well old oak burns. I better get looking for some seasoned wood for this winter.
 
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