Anyone want to play what's wrong with this picture?
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Lumber-Jack
Minister of Fire
It looks like 3 possible problems there to me. First one is the attic insulation shield is crammed too the chimney by the beam which is now obviously also too close.
There is no collar on top of the insulation shield preventing debris or critters from getting in there.
And even though it's hard to be certain from the pictures, it looks like the hole in the roof is not big enough to give the proper 2" clearance all around the chimney.
Please update us with how this gets resolved.
There is no collar on top of the insulation shield preventing debris or critters from getting in there.
And even though it's hard to be certain from the pictures, it looks like the hole in the roof is not big enough to give the proper 2" clearance all around the chimney.
Please update us with how this gets resolved.
Be careful. Get the inspector to give a detailed, written report of what needs to change and the caveats. That way it is coming from an authority. Let the installer know that said inspector will be returning to inspect the final installation.
Have you done a background check on the installer? Is he licensed or certified?
Lumber-Jack
Minister of Fire
I don't know exactly what that wood beam is supporting, maybe nothing, but I'm pretty sure cutting the clearance out of it would have been a much safer resolution than what I see now.
Lumber-Jack
Minister of Fire
I'm not seeing that. I've never seen a top plate on a 45 deg angle before. Also, most structural support beams will be sitting vertical, not on an angle.
Edit. To me it looks like you could cut the 2" into the corner of that (beam, plate, whatever) and get your clearance without any significant structural or integral harm.
Send him the same pic you posted...Then ask him if he would accept that install in his daughters house.
It's a husband wife team ownership. It's the wife that answers the phone. She is an idiot, and a huge expletive.
It appears that the roof decking is laying directly on top of it. Could it be some sort of gabled end???
Suggestion - don't get into a pizzing contest - at least not yet. Get the full report from the inspector and then gently lay it on her desk and say "it didn't pass inspection". Fix it.
The inspector felt it was an important beam that should not be compromised. Our house was, how do you put it? "Home built". Built by the owner we bought it from. He was an incredible craftsman, and this house is extremely unique. (Not trying to toot our horns, but more his really.) It would not surprise me if things are done in ways you haven't seen before. We take the good with the bad when it comes to the uniqueness I guess.
You are right, it's just hard because we have been through so much with these fools already. OH to go back in time! I just called her to get her email so I could send her the photos so she can check them out herself and maybe run them by the manufacturer of the pipe herself etc. She basically felt how it looks now is irrelevant she doesn't know how many people have been up there since they last touched it. I've had the fire department, code inspector, and this other inspector, and who knows who else! Like some one went up there and pushed it over. Good lord. She claims she has photos of the day they did the re-install of everything correct up there but she won't send them to me. Hilarious!
Lumber-Jack
Minister of Fire
Hard to tell just from those pictures what that bean is all about, but because it's on an angle if you cut into it you'd just be cutting out the corner, rather than cutting all the way through the beam, so even if you cut into it 2" you wouldn't be removing that much material and wouldn't be weakening it very much at all.
My guess is that is exactly how that one issue will get fixed.
My guess is that is exactly how that one issue will get fixed.
Dunno CL - without more pics or seeing it personally, if that is a load bearing beam for the roof, it should be hands off.
He is going to be getting me one.
I did not do a background check on the installer. I have no idea if they are licensed or certified, but based on their work I am sure they are not. We were completely ignorant going into this, which I guess is our fault. I just feel like I can't be an expert in everything, that is what the experts are for. That's what my husband makes good money for, to pay other people to be good at what they do so they can do it for us when we don't know how. I think some one selling and installing wood stoves in homes should only be doing so because they capable. I never dreamed people can just go into people's homes and do it how ever they want, rules and regulations be damned. This whole thing has been a nightmare and completely shocking.
It's not going to happen. There are other issues, mainly chimney height, that can not be resolved with the stove in that spot. It has to be moved. The chimney is still not high enough to be two feet taller than the roof that is closer than 10 feet away, and if we were to take it that high we'd have even more problems at the cap with creosote, and it being that high up makes it nearly impossible to maintain.
