The price of firewood

bogydave said:

My wood is worth more than $300 cord.
My thought is anyone who buys wood & thinks it's overpriced;
should go CSS it themselves.

I do.

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Honestly.. I don't agree with you there. I wouldn't sell MY stacks for that. BUT.. hear me out.

I'm a homeowner. Now, I've got a fair amount of equipment. Tractor, logging winch, hydraulic splitter.

Someone selling for a living? Now that's a whole different ballgame. If I had an employee that I could tell to split wood 8 hours a day. Or I had a guy I could pay to run a skidder and gather all day. There's an economy of scale there. I don't feel that all wood is overpriced, but a guy with all the gear can make some money I think. If you just bought log length in the woods, and a processor, conveyor, delivery truck. Heck, maybe even an insulated shipping container and did the kiln thing.. I think you could build up a business.

I guess I don't think GOOD wood is overpriced. But with the crappy definition of "seasoned" (well It laid down as log length one WHOLE summer) is what I believe makes most purchased wood overpriced.

JP

Wood prices are a relative term and are also very different by location. Anything that you have put blood, sweat and tears into will be
more precious to you than something you just bought. I buy some wood from a friend because I have a bad back and he needs the money.
I am also going to hit the woods and get caught up(I hope)now that my back is feeling a bit better. I think he is fair with his wood prices
and I sure wouldn't sell mine for the price he gets for it. I enjoy getting out and getting my own wood, but if I cant...I have no problem
paying for some to keep me ahead of the game. My woodstove is not saving me any money...electricity is cheap here, but I cant make
electricity, gas, or oil...but I can get wood from my own place if needed.

Let's look at it from another angle and compare it to the other major alternatives. These are based on my approximate prices around here and would obviously vary by location and market prices. For simplicity sake let's just figure an average of 20 million btu's per cord of wood.

Electric: Average price including surcharges is about $.11 per kwh. Since a kwh is 3,412 btu's it would take about 5,860 kwh to equal one cord. So 5860 x $.11 = $645 per cord

Propane: Average price is about $2 per gallon. Propane is about 91,500 btu's per gallon. So it would take about 220 gallons to equal one cord. So 220 x $2 = $440 per cord

Natural gas: Average price with surcharges is about $.90 per therm. With about 100,000 btu per therm it would be 200 therms to equal one cord. So 200 x $.90 = $180 per cord

Oil: Average price delivered is about $3.20 per gallon. With about 140,000 btu's per gallon it would take 143 gallons to equal one cord. So 143 x $3.20 = $458 per cord

Now putting a number on it from a business perspective is something I can not do accurately without the numbers. Taking some guesses and figuring the wood is free up to the point it gets dumped off the truck. Guessing the numbers for a small 2-5 man company I come up with about $150-$180 per cord gross on 1-3 cords delivered. By gross I mean with no net profit.

So I would have to say yes $200-$300 per cord is a fair range. And no, I would not sell my wood for that. Around here you can get wood delivered for $150-$175 a cord. The only businesses here that even sell firewood are those that have a large portion of employees that, well to try to keep it pc, have mostly employees that do not speak english. The other people that sell firewood take cash only. So for the most part you can put 2 and 2 together and figure it would take $200+ per cord to be worth it legitimately.

Here in Central mass you can get c/s/d for $185/cord green. $225 for seasoned seems fair, but its only seasoned cuz it was probably cut split in the spring, and sold as seasoned a few months later. I buy green 18 months before I am going to burn it.

suprz said:

Especially if the seller is a tree service, and gets the wood from paying jobs?

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Well. That wood should be cut, split and stacked neatly in my yard for free.

I've been gathering my own wood now. But for the last 2 seasons I've paid $250 delivered for seasoned hard woods. Mostly oak with some maple and black locust thrown in.

When I consider all the costs to handle and process the wood it seems more than fair to me. I wouldn't sell mine for the same because it hardly seems worth all my labor.

It all boils down to what you have more of in any given season -time or money. If you have more time than money, it's worth processing your own. If you have more money than time, it's worth buying.

The price is still $70 a logger cord here. Just talked to the logger I purchase my wood from and will have a load of red oak (11 cords) delivered here is a couple of weeks. Of course at that price I C/S/S and season myself. Still buying logger length save me a lot of time I do not have. I added an addition this summer and am putting in a new Harman wood stove. I also put in a Harman P68 pellet stove for the shoulder seasons and when I am away for a few days at a time for work. (easier for the wife). I hope to cut my wood consumption down to 5 cords or so. Last year I went through 12 cords; winter just would not end and I was heating with an old inefficient wood furnace.

