Quad 4300 overfiring/no control of the burn...Any Suggestions?

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richg

Minister of Fire
Nov 20, 2005
888
Gang,

I'm starting to get frustrated with my 2010 Quad 4300 Step Top because of insanely-fast burning and lack of control over the burn proces. Setup:

-blower kit
-outside air kit
-4 vertical feet of double wall stove pipe, 90 degree elbow, four foot horizontal run through the wall (double wall pipe as well), and 18 feet of double wall insulated stainless chimney pipe
-Stove pipe has been sealed to stop the "hole in the drinking straw" syndrome
-wood is 2-year old ash, red oak and sugar maple. moisture readings are well below 20%

This thing is going through wood like I go through pizza. Yesterday, I loaded it to the gills over a nice bed of coals, and within minutes, the fire was going well. I turned the air controls down, and the fire ketp growing. I completely closed off the primary air control and the rear air, and the fire kept growing. It soon looked like there was a nuclear explosion going on inside the firebox. After a half our or so, the fire calmed down, but it reduced a full load of hardwoods to coals in ninety minutes.

My thought is that there is an air leak on this thing. I'm getting tired of constantly having to reload, and upon reading how Blaze King owners can get 8 hours of strong burns without reloading and 24 hours on low, I'm considering dumping this thing. However, the better half wants me to try and rememdy the problem first before forking out cash. Can anyone offer suggestions? Any advice woujld be appreciated, thanks.
 
Reloading on Hot Coals, is more than likely your culprit. EPA stoves always let some air in, even when you think its choked back.

Is the bed of coals in the stove spread even? And what temp do you let your stove top get down to, before reloading?
 
I agree with you richg, that length of pipe plus the elbows and the horizontal run will limit the draw some what so IMHO you must have a leak some where, DexterDay is correct loading on a hot bed of coals can be a problem but sounds like you have more going on than that.
 
Many EPA's just let in too much air. I have modded my jotul down, which helps a little.
 
First thing to check is the ACC control to make sure it is not stuck open or leaking. What kind of wood are you burning and what size splits?

For a longer burn try letting the coals burn down further. Then rake them to the front of the stove. Refill the stove with good sized splits, 6-9" tightly packed. Let them ignite. Start closing down the air in 50% increments as the wood catches fire. Each increment should make the flames lazy. Depending on the wood, there will be 5-10 minutes between with the air control all the way closed at the end.
 
oldspark said:
I agree with you richg, that length of pipe plus the elbows and the horizontal run will limit the draw some what so IMHO you must have a leak some where, DexterDay is correct loading on a hot bed of coals can be a problem but sounds like you have more going on than that.
Click to expand...

I think he meant air leak on the stove itself. A leak after the stove would decrease draft (gas temp) and adversely affect the burn.

I have the exact flue set-up for my basement 4ft up, 4 ft over (all double wall), cleant-out T, and 18 ft of Class A Triple wall (said yours was double/either way).

My stove drafts like a champ. The only time I had this same thing happen was loading on a Hot bed of coals when the stove was still about 450* (stupid) . Finally did some reading and now burn the coals down and rake them forward. Into a 2" deep x 20" wide x 6"-8" in length (from front of stove, back) .

The whole load was "Cherry Red" and super hot. Loading on coals outgases the wood very quickly.

Could still be an air problem. But 2 yr old Ash on Hot coals, will make for what Gamma Ray calls a "Pucker Moment"!! Been there and done that. And didnt like the outcome.
 
Yea Dex I ment the stove also, with my summit and a straight up chimney 21 feet total it wont do that but have never loaded a big load at 450 so you very well may be correct.
 
If you put a large load of dry wood on a large and hot coal bed, it's going to outgas suddenly and strongly. The secondary air will ignite this gas into a mighty conflagration that clean your flue and soil your shorts if you don't know what is happening.
 
BeGreen said:
If you put a large load of dry wood on a large and hot coal bed, it's going to outgas suddenly and strongly. The secondary air will ignite this gas into a mighty conflagration that clean your flue and soil your shorts if you don't know what is happening.
Click to expand...

Guilty as charged :red: Well, I thought I had this burning thing down, but eveidently I don't. Guess I should wait until the coal bed dies down before reloading. I will look for an air leak as a matter of course, but see that my loading process could very well be the problem.
 