HollowHill
Minister of Fire
I would not let those installers or anyone from that company within 20 miles of my house after the jobs they did. I wouldn't trust them to do a safe job. I would ditch them faster than I could say what the wife was. I'd certainly try to get them to refund my money, but I would not, regardless of whether they forked it over or not, let them touch my house. If I had to repay for the install by a competent person, so be it, safety is more important.
I would check this out. If they are licensed, this could be a violation. In the least they better have a business license. Maybe have a 3d party call and ask them if they are licensed and certified installers?
As for the chimney cleaning, sounds like you could use a telescoping connector or just drop the baffles on the stove and clean it bottom up.
Seeing those pictures makes me so glad that I found this site almost a year ago and read, and read, and read about wood, installs, hearths, stoves, etc.
!! I've always been one to do things myself rather than spend someone to do it for me..........................especailly if there are no really "special" skills involved. Yes; I'm a cheap ass! I spent most of last winter gathering wood and tearing out the ZC fireplace rather than do an install like the OP posted.
That said, I did my install right. Proper clearances, materials, R-factors etc.!! I'm not a carpenter, tile layer et.al., but I tore out a POS ZC fireplace, reframed the wall, built a hearth, set tile, set a stove, and installed a chimney and stovepipe. And if I do say so myself, it's probably better than most "PROFESSIONAL" installs based on what I've seen here!! That's really sad IMHO also!
What if her house burns down now and lives are lost..............the insurance covers it because it was professionally installed????? What a crock My install meets every "code" in my area, and then some..........never inspected. In fact, I know it's safer than the POS ZC fireplace I tore out! The OP's is a hatchet job plain and simple........................fitting a round peg in a square hole in other words. Get in/get out as fast as possible and get the check
Rant off
!! I've always been one to do things myself rather than spend someone to do it for me..........................especailly if there are no really "special" skills involved. Yes; I'm a cheap ass! I spent most of last winter gathering wood and tearing out the ZC fireplace rather than do an install like the OP posted.That said, I did my install right. Proper clearances, materials, R-factors etc.!! I'm not a carpenter, tile layer et.al., but I tore out a POS ZC fireplace, reframed the wall, built a hearth, set tile, set a stove, and installed a chimney and stovepipe. And if I do say so myself, it's probably better than most "PROFESSIONAL" installs based on what I've seen here
!! That's really sad IMHO also!What if her house burns down now and lives are lost..............the insurance covers it because it was professionally installed????? What a crock
My install meets every "code" in my area, and then some..........never inspected. In fact, I know it's safer than the POS ZC fireplace I tore out! The OP's is a hatchet job plain and simple........................fitting a round peg in a square hole in other words. Get in/get out as fast as possible and get the check Rant off
Bub381
Minister of Fire
No more fooling around,go deep with this,they already are pee'd you caught em in the act.Lawyers should have this in their hands darned soon.you'll be getting no help from this company.They've risked the lives of your family.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
The beams looks like a horizontal rafter beam. Many old barns were built this way. The decking is made up of various width planks laid over top of the beam resting flush against the beam(s), and fastened to the beam. Many commercial buildings do the same set up with steel beams and steel decking. Don't cut the beam.
Pearlgirl:
Sorry to learn that you were victimized by incompetent installers.
You may wish to cut your losses, forget about the installers and obtain a professional opinion about the purpose of the beam. Most likely, as other posters have indicated, the beam is structural. If so, you have to be careful about removing too much material from the beam. The International Residential Code specifies the amount of material that can be removed from a load bearing member. Since you shouldn't have to become an expert in these matters, I suggest that you consult with a licensed structural engineer in your area.
I make this recommendation under the "cut your losses" category. If I were in your shoes, I would not conduct any further business with the outfit that did the original install.
It may be possible, under the guidance of a structural engineer, to remove some of the wood material sufficient to achieve the necessary clearance to combustibles, and "sister" a steel plate to the beam. Again, I would seek out a licensed professional opinion before doing anything - and before you use your stove.
I wish you the best in solving this problem.
DianeB
Feeling the Heat
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