Ash trees

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Backwoods Savage

Minister of Fire
Feb 14, 2007
27,811
Michigan
As I was wandering through our woods I had to take note of several ash trees that have fallen over. Our trees have been dead for many years as we got hit first around 2002 and have cut many, many cord plus have had others come in to cut also. But they are just now starting to get to the point of falling over. I'd say that is not too bad with 10 years of damage. I've cut most of the larger trees but still have a few to cut this winter. Hope to get it done as they are getting to the point of making me a bit nervous. You can bet I'll be looking them over really good before felling. Hopefully, I can get all the big ones and then we have a lot of little trees 12" and under. Those are not much of a concern.
 
As I was wandering through our woods I had to take note of several ash trees that have fallen over. Our trees have been dead for many years as we got hit first around 2002 and have cut many, many cord plus have had others come in to cut also. But they are just now starting to get to the point of falling over. I'd say that is not too bad with 10 years of damage. I've cut most of the larger trees but still have a few to cut this winter. Hope to get it done as they are getting to the point of making me a bit nervous. You can bet I'll be looking them over really good before felling. Hopefully, I can get all the big ones and then we have a lot of little trees 12" and under. Those are not much of a concern.
Sav what are you getting for regrow, young ash?

zap
 
Almost nothing yet zap. Only found a couple young sprouts. I do hope they come back though. Won't help me but will someone else.
 
Most of mine are in a pretty wet area. They are rotting from the bottom and breaking off at the stump. Should have most of the usable small stuff out this winter. There are some bigger ones that are going to be a little tricky.

On a good note, I'm seeing a fair amount of honey locust coming on. One of them stabbed me the other day.
 
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We have quite a few very large dead ash trees on our property, the ones closer to the house make me a bit nervous, they tend to lean quite a bit towards the house and are very tall, will be calling a tree service for those, the largest one out back i will try to tackle but makes me a little nervous as its trunk is very rotten.
 
Dennis,
All of the Ash in my stacks came from Oakland County (SE MI for other readers). Many of the trees were already on the ground or leaning.
When I first moved to this area in the 70's Ash was plentiful, but Ash is getting harder to find dead or alive! It is a shame to see these mature trees all fall prey to a little bug. Here is a photo inside the bark of the last tree that I cut up. I only had 2 Ash trees on my 1 acre and they are gone. I can only imagine how you feel.
Take care,
Tim

DSCF3040.JPG
 
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It's a shame. I only hope they can figure out something to do for the Ash. I planted a DED resistant American elm a few years ago and am going to try to root some cuttings with rooting hormone this year so I can help spread the tree around. I'm really excited about the re-introduction of the American chestnut coming up.

There are two strains out now that are resistant to the blight. One is a cross with the Chinese chestnut that is 15/16 American. The other is a GMO with wheat DNA providing the resistance. The American Chestnut made up 25% of our forests in the NE and its reintroduction will give our forest a lot of food that has been missing.

Matt
 
It's a shame. I only hope they can figure out something to do for the Ash. I planted a DED resistant American elm a few years ago and am going to try to root some cuttings with rooting hormone this year so I can help spread the tree around. I'm really excited about the re-introduction of the American chestnut coming up.

There are two strains out now that are resistant to the blight. One is a cross with the Chinese chestnut that is 15/16 American. The other is a GMO with wheat DNA providing the resistance. The American Chestnut made up 25% of our forests in the NE and its reintroduction will give our forest a lot of food that has been missing.

Matt
Matt,
Where can I read up on what you posted? You appear to know quite a bit more than I do about efforts to introduce resistant trees. Thanks for the information.
Take care,
Tim
 
I'm aware of the elm and ash diseases/bugs, but what happened to the chestnut?

Blight, killed most all of them, late 1800-early 1900's.
 
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Tim, that road map made in the wood is pretty typical of the EAB. Danged if I didn't find another one down today. They are beginning to rot because they've been dead so long.
 
I'm aware of the elm and ash diseases/bugs, but what happened to the chestnut?

The American Chestnut was an awesome tree. Its wood has a beautiful color, fine grained, and fairly strong. It was used to frame houses and barns along with make fine furniture. It also produced chestnuts which were a great source of food for deer, elk, bears, people, etc. Most don't realize elk are native to the NE, but they were here. I'm going to leave moose out of it because they eat so much aquatic vegetation.

The chestnut was a climax tree. It was one of the trees that was strong enough to grow from the understory and wait until the trees above it died. Most trees can't spend decades in the shade. I've seen in multiple sources that the chestnut made up 25% of our forests. I find it hard to imagine what our forest would have looked like before 1/4 of the trees were replaced, much less one that made up such a large portion of the food chain. I think we'll be seeing it though since the Hemlock is getting its adz handed to it and the beech is getting quite a workout off that fungus.

Anyway, a blight came in from Asia in the early part of the last century and wiped them out. There are still root stocks pushing them up, but the cankers caused by the disease effectively girdle them before they can start producing seeds. The ones that make it long enough to produce seeds aren't having them pollinated.. so there are very few left in the wild.

Those that are left have been quarentined as breeding stock by the American Chestnut Society. This is were the base for the hybrids and GMOs comes from.