Its been a few years since I've bought wood but at $200 a cord I would never complain. A friend who has a tree service told me he pays over$30,000 per year in liability insurance. On top of this i'm sure he has payments on his cherrypicker and skid steer plus rent for his lot,crew pay,etc.... That's a big nut to pay before he even starts making money. I haven't really tried to put a per hour value on the wood I harvest myself, but I know what my time is worth and I probably wouldn't sell for as low as $200 per cord.

Scols said:

Its been a few years since I've bought wood but at $200 a cord I would never complain. A friend who has a tree service told me he pays over$30,000 per year in liability insurance. On top of this i'm sure he has payments on his cherrypicker and skid steer plus rent for his lot,crew pay,etc.... That's a big nut to pay before he even starts making money. I haven't really tried to put a per hour value on the wood I harvest myself, but I know what my time is worth and I probably wouldn't sell for as low as $200 per cord.

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Amen! There's a lot of cost involved for a Tree service company, lots! Climbing gear, chipper blades, hydraulic oil when a hose fails, and new hoses, etc.. Equipment maintenance for a bucket truck , Prentice loaded, chipper , stump grinder.. Those stump grinding teeth can set you back 200 dollars grinding out one stump in rocky soil.. Even a truck with a good size commercial grade chip box will set you back some good money... Now lets look into getting heavy duty tires for everything! That can be a quick 10-15 thousand easy! Yup, we're making money now.... So firewood returns is chump change! Why would anyone do it? Maybe because they think they're making money? Does anyone ever pay their equipment off and really make a profit? Unless you run the equipment yourself, most likely your employees have abused it to death! So whats a fair price on firewood? I think down the road people selling firewood will be burden with such regulations that almost immediately they will just realize it won't be worth their efforts.. It just won't be profitable... big brother! If you can get your own wood you'll be blessed...

I got a tree service guy near me on CL always posting bucked cords of rounds for sale. Usually it's marginal wood like silver maple, red elm, etc. He generally asks about $70-$100 a cord. I called and asked if he ever cut oak he said rarely which I found odd. He then went on to try and sell me two loads of "big leaf aspen" for $100, said it was easy splitting wood. I am 3 1/2 years ahead and dont need to mess around with any fancy named popal even if he came and dumped it for free.

charly said:

Amen! There's a lot of cost involved for a Tree service company, lots! Climbing gear, chipper blades, hydraulic oil when a hose fails, and new hoses, etc.. Equipment maintenance for a bucket truck , Prentice loaded, chipper , stump grinder.. Those stump grinding teeth can set you back 200 dollars grinding out one stump in rocky soil.. Even a truck with a good size commercial grade chip box will set you back some good money... Now lets look into getting heavy duty tires for everything! That can be a quick 10-15 thousand easy! Yup, we're making money now.... So firewood returns is chump change! Why would anyone do it? Maybe because they think they're making money? Does anyone ever pay their equipment off and really make a profit? Unless you run the equipment yourself, most likely your employees have abused it to death! So whats a fair price on firewood? I think down the road people selling firewood will be burden with such regulations that almost immediately they will just realize it won't be worth their efforts.. It just won't be profitable... big brother! If you can get your own wood you'll be blessed...

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I agree. I think most only handle firewood because a bucks a buck and every bit helps. Plus many places charge to dispose of it anyway.

It seems we are getting off real easy here on the island. Wood is an abundance! Therefore the market can only dictate a cut cord (junked, not slip) for $80. It's not seasoned but for that price, who cares. I still cut my own due to the enjoyment and relative ease of acquiring it.

JustMike said:

It seems we are getting off real easy here on the island. Wood is an abundance! Therefore the market can only dictate a cut cord (junked, not slip) for $80. It's not seasoned but for that price, who cares. I still cut my own due to the enjoyment and relative ease of acquiring it.

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If I could get a cord for $80, I'd probably just buy most of my wood. Near me its $220-250.

Locally I have a guy that sells a cord of mixed hardwood, mostly Oak, for $150 delivered. If you pay him cash he'll make it a generous cord. I usually buy 2 cord each September and I end up with about 2 1/4 - 2 1/2 cords stacked. So far it's been pretty well seasoned, good burning wood. I'd never pay the priced quoted in the original post.