My QuardaFire 3100i was pretty controllable, even if I loaded it with good coals I was still able to control it very well. Actually to get longer burn times at night I used to add 1 or 2 logs right before I went to bed to fill it all the way. Unless they changed the design you must have a leak like everyone else, and you, is suspecting. Is the rope on the door in good shape? Do the dollar bill pull test to check. Maybe something is not connected correctly with the outside air setup? Another silly thought, just in case, re-read the operating manual and make sure you have the controls set correctly.

Good luck!
 
Yeah it is that big hot spread out coal bed with a hot stove reload. We have all been there. Or at least a lot of us have.
 
richg said:
Guilty as charged :red: Well, I thought I had this burning thing down, but eveidently I don't. Guess I should wait until the coal bed dies down before reloading. I will look for an air leak as a matter of course, but see that my loading process could very well be the problem.
Click to expand...
Hi, We recently purchased the Quad 4300 step top as well. Thought we were having burn control issues as well as we were following instructions in manual explicitly. We found that if you reload on a bed of hot coals to not open the back air (the one on the timer). Instead leave burn rate wide open and let the fire get up to temp on the pipe in the burn zone about 450 (and front of stove upper left corner 450) and then start shutting down the burn rate air control. We shut that down to about 50% if we need more heat, if we are signing off for the night we shut it completely down. Burn times are great, a load at 9PM will leave us enought hot coals to get going at 8 am the next morning. On our old Encore I would have to come down in the middle of the night to feed it and would barely have anything at 7 AM. My question now is where should you take the read from for the stove temp. We have one attached to the flu collar and one over the upper left corner of the door. The flu is usually ahead of the front initially but then the front gets ahead of the collar. I just loaded on a bed of hot coals without opening the rear air, the collar now is about 450 and the front of the stove is about 475 and both seem to be climbing slowly with the burn rate at about 50% so I just shut down to about 25% and it is stable. Front of stove was pushing 600 and collar is at 450 which one should I go by ?! Based on the stove front, I just shut the burn rate all the way.
 
Does that mean then that I should not be running my recently loaded stove completly shut down as a norm? Right now both air intakes are completly shut and have been for about 40 minutes the logs are red hot coals with the gases burning off the top.....my stove is brand new so if this is not how I should have to run it please advise. Also, the stove temps are now 510 on the front and 300 on the collar. I would imagine I could open up the burn rate 25% or so without issue, just a faster burning fire. I welcome feed back on how this novice is running the Quad4300 step top!
 
Kristine Patti said:
Does that mean then that I should not be running my recently loaded stove completly shut down as a norm? Right now both air intakes are completly shut and have been for about 40 minutes the logs are red hot coals with the gases burning off the top.....my stove is brand new so if this is not how I should have to run it please advise. Also, the stove temps are now 510 on the front and 300 on the collar. I would imagine I could open up the burn rate 25% or so without issue, just a faster burning fire. I welcome feed back on how this novice is running the Quad4300 step top!
Click to expand...

Sounds like your stove is fine and you are doing a good job running it.
If you are warm why turn it up any?
The OP must have a prob with the stove if he can't keep it in a lower burn.
 
HotCoals said:
Sounds like your stove is fine and you are doing a good job running it.
If you are warm why turn it up any?
The OP must have a prob with the stove if he can't keep it in a lower burn.
Click to expand...
Thanks! What about the differences in stove temps which reading should I be going by for safety?
 
Kristine Patti said:
Thanks! What about the differences in stove temps which reading should I be going by for safety?
Click to expand...
I don't really know that stove but as long as it's not glowing orange you are prolly good!
Seriously stove top of 550-600 is fine..try not to go over 700 to much though. Cheers!
 
When it's going really good, the secondary tubes partially glow orange, no matter what the thermometer says. The stovetop temp can be higher and the tubes not glowing; I know that means the inside has cooled a bit.
The OP describes basically what my QF can go through. I find that packing the wood tighter makes a big difference. I can generally count on the first load burning up fast because I have to pack it loose to get the fire started without smoldering. I worry about regulating on the reload. The overall temp isn't much worry because this is an insert, so the fan blower is always running.

Most of my wood is 3 year red oak.
 
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