Installing 24 volt WiFi Thermostat on millivolt stoves

What type/kind of tsat are you using?

WoodPorn said:

What type/kind of tsat are you using?

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http://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywel...tat-Free-App-RTH6580WF/203556922#.UmcAbvmsim4

pretty much the same one as the OP

As a test can you try just disconnecting that jumper on the thermostat terminals. That will essentially simulate a thermostat satisfied condition. Then if you connect the jumper, you should be simulating a call for heat. If it doesn't work in that test, either some mode is set wrong, or there's something out of wack on a controller.

Does that sound like a reasonable test?

Also, the manual I found for your stove doesn't make any mention of needing a millivolt tstat. I think all you need to do is hook your tstat directly to those terminals (once you verify everything is functional with the above test).

One other thing. Reading the manual page you posted it says:

"This control module is responsible for switching between a factory setting (for auger timing and exhaust voltage) and the control panel settings when the wall thermostat calls for heat."

My interpretation of that is that the thermostat setting on your stove cannot start the stove. It can just switch between "a factory setting", which I'm guessing is a low idle, and the set heat output. This is what is usually called a "hi-low mode".
So tstat is satisfied, the auger and blower will drop down to a low setting, reducing the fire, tstat calls for heat and the stove ramps up to the burn rate set by the controls.

Can you try starting the stove manually, then working the tstat (or simulating it) to see if that's how it behaves?

mchasal said:

As a test can you try just disconnecting that jumper on the thermostat terminals. That will essentially simulate a thermostat satisfied condition. Then if you connect the jumper, you should be simulating a call for heat. If it doesn't work in that test, either some mode is set wrong, or there's something out of wack on a controller.

Does that sound like a reasonable test?

Also, the manual I found for your stove doesn't make any mention of needing a millivolt tstat. I think all you need to do is hook your tstat directly to those terminals (once you verify everything is function with the above test).

Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply. Im not sure what you mean by disconnecting the cable and connecting it back on? sorry
When I take out that white wire and connect the two wires coming from the tstat nothing happens. I can hear a small click sound coming from the stove when the relay calls for heat but it wont do anything else. If i disconnect one of the wires from the stove and touch it back to the metal terminal i can hear it click again so i know its trying to do something.
Regarding the millivolt, i just assumed because thats what everyone says most pellet stoves are. Im not sure how i would connect the tstat straight to the stove.

newtonfb said:

Thanks for the reply. Im not sure what you mean by disconnecting the cable and connecting it back on? sorry
When I take out that white wire and connect the two wires coming from the tstat nothing happens. I can hear a small click sound coming from the stove when the relay calls for heat but it wont do anything else. If i disconnect one of the wires from the stove and touch it back to the metal terminal i can hear it click again so i know its trying to do something.
Regarding the millivolt, i just assumed because thats what everyone says most pellet stoves are. Im not sure how i would connect the tstat straight to the stove.

Click to expand...

I made an edit for something else, not sure if you saw it, probably should have done a new reply, so here it is again:

One other thing. Reading the manual page you posted it says:

"This control module is responsible for switching between a factory setting (for auger timing and exhaust voltage) and the control panel settings when the wall thermostat calls for heat."

My interpretation of that is that the thermostat setting on your stove cannot start the stove. It can just switch between "a factory setting", which I'm guessing is a low idle, and the set heat output. This is what is usually called a "hi-low mode".
So tstat is satisfied, the auger and blower will drop down to a low setting, reducing the fire, tstat calls for heat and the stove ramps up to the burn rate set by the controls.

Can you try starting the stove manually, then working the tstat (or simulating it) to see if that's how it behaves?

Click to expand...

mchasal said:

I made an edit for something else, not sure if you saw it, probably should have done a new reply, so here it is again:

Click to expand...

Ya Ill try that. Il start the stove and then make the tstat call for heat and see what it does and then lower the tstat and see what happens also

newtonfb said:

Regarding the millivolt, i just assumed because thats what everyone says most pellet stoves are. Im not sure how i would connect the tstat straight to the stove.

Click to expand...

The manual says specifically to connect a "12 or 24 volt thermostat". That indicates that it does not need a millivolt thermostat. Millivolt stats are < 1 volt.

newtonfb said:

Ya Ill try that. Il start the stove and then make the tstat call for heat and see what it does and then lower the tstat and see what happens also

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Just make sure you have the heat control set on High so you'll be able to tell when the stat kicks it up.

mchasal said:

Just make sure you have the heat control set on High so you'll be able to tell when the stat kicks it up.

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Ok, so after i started the stove with the thermostat hooked up it looks like the stove does react to the temp. I turned the tstat up few deg and the auger went to a higher speed, when the desired temp was reached the auger rate went low. I didnt really notice the blower speed change but the auger speed def did.

newtonfb said:

Ok, so after i started the stove with the thermostat hooked up it looks like the stove does react to the temp. I turned the tstat up few deg and the auger went to a higher speed, when the desired temp was reached the auger rate went low. I didnt really notice the blower speed change but the auger speed def did.