I go through 6-8 cords per year, and a few years back I decided to skip buying it at $200ish per cord green and harvest/cut/split it all myself. I "saved" around $1600 that I used to buy a MS 391, all the safety gear, and other accessories like wedges, axes, chains and files. In the end I saved some money by doing the work myself, but more importantly am now equipped to take care of my entire homes heating needs in the future if things go bad. The work was far more than I want to take on routinely with both my wife and I working full time, but it's nice to know I have a way to shave cost from the monthly budget if I need too.

In my opinion its greatly overpriced around here but there also seems to be a high demand for wood around here as well. but at the same time were the most forested state in the entire country, so wood is not scarce.. People are asking 200 a cord for green and up to 300 ""seasoned"" (and we know its most likely not) Alot of these guys are in the tree service bussiness and have the tools and equipment to process and delievery this stuff easily. I have never heard of tree services giving away wood around here.

If your lucky you can find a tree service that will drop off log length for a fee of 100 a cord.... Even grapple loads have been going for around 120 a cord.

Sixty to 70 miles S of Ottawa, out in the country with tons of wood available, all the wood I have seen advertised c/s/s/ runs $300 a cord. Likely cheaper to hire some to cut for you for a day, rent a splitter for them for the day.

ColdNH said:

In my opinion its greatly overpriced around here but there also seems to be a high demand for wood around here as well. but at the same time were the most forested state in the entire country, so wood is not scarce.. People are asking 200 a cord for green and up to 300 ""seasoned"" (and we know its most likely not) Alot of these guys are in the tree service bussiness and have the tools and equipment to process and delievery this stuff easily. I have never heard of tree services giving away wood around here.

If your lucky you can find a tree service that will drop off log length for a fee of 100 a cord.... Even grapple loads have been going for around 120 a cord.

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I paid around 3 grand for oil to heat the house. I use wood now at 5 cord a yr. $300 a cord would still be 1/2 the price of oil. You can never find oil at the end of a driveway for free. Wood is free everywhere, just have to have your eyes open, and be willing to do a little work.

STIHLY DAN said:

I paid around 3 grand for oil to heat the house. I use wood now at 5 cord a yr. $300 a cord would still be 1/2 the price of oil. You can never find oil at the end of a driveway for free. Wood is free everywhere, just have to have your eyes open, and be willing to do a little work.

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So whats your point? just because you save money doing something means you should still be OK with overpaying for it?

I too am saving a boat load burning wood vs oil, but Im still not ok paying 300 a cord for firewood, when like YOU said, you can get it for free! Which is what I do.

With that said, if wood was more reasonably priced I would probably scrounge less and buy more. The high cost of wood around here and the high number of wood burners around here means difficult scrounging as of late.

My point is, if you pay much less for the same amount of heat, then it can't be over priced. I agree the scrounge is getting tough. Which also means demand is up, so cost is up.

I get my wood from a sawmill $90 a cord (3 dakota loads) 5 min from the house. Since I found this guy I have not cut or split any wood. I burn 5 to 6 cords a year.

We can not compare what we do with professional wood suppliers. They do not chop wood by hand or stack the wood. In Massachusetts they are getting $250 green cord. It cost them most likely $90 if not less per cord to split and deliver.

They could be doing better. They lump everything together now. If they would allow people to order wood based on btu output or wood species. I would pay significantly more for a cord of white oak vs a cord of maple.

Hardwood is $180 a cord here in Pa.
Have never bought any firewood.

going rate here near lansing mi is 65-85 a face chord. No one advertises chords. If you are within 10-15 miles you can usually get free delivery, otherwise another 15-20 dollars a deliver is added. I've called some places that would discount if ordering 2+ chords but the best cut, split, and dumped here for ~2 chords I cold find came out to be 360$ for 2 chords. And frankly when questioned the wood had been cut about 3-4 months ago.

I know the parameters for seasoned wood here are, but honestly I haven't found anyone out of like 20 calls that actually has properly seasoned wood for an entire year at the least except for a local tree service that sells for 260 a chord.

All of my neighbors cut their own wood log length or harvest their own property for the most part in the spring and burn in the winter and think I'm crazy wanting 1+ year seasoned wood. I have 20 acres, but its mostly cotton wood which sucks. I still have been harvesting 1-2 chords of it a year and burn it in the shoulder season as it drys ridiculously fast and burns hot but quick. It definitely decreases my hardwood consumption but is a bit of work for not the best gain.

I buy a dump truck loads of mixed logs for $300. It yields 4.5 to 6 cords of wood. It will take me 6 days of work to process the wood. @ $20.00 an hour = $960. that is a total of $1260. Say I average 5 cord That"s approx. $250 a cord. just to break even.

This works for me as it's my time, but I would not pay that much for wood from anyone at any quality. It's just too much.