Checked the chimney

Backwoods Savage · Sep 20, 2012

As we usually do, in the fall we check the chimney. We also check it a few times during the winter. But what did we find in the chimney this year? Some spider webs and a clean chimney! So we have now burned wood in our new stove for 5 complete winters and wood heat is our only source of heat. We have cleaned our chimney one time and then got about a cup of soot. Of course when we remove the cap on the tee, we do get a little bit of junk but not enough to amount to anything.

Why, when we find people (we used to) cleaning their chimneys several times per winter, can we get by so long? We attribute this to burning good dry fuel in a clean burning cat stove. This Fireview is our first stove with a catalyst and although we were hesitant on buying it, we now find our fears were rather silly.

The biggest factor in clean burning is having good wood. We dry our wood usually for a minimum of 3 years (sometimes 2 years and sometimes many, many more). This past 5 years we have burned white ash because our woods was infected by the emerald ash borer. But in addition to the ash we also burn some elm, soft maple, cherry and oak (mainly red and pin oak). Occasionally we'll have some other wood, like blue beech, popple, thorn apple, etc., but our main wood is ash. When that is gone we will probably burn mainly elm, soft maple and oak.

bogydave · Sep 20, 2012

Backwoods Savage said:
We attribute this to burning good dry fuel in a clean burning cat stove. .

Well said.

Good dry wood is the # 1 key, cat or non cat!

etiger2007 · Sep 20, 2012

Savage thats great and gives the rest of us the will to get ahead on the wood supply. I hope I can get clean burns like that in a non-cat stove. I wish you would take some pics of the flue to show us how clean it is, i do believe you i just want to see a five year flu that hasnt been cleaned and has only been fed dry wood. Thanks for all your advise and time.

Backwoods Savage · Sep 20, 2012

etiger2007 said:
Savage thats great and gives the rest of us the will to get ahead on the wood supply. I hope I can get clean burns like that in a non-cat stove. I wish you would take some pics of the flue to show us how clean it is, i do believe you i just want to see a five year flu that hasnt been cleaned and has only been fed dry wood. Thanks for all your advise and time.

Tiger I just might see if I can aim the camera up there to get a good shot.

Nixon · Sep 20, 2012

Thanks for posting this ,Dennis. I just checked mine,and didn't find anything to amount to much . It's been that way for several years. I seriously have thought about posting something to ask if I may be doing the cleaning wrong . I believe you are right , it's the fuel . I generally burn wood that's 3-5 years old .

etiger2007 · Sep 20, 2012

Backwoods Savage said:
Tiger I just might see if I can aim the camera up there to get a good shot.

I suppose i need to just come over and see it in person and check out that Fireview.

Backwoods Savage · Sep 20, 2012

etiger2007 said:
I suppose i need to just come over and see it in person and check out that Fireview.

Tiger, you are welcome and we'd be happy to see you. You have my phone number and email so just let me know ahead of time. That is a long way to come to find nobody home! lol

PapaDave · Sep 20, 2012

Dennis, good info (yet again).
I really should keep a log of checks to the flue this winter. I checked quite a few times last year, but only cleaned 2-3 times and probably could have skipped at least one of those.
Not too shabby considering the old stove. I attribute it to the drier wood and burn habits I've acquired.
Still burns dirtier than I'd like, but cleaner burning will come with the new stove.

We'll see what this season brings.

Backwoods Savage · Sep 20, 2012

You are right Dave. A new stove can do wonders, not only in the clean burning, but keeping your bottom side warmer too. Another very nice thing is that you burn less wood for more heat. We cut our wood needs in half and heat more area too.

PapaDave · Sep 20, 2012

Preachin' to the choir Dennis, preachin' to the choir.

The choir w/o a new EPA stove. ;em

Yet.

fire_man · Sep 20, 2012

Dennis

Good dry wood is certainly necessary, but I suspect there is more going on here. Can you tell us exactly what your flue setup is? I know it's not supposed to draft as well as it does because it's kind of short, but what is your setup - is it a Class A liner?