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Yay!

I do have to recant a bit I think on something I said. Your thermostat does need power, and even though the stove provides 12-24 volts, that will only be available when it's calling for heat. So keep the setup you have.

mchasal said:

Yay!

I do have to recant a bit I think on something I said. Your thermostat does need power, and even though the stove provides 12-24 volts, that will only be available when it's calling for heat. So keep the setup you have.

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Thanks again.
My only complaint is the whole point i bought the WiFi thermostat was to start the stove when I wasnt home and beable to monitor it. I guess I can just split the wires goign to the tstat and also connect them to the start switch. I dont see why that would be a problem

newtonfb said:

Thanks again.
My only complaint is the whole point i bought the WiFi thermostat was to start the stove when I wasnt home and beable to monitor it. I guess I can just split the wires goign to the tstat and also connect them to the start switch. I dont see why that would be a problem

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In the manual it says:

DO NOT:
- Hold the start-up switch down, this is a momentary contact switch and can be damaged if held down too long.

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While what you discuss doesn't involve literally holding that switch down and won't damage the switch itself, it's not the way your stove is designed to work. It would be like you were sitting there holding the start switch down all the time that the tstat is calling for heat. Not sure what adverse affect or what safety features that could be bypassing. I don't think it's a good idea unless you're intimately familiar with the inner workings of the stove and know what will happen.

mchasal said:

In the manual it says:


While what you discuss doesn't involve literally holding that switch down and won't damage the switch itself, it's not the way your stove is designed to work. It would be like you were sitting there holding the start switch down all the time that the tstat is calling for heat. Not sure what adverse affect or what safety features that could be bypassing. I don't think it's a good idea unless you're intimately familiar with the inner workings of the stove and know what will happen.

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hmm.. ya i see what your saying

I'm thinking a timer relay would work. If I set that up to the start switch for only a couple seconds and then cut off power to it.
Anyone know exactly what kind of relay does that? I'm confused with delay on and delay off types.

newtonfb said:

I'm thinking a timer relay would work. If I set that up to the start switch for only a couple seconds and then cut off power to it.
Anyone know exactly what kind of relay does that? I'm confused with delay on and delay off types.

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Maybe this will help: http://www.grainger.com/tps/electrical_time_delay_relay_selection_guide.pdf

No experience with any of this, so can't really help. Not sure I'd feel comfortable with this level of modification personally, but good luck.

Thanks Scott. Can't we all just get along....;-)

In our town you can drop off mercury filled devices at the town garage for free and they'll dispose of them for you. When I dropped off my waste oil I pick through the pile and got a nice old Honeywell for my shop heater.

I have an old DC power supply from an ADT alarm panel that I could use to power your set up. Good write up.

To Don,

My buddy has a rental house in VT and he uses an EcoBee and he loves it. He can monitor the temp inside his place when nobody is there and get a heating guy to fix his furnace when it craps out. He can also raise the temp setpoint before his renters show up remotely so he doesn't have to have someone else do it.

Mommy and Daddy are fighting again.

So just so I understand....my stove isn't capable of starting from tstat but most other stoves are?

newtonfb said:

So just so I understand....my stove isn't capable of starting from tstat but most other stoves are?

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I don't know about "most", but many do. Many stoves have a selectable thermostat mode. They can run in "hi/lo" where the stat switches it between idle and the set temp, like your stove, or they can run in "on/off" where the stat turns the stove entirely on and off. The former uses more pellets and can overheat the house on warmer days, the latter, arguably, causes more wear on the ignitor. Some stoves have some combination of the 2 where they'll run in hi/lo, but shut the stove down entirely if there isn't a call for heat for a certain time.

I suppose it makes sense to use on/off during the shoulder season, and hi/low when it's colder.

I got a new issue now that i have the thermostat. I set it to 70 and it heats the house up to 70 and stays there for couple hours. The problem is after that the stove cant stay in that desired temperature and goes out. When i look in the burn pot there is a heap of pellets in burn pot. So basically when i go to bed and set the tstat to 70, i wake up and its 55 in the house and there is a heap of unburned pellets in the burnpot because the stove couldnt stay hot enough after reaching the desired temp.
Is there something wrong with the stove?

Ok Thanks, Ill adjust the damper and give you an update

Wow all this stuff is confusing. My head hurts..... yet it would be very cool/efficient to turn my temp up and down remotely and timed.

all you really need is something like this to plug in and then run a pair of wires to the thermostat.
http://www.amazon.com/Class-II-Transformer-Approved-MGT-2440/dp/B004VMVDTA/ref=pd_bxgy_hi_text_y

It certainly sounds easy enough.