Matt
 
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Matt,
Where can I read up on what you posted? You appear to know quite a bit more than I do about efforts to introduce resistant trees. Thanks for the information.
Take care,
Tim


I suppose most of my knowledge comes from Google-Fu. I become interested in a topic and google the heck out of it. Sometimes you can find peer reviewed articles where biologists have published their results, but if you aren't a subscriber or aren't associated with a university it can be difficult to gain access to them. MI DNR would have info on some of them. Usually there is a society running efforts to find the/a cure. A university will be working hard on it. I was talking to a person about the American chestnut being worked on and he said that his school (SUNY ESF is his case) was also working on it. Mostly it's google. For anything I can think of there is a site on Google dedicated to it.

Matt
 
I suppose most of my knowledge comes from Google-Fu. I become interested in a topic and google the heck out of it. Sometimes you can find peer reviewed articles where biologists have published their results, but if you aren't a subscriber or aren't associated with a university it can be difficult to gain access to them. MI DNR would have info on some of them. Usually there is a society running efforts to find the/a cure. A university will be working hard on it. I was talking to a person about the American chestnut being worked on and he said that his school (SUNY ESF is his case) was also working on it. Mostly it's google. For anything I can think of there is a site on Google dedicated to it.

Matt
Thanks Matt,
Hope you are safe from the storm.
Take care,
Tim
 
I don't know what I'm going to do with all my dead ash. I just can't seem to find the time to make much progress in dropping them. I have dropped one large dead maple and one large dead ash this fall and that's it. ;em That leaves me 24 large dead ash, and plently of smaller ones. This is just on my property which is surrounded by lots of woods that is mostly unmanaged. So, no shortage of wood around here.

Ours got hit with the EAB the summer of 2010, so I figure I have a couple years at least before they get too rotted to safely drop and burn. I really need to just take a week off and do nothing but drop and buck. Someday...
 
Waulie, ours got hit in 2002 and we're still not done cutting. The first one to fall on its own was last year. I see a couple more have come down this year but that may have been from that July storm. Ash is pretty good at keeping well for many years even if it lays on the ground.

We had a lot more than you report and it is amazing how much we have given away over the years. I still won't get them all cut this coming winter but we'll work at it. I think Pallet Pete is going to come to cut some for himself this year. He got a little bit last year but hopefully will get more this year.
 
What makes me sick is I have several ash trees laying in the woods that have rotted and became mushy, the sickening part is I can tell the previous home owner cut them down with a saw and left them there ,,,,, crazy. What a waste of good firewood.
 
That is bad Ed.
 
The EAB unfortunately has been very active down here in Ohio as well. On my property I've found ten or more dead ash since I spotted the first dead one in 07. Unfortunately I have a lot of ash on my property. I cleared trees this summer, building a home this spring. Just after felling a dead ash, one of those little suckers landed on my neck! I looked and actually saw about four of them near the notch cut after felling! Once you see those D shaped exit holes and new young branches near the lower portion of the trunk, it's too late.
 
Yup. One "D" hole means all the ash will soon be dead. All mine died within a year because it happened the same year as a complete defoliation due to tent catepillars. We lost a few maple just from the catepillars. It depresses me to think about so I try to go by Zap's sig, "get it before it rots".
 
I hear you Dennis. I checked out the wood lot I've been working off for the last few years and counted 22 more trees to clear out of there. I'm leaving what I can if it's up off the ground and working on whatever is down low where it might begin to rot. I don't want to lose any unnecessarily.

The Chestnut Tree that once covered this land was quite a loss for this country. I think it could be said that this nation was built off the back of the Chestnut Tree. A settler that had a few of these trees could cut some down, build a house, build a barn, put in fences, and burn what's left for heat. The ones remaining he could feed his stock and and his family. Have you ever googled for photos of these giants. It's unbelievable how big they were. I've read stories of them being 10-12 foot in diameter. We have one left here in Northern Ohio in the middle of a swamp up near the shore of Lake Erie I believe in Sandusky county. They organize hiking groups to go back and see it.

Hey Matt, what kind of Elm did you get. I wish I had room for one. The one I would get is the Valley Forge Elm, it is a direct descendent from the American Elm with no influence from the Chinese Elm. I have a theory on why it seems so hot in the summers now a days and it is because of DED. The Elm was used heavily in populated areas to shade houses in neighborhoods. Compared to the trees we all are use to today these things were giants towering well over 100' tall with a huge canopy with large leaves. Entire neighborhoods could be covered in shade by these things, yards, houses and streets. Often you can see that in the older movies. When these things died off it left us without the shade that kept us cool. Think about the shade the Chestnut Tree provided in it's hay day. Those trees towered over the Elms.
 
My FIL has been logging ash off his land for the past few years because he knows EAB is coming and he wants to get something for it while he still can. Leaves the door open for me to find and take all the white ash I want.
 
My FIL has been logging ash off his land for the past few years because he knows EAB is coming and he wants to get something for it while he still can. Leaves the door open for me to find and take all the white ash I want.
Just off the tops, you could have tons of it. _g
I dread the arrival of that borer. Hell, I'm behind in getting the dead stuff as it is. White Ash is one of the more common trees in our woods...
 
There's so much dead ash in Southern Ontario its sad to see them go, but on the other hand I've got so much of it I've been mixing it with my shoulder wood for overnight burns.
 
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