I have been operating with a 15 foot uninsulated 6" SS liner installed thru a 12"x12" exterior chimney clay liner and burned 3 year old wood but still had to clean the flue 2-3 times a year. It was just fluffy powder, but definitely lots more than you describe in your flue. Today I just finished wrapping it twice with a blanket of insulation so it now has two 1/2" layers of Foil Faced wrap. I expect and hope this improves the draft and gets me closer to your experience.

The draft definitely suffered after I switched to the Progress, I attributed it to the lower flue gas temperature relative to the Fireview. With the Fireview we had no draft issue but still had to clean 2-3 times a year when burning 3 year old seasoned wood.

sappy · Sep 20, 2012

Backwoods Savage said:
As we usually do, in the fall we check the chimney. We also check it a few times during the winter. But what did we find in the chimney this year? Some spider webs and a clean chimney! So we have now burned wood in our new stove for 5 complete winters and wood heat is our only source of heat. We have cleaned our chimney one time and then got about a cup of soot. Of course when we remove the cap on the tee, we do get a little bit of junk but not enough to amount to anything.

Why, when we find people (we used to) cleaning their chimneys several times per winter, can we get by so long? We attribute this to burning good dry fuel in a clean burning cat stove. This Fireview is our first stove with a catalyst and although we were hesitant on buying it, we now find our fears were rather silly.

The biggest factor in clean burning is having good wood. We dry our wood usually for a minimum of 3 years (sometimes 2 years and sometimes many, many more). This past 5 years we have burned white ash because our woods was infected by the emerald ash borer. But in addition to the ash we also burn some elm, soft maple, cherry and oak (mainly red and pin oak). Occasionally we'll have some other wood, like blue beech, popple, thorn apple, etc., but our main wood is ash. When that is gone we will probably burn mainly elm, soft maple and oak.

Dennis our fire view is ready to go as well. Still a little warm for me yet but certain that will change in time. My sweep took maybe a coffee can or two out I think. He thought this was pretty good. As you might recall I had a couple cords of kiln dried the first year and some other maple as well. I am hoping where that wood which 6 cords were left to go into this yes supply, it will be even drier. I need to o a lite for or two when ready to get any moisture out and forget if I should keep com buster out of it those couple times or no.
Hope all has been well for you My Friend, it has been a crazy and hectic summer here.
My bet from Vermont,
Pat aka Sappy

rideau · Sep 20, 2012

fire_man said:
Dennis

Good dry wood is certainly necessary, but I suspect there is more going on here. Can you tell us exactly what your flue setup is? I know it's not supposed to draft as well as it does because it's kind of short, but what is your setup - is it a Class A liner?

I have been operating with a 15 foot uninsulated 6" SS liner installed thru a 12"x12" exterior chimney clay liner and burned 3 year old wood but still had to clean the flue 2-3 times a year. It was just fluffy powder, but definitely lots more than you describe in your flue. Today I just finished wrapping it twice with a blanket of insulation so it now has two 1/2" layers of Foil Faced wrap. I expect and hope this improves the draft and gets me closer to your experience.

The draft definitely suffered after I switched to the Progress, I attributed it to the lower flue gas temperature relative to the Fireview. With the Fireview we had no draft issue but still had to clean 2-3 times a year when burning 3 year old seasoned wood.

Tony, chiming in on your note to Dennis: with both my Fireview and PH I have cleaned a maximum of once a year, get very little out of the chimney, and all I do get seems to be at the sliding area of the adjustable stovepipe or below. Haven't noticed a difference in draft with the PH, but I have a really long (30 feet) interior double wall pipe and chimney....and I'm on top of a hill, facing N across a lake, about 250 wooded feet back from and 100 feet above the lake.

remkel · Sep 21, 2012

Dennis,

Keep preaching to us oh wise sage of wood burning and vertical splitting! Going to be looking at my flue this weekend. Curious to see what I get.

fire_man · Sep 21, 2012

Rideau:

WOW a 30 foot double wall INTERIOR chimney? That think must draft like a hyperactive vacuum cleaner. I have heard exterior chimneys that are "too tall" can actually start to hurt draft because you lose the benefit of the height due to cooling of flue gases towards the top.

