Been lurking for a couple of months…there’s some amazing information here…a lot of well thought out solutions. My husband and I could use some assistance and welcome opinions, advice and recommendations. Here's the situation. We need to replace a VC Vigilant, circa 1978, which is cracked. The horizontal flue pipe fits into an 8" masonry thimble through a brick wall into an interior masonry chimney. The measurement from the floor to the center of the thimble is 28 7/8” so the problem is finding a stove to fit. We don't want to reconfigure anything, although as a last resort we might consider adding a course of brick to the already existing pad to reduce the distance to the center of the thimble. We've considered the Leyden, which is 25 ¼” to the center of the flue collar. Also, the VC Encore, which is 23 ¾” to the center of the flue collar. Preference is for a top load…we like the convenience and safety aspect. So it's basically down to these two stoves, with the Leyden the first choice. We have a wooded lot and burn mostly as supplemental heat and as backup when the power goes out. So my questions are, is there anything else out there worth considering that could fit without reconfiguration? We read Shane's post regarding the Leyden…would be interested in hearing more about anyone's experience with this stove after a winter's use. Does anyone have a recommendation of one stove over the other and how to configure the flue pipe to make either the Leyden or Encore fit without masonry work, and will one stove fit better than the other? We’d like to be prepared with a little knowledge before going back to the local stove shop (sells Leyden) and we have reservations about the shop based on some local grumblings and a post we saw on this site. Their estimate for installation is $525…is this in the ballpark? Seems a bit high as this doesn't appear to be a difficult install with the right configuration of flue pipe… or am I oversimplifying? Would appreciate whatever advice you have to offer. Thanks in advance.
Need Advice on Replacement Stove
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Before deciding, I'd also look at the top-loading Quadrafire Isle Royale which is 26 7/16" to center of flue collar. It will give you more capacity (3 cu. ft.)
Why not install a tried and proven stove? My suggestion would be a cat combustor Defiant . If you already have the 8" setup rear vent then the Defiant is the way to go. Essentially a perfect match up of your current flue location The leyden has the exact technology developed by Vermont castings everburn technology.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
elkimmeg said:
Elk
Are you saying that Lopi licenses this same technology from VC? I sort of doubt it...... I'm a bit confused by your use of the term "exact technology". Have you used or carefully studied the Leyden (I have not)?
PYRO
VC are good stoves- you already know that cause you have one. However, you should check out a few things - like do you have a good dealer who will provide parts and service nearby? It may be that the tried and true cat encore is expensive to maintain, so check on the warranty and the replacement cost of the cats...and, more importantly, of the chambers, gaskets and other stuff around the cat. When I sold these stoves, those parts added up to over $500, plus installation.
The cat converter itself usually has a prorated warranty....but check on the other parts.
If you've been hanging around, you probably read some threads about cat vs. non-cat. If you are a 24/7 burners, a cat sometimes has advantages....longer burns, and generally better on very low burns.
Hopefully some users of the Leyden will chime in, however it is fairly new so you may not be able to scare up a lot of 'em.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
$525 does sound a little high for a "stove pipe" rear venting job. However, it's tough to comment on stuff like this from afar. I think the range of such jobs is from a low of about $150 up to high of about $400 - but then again, you may be getting your chimney cleaned also, which is about $100 more. It's typical for a shop to charge a fee of "X" plus the actual pipe used.
bwolfe1
Life of Fire
I would consider having the thimble removed and placed higher so you have more options? This may be done without major expense and would provide you with many more stove options. With the thimble that low it really limits the stoves to rear output or small top outlet stoves. Maybe you could have an estimate of what it would cost to move the thimble and see if it’s worth the extra cost? If it costs $500.00 to move the thimble higher it would be better than spending that money on the install as you could do it yourself with the proper guidance? With the higher thimble your options aren't limited and no matter what stove you put in, it will perform more efficiently with a better draft.
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Todd
Minister of Fire
I've been looking at inserts, and around here all the stove shops are charging between $400-$500 for install not including pipe, parts and even gas milage. Maybe you could do it yourself and look into some local metal/welding shop to fabricate something to hook the stove up?
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
I have to somewhat disagree about moving the crock - it is pretty expensive in most cases - but, even worse, you have often added one additional 90 which negates any improvement in draft and usually turns it the other way.
Then again, buying a stove because it fits is tough - BUT, it sounds like you have a couple of good options as it stands.
Yeah, the price thing is tough because it has been almost 10 years since I have actively installed stoves. We charged somewhere about $225-$250 plus pipe way back....even less before that....but things are different these days. In contracting I've always learned that you should guess what something will cost, and then double it! This is the result of more people in college and less in the trades!
Then again, buying a stove because it fits is tough - BUT, it sounds like you have a couple of good options as it stands.
Yeah, the price thing is tough because it has been almost 10 years since I have actively installed stoves. We charged somewhere about $225-$250 plus pipe way back....even less before that....but things are different these days. In contracting I've always learned that you should guess what something will cost, and then double it! This is the result of more people in college and less in the trades!
Thanks to all for your suggestions and recommendations. One thing I didn’t mention is that our house is heavily insulated, about 1700 square feet. The VC Vigilant had a tendency to roast us to well done in the room where it is located. Checked out the Defiant and the Quad Isle Royale…too large for our application, I think. Also, I appreciate the advice on the price of the install…when the time comes, we will do some serious negotiating. I found a local chimney sweep who does installations for a stove shop…and the guy lives about half a mile down the road…another possibility for getting a reasonably priced installation. We’re leaning toward the Leyden, but somewhat apprehensive about being a guinea pig on a relatively new product. Still, it has most of the features we want and it will fit our configuration. Sometimes you just need to have faith and take the plunge…
PyroBlonde
PyroBlonde
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