Location two cool air vents and blower intake?

Both the Fireplace Xtrordinair and the Napoleon NZ6000 have a blower intake which can draw cool air from vented crawlspace or outside wall. And both units require two other cool air vents as well to cool the shell---and these can also be ducted from vented crawlspace.

So the question is---what if one put the blower in the crawlspace to draw cool air AND one also ducted the two cool air intakes from the crawlspace? Is that trying to get too much cool air from a vented crawlspace? All three intakes would be in close proximity under the fireplace naturally.

Has anyone done this?

You folks can tell I am really getting into this woodburning fireplace technical stuff in our planning for a new home!! And your info, suggestions, and help are just what we need. Thanks all

builderbob

Anyone have any thoughts on this, if not actual experience?

builderbob

Thanks for the thoughts guys.

I am not sure I understand the last point about dumping heat by cooling the chimney. Are you against the whole concept of air cooled chimneys in the first place? The air that cools the chimney is outside air to start with. It is not air you have just heated with the fireplace. I don't see how one "dumps heat" as you state.

Also, you refered earlier in your first post on Fireplace Xtrordinair to their reputation for their *insert*. This unit is not an insert but a zero clearance fireplace. Hence the need also for cool air intake to keep the shell cool---so it can be zero clearance in the first place. Same for the Napoleon NZ6000.

Thanks again for all the discussion.

I have reread the install manuals for both the Xtrordinair and the Napoleon, and all your responses. I can see understanding ZC woodburning fireplaces, all the different models, what air is going where, and whether to believe the install manual warnings or the unit brochures on some points, is a fulltime job.

Now, do I understand correctly---do you guys get the same understanding?:
1) Blower is required on Xtrordinair
2) Blower is optional on Napoleon NZ6000
3) On either Xtrordinair or Napoleon NZ 6000, the blower(if used on NZ6000) and blower duct would be circulating air (from either inside house or outside) into the "outer shell" of the fireplace to get heated by going around the outside of the hot firebox, then exiting into the house to warm the house. And the blower simply gives a boost to what happens by natural convection? And this circulation air stream going around the outside of the hot firebox never touches the fire inside the firebox?


Also, I noted in the Napoleon install manual the same "warning" in first few pages to "always operate the fireplace with the doors tighly closed." But later in the same manual it mentions the optional firescreen and open door fires for ambiance. So, same dilema as with Xtrordinair---conflicts between install manual warnings and sales brochures. So that issue is a wash as between the two models. (Perhaps the install manual warnings are boilerplate required by some government safety regs?)

The blower being optional on the Napoleon could give it an advantage in my book. I worry about noise if the blower is installed inside. And if I install blower in crawlspace to lessen the noise, I worry about bringing (letting) too much cold air in the house. Being in the Willamette Valley in western Oregon, we are not in the bitter cold climates, but it can get cold in the winters---this is no Arizona or Florida by any stretch.

I wonder if Napoleon and Xrtordinair have cutaway fireplace models for viewing and studying and trying to understand at their factories.

Thanks again for all your discussion , and anyone else feel free to chime in too, on any of several points.

builderbob

You guys are the best! Thanks for that firsthand info on the Xtrordinair fan sound level.

I did take a look at the brochure and I see it has the damper in the fan blower box. So even if I would decide to mount the blower in the crawlspace, then when not in use, that duct and fan box with damper shut would close off much migration of cold air into, or warm house air out.

I wish Napoleon has such a good cutaway view of its inards.

So, in my (now hopefully) less confused mind, I now see Fireplace Xtrordinair with advantages over Napoleon NZ6000 as:
1) cost----can use AC chimney (and fan blower comes with unit, not as extra cost option?)
2) install cavity does not require metal studs and cement board as does Napoleon---more cost savings for simpler install
3)Xtrordinair gives actual data for burn cleaness and efficiency (Napoleon does not)
4)install cavity does not require vents open to inside of house to keep cavity cool enough for safety as does Napoleon---meaning cavity itself can be fully insulated (which I think is requried for Xtrordinair install anyway)
5)Xrtordinair model has longer field tested history than Napoleon.
6)Xtrodinair gives 2+ years parts and labor warranty---Napoleon gives lifetime parts but only 1 year labor.

I see them both as goodlooking units, and both have large enough doors for ambiance viewing (ie, bigger than 14+" x 26+"
Both seem to have users who have stated satisfaction on this forum.

Napoleon has advantages:
1)allows gravity ducting for heating adjacent or upstairs room areas
2)does not require catalytic converter or associated maintenance or replacement costs
3)uses AC or solid pack chimney. Solid pack chimney *might* promote better draw and less puffing into room (if burning with doors open----irrelevant if burning with doors closed). On an install like we plan with chimney inside heated envelope of house, differences perhaps not so noticable anyway.

Thanks again for input, and if anyone sees some advanatges or disadvantages for one unit or the other I haven't thought of---please post!!

builderbob

The fireplace module will face the living room. On the backside will be the dining and then the kitchen. One end of the fireplace will be about 8 to 9 feet from a wall of the central hallway. The other end of the fireplace will be an outside wall.

I can see perhaps a few disadvantages of a crawlspace mount for the blower. I did have one fireshop person mention an advantage of a crawlspace mount would be it could circulate cool air in the summer. But then again, that cool air could still be musty smelling.

Also, Xrtrordinair mentions its feature of "positive pressurizing" of a home by drawing outside air.

Thanks for the thoughts.


builderbob

Another thing I was thinking about, speaking of outside air and the blower.

Houses are being built so tight now, that the construction trade is starting to recommend as part of the heatpump/furnace systems that people have "heat exchangers" installed which bring in fresh air into the home. They use the same terms of "pressurizing" the home. And they talk of getting the old stale air out and replaced with new fresh air. The old leaky houses of a few decades ago used to do this air exchange adequately on their own, just by leaky windows, doors, ceilings etc. Now the air exchange does not occur often enough, that they recommend the heat exchangers to do it.

I was thinking, the Xrtrordinair could be the "heat exchager" and do the replacement of the stale air with fresh air.

I can't remember all the problems they said were caused by inadequate exchange of stale air with fresh in the new tight homes, but they had a list.

Comments on this subject?

builderbob