I should know pretty soon if/how much the insulation helps me with the Progess - it's starting to get cooler around here.

Waulie · Sep 21, 2012

I just cleaned mine the other day. I got about a cup of chunky stuff from the top of the chimney (the part that sticks out of the roof). The rest was totally clean. I have an interior, clay flue masonry chimney at around 25 feet.

Last time a cleaned it was early January after getting the PH. That cleaning, I got an entire ash bucket full of crap since the previous cleaning just three months before. So, yes, good dry wood but also the stove can make a huge difference.

Tony, I bet you see quite a difference with that insulation both in draft and in creasote.

fire_man · Sep 21, 2012

I just lit the first fire. With the brand new insulation the fire was definitely easier to start in 55 F degree weather - but I still do get smoke spillage out the door when loading. Before insulating, the fire was almost impossible to get going in warm weather, so there is a noticeable improvement with the insulation (hip hip hooray!). I had removed the smoke baffle plate above the door last year, so I will put it back and see if it helps prevent spillage. The plate was annoying because it prevented fully loading the stove - but for shoulder season (when it's needed most) it should work out since I don't fully load the stove.

So after the first fire on a warm day, I am seeing a definite improvement in draft with the double wrap insulation.

Waulie · Sep 21, 2012

Good news, Tony! I get a little smoke spillage in those kinds of temps too. The smoke baffle helps a little.
I don't find it to be an issue though. In these warmer temps, I'm not reloading on anything smoking. I build a fire with paper, kindling, and a few splits, light that up, shut the door and no need to open again for 8 hours or so.

I don't get any smoke spillage is normal temps, so I think you might be in business.

rideau · Sep 21, 2012

Good to hear that problem is resolved for you, Tony. Now you'll be able to enjoy the PH even more. I can't wait for consistently cool weather, with chilly nights. It gets harder and harder to relax in front of that stove of an evening and not be looking at a great fire.....

Backwoods Savage · Sep 21, 2012

fire_man said:
Dennis

Good dry wood is certainly necessary, but I suspect there is more going on here. Can you tell us exactly what your flue setup is? I know it's not supposed to draft as well as it does because it's kind of short, but what is your setup - is it a Class A liner?

I have been operating with a 15 foot uninsulated 6" SS liner installed thru a 12"x12" exterior chimney clay liner and burned 3 year old wood but still had to clean the flue 2-3 times a year. It was just fluffy powder, but definitely lots more than you describe in your flue. Today I just finished wrapping it twice with a blanket of insulation so it now has two 1/2" layers of Foil Faced wrap. I expect and hope this improves the draft and gets me closer to your experience.

The draft definitely suffered after I switched to the Progress, I attributed it to the lower flue gas temperature relative to the Fireview. With the Fireview we had no draft issue but still had to clean 2-3 times a year when burning 3 year old seasoned wood.

Sure Tony. The Fireview sits on a 16" raised hearth. The flue goes straight out the rear and through the wall. That horizontal section has a bit over 1/2" rise per foot. There is 17" of black pipe before going into the thimble. Outside there is a tee and then straight up with class A. Above the tee there is 12' of class A. So according to all the theories, this should not work. I did have it higher and when we tested we could not notice any difference in the draw so I reduced the pipe so that we did not have to put roof braces on. We have never had a problem with draft with this stove and this is the shortest chimney we've ever had. I'm still a bit puzzled but it works.

In addition to the above, we live in the woods which means we are surrounded by trees. The tallest are some red and white oaks on the opposite (north) side of the house. On the east there is a soft maple which is about 40-50'. To the SE is a pretty good sized pin oak which is much higher. Pines to the south and some white pine and oak really close on the SW. More oaks and maples to the west.

The wind here swirls a lot and most times during the winter months on reloads we see smoke come right down to the ground. So why we get a good draft is still a bit puzzling to me. All I know is it works just fine.

Backwoods Savage · Sep 21, 2012

sappy said:
Dennis our fire view is ready to go as well. Still a little warm for me yet but certain that will change in time. My sweep took maybe a coffee can or two out I think. He thought this was pretty good. As you might recall I had a couple cords of kiln dried the first year and some other maple as well. I am hoping where that wood which 6 cords were left to go into this yes supply, it will be even drier. I need to o a lite for or two when ready to get any moisture out and forget if I should keep com buster out of it those couple times or no.
Hope all has been well for you My Friend, it has been a crazy and hectic summer here.
My bet from Vermont,
Pat aka Sappy

Hi Sappy. Seems most of us had a hectic summer. I was hoping to pay you a visit this fall but it appears we won't be heading east this year. Maybe next year? I remember it was really nice to meet you and your lovely wife last year.

You did the burn-in last year on the Fireview so you should be fine. Naturally your first fires in the fall will be small fires so there is no need to worry about any burn in as that will take care of any moisture. As for the cat, if the stove gets hot enough, by all means, flip that lever. We had a fire a couple days ago and got the stove top only to 400 but we flipped that lever at about 225 degrees stove top. Flue was 450. That was a pretty small fire but was enough that we just left it alone and let it burn out. I am thinking about lighting another one right now though as I feel a bit cool and with the weather (trying to rain) now a small fire might feel good in here.

Hope you got lots of wood put up for next spring. I'm betting the sap will run much better than it did last spring. At least we hope so!

rideau · Sep 21, 2012

Backwoods Savage said:
Sure Tony. The Fireview sits on a 16" raised hearth. The flue goes straight out the rear and through the wall. That horizontal section has a bit over 1/2" rise per foot. There is 17" of black pipe before going into the thimble. Outside there is a tee and then straight up with class A. Above the tee there is 12' of class A. So according to all the theories, this should not work. I did have it higher and when we tested we could not notice any difference in the draw so I reduced the pipe so that we did not have to put roof braces on. We have never had a problem with draft with this stove and this is the shortest chimney we've ever had. I'm still a bit puzzled but it works.

In addition to the above, we live in the woods which means we are surrounded by trees. The tallest are some red and white oaks on the opposite (north) side of the house. On the east there is a soft maple which is about 40-50'. To the SE is a pretty good sized pin oak which is much higher. Pines to the south and some white pine and oak really close on the SW. More oaks and maples to the west.

The wind here swirls a lot and most times during the winter months on reloads we see smoke come right down to the ground. So why we get a good draft is still a bit puzzling to me. All I know is it works just fine.

Sounds beautiful. You must enjoy watching lots of wildlife....

Backwoods Savage · Sep 21, 2012

We do Rideau. Just before I came inside I saw 2 deer standing there watching me.

fire_man · Sep 21, 2012

Dennis

That's amazing, only 12 feet of class A surrounded by trees. Jeez - you have broken the laws of physics. But glad it works, you certainly have a good setup.

westkywood · Sep 22, 2012

So I finally cleaned out my flue from last year. I never cleaned it out once last year. I took off the single wall pipe inside the house and shined a light up into the flue and saw almost nothing. I ran a brush down it anyway and got maybe a cup of creosote. Got about the same amount out of the single wall pipe. Thats for the entire year last year. I contribute it to two things. First , we did have a milder winter, and second, my wood was seasoned an extra year. I burn 24-7 .. Last year I got 4 1/2 cups of creosote at the end of the year.
I burned Maple and Oak.....Saweeeet.......

Checked the chimney

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