BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
You can not completely close of the air on any modern EPA stove. VC stoves are not different or special in regards to this.
2013 VC Burning Thread
- Thread starter jharkin
- Start date
-
Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.
We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.
We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
- Status
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
Burner
Member
So is this gap how they prevent the stove from being completely closed? The stove also has two holes on the bottom that pass air into the ash box. I thought that was the EPA thing.
Burner
Member
On my defiant the primary air flap never closed completely. When I tried to close it, It would spring back to about a quarter inch gap. I replaced the whole thermostat assembly (wire and flap spring). Even after doing that I had to mess with the flap and wire that it hangs on (like a hinge). It now closes pretty well and I have a huge amount of control over it. It still gets air when I close it completely, which I assume is coming from the two holes on the bottom of the stove (through the ash pan holder).
The primary air on my encore closes all the way. As mentioned it is adjustable by loosening the screw in the flap and sliding the wire in and out. It should just close at minimum setting cold.
The minimum epa air comes from two 1/4" holes in the ashpan housing behind the front legs.
The minimum epa air comes from two 1/4" holes in the ashpan housing behind the front legs.
Burner
Member
Hi. My 2550's primary air flap does close all the way. I actually hear it click. The problem is that the flap itself is about 1/4 inch too small from the bottom lengthwise. This leaves a gap when fully closed. Does your primary air flap cover the entire opening or does it have this gap? Thanks!
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
I'm pretty sure on the 0028 the flap closes all the way, but there is still a gap at the bottom, much like the Defiant.
Burner
Member
Strange. My defiant doesn't have a gap. The flap covers the entire opening. The problem was that it had been springing back from closing completely which I fixed.
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
Mine has a gap. It closes completely, but the flap does not cover the entire opening.
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
Burner
Member
About 4 inches behind the front legs in the ash pan holder right up against the side of the holder. You can feel around for them and find their indentations. Use gloves if hot, obviously. 
Excavator
Feeling the Heat
Jharkin - I have been experimenting with the stove last few days and even when I close damper at 350 griddle temp and cat temp on cool if I leave the air open for just few minutes the cat temp does quickly rise. Last few days I had the cat temp at just 600 and slowly closed air supply all the way. The cat temp still slowly rises to 1500 - 1700 and just hangs around there for hour or so then very slowly drops. I have not seen the cat stall yet even closing the damper and air supply this quick. Only time I did see this was with bad wood on my part
Reckless
Feeling the Heat
Upper 20's here last night stuffed full of red oak 9.5hrs later GT 4-500 and a HUGE bed of coals and clean glass. Raked forward and got another hr or usable heat off the glass. Sorry for the constant updates but I really think you guys should try blocking your secondary. I know all drafts are different but I think its worth a try even if its a cple daytime loads. Last time I mention it
Note: I tightened my door latch again (3rd time since gasket change) last night before my overnight and WOW what a difference again. Make sure you guys keep up with your door and ash pan latches!!
grobinson2
Member
I have been following this thread for a couple of weeks now and have it come up as soon as I open Firefox for updates. Please keep them coming. I have been a coal burner for years and use whole house coal boilers (running on corn, prune pits and coal) but just got into the VC stoves and find them fascinating and of course beautiful. We have nine fireplaces to mess around with so I hope to put a different model in each fire place. I am very intrigued as to how you are getting such clean glass? I am burning wood that is five or so years dried (oak) in a VC1945 that I totally rebuilt and my glass will coke up in no time unless I burn with the bypass open. Anyway not hijacking your thread but if you could please provide a link to your stove rebuild I would very much like to look over that as well.
Thanks again,
Glenn
Thanks again,
Glenn
Charles1981
Minister of Fire
Reckless
Feeling the Heat
First off welcome! Secondly please dont buy 9 VC's for my sanity alone
Third does your vc1945 have an air wash system above the doors? If so you have to adjust it. Easiest way I found is to close both doors and reach through the top load and feel how they line up (No fire of course!!) I had the same problem until I lined the air wash up with the air channel above the doors. To adjust mine, they had to widen so I had to remove the screw closest to the door opening, give it a couple turns and screw it back into the door hole. Now no more black soot (for the most part 
) Keep warm!!Looking at the manual it appears it does, though it isnt mentioned.
Last edited:
Reckless
Feeling the Heat
Hopefully no news is good news..... keeping busy tryin to keep my underpowered stove full!! Anyone else get mad like me when you have good cat temps and poor GT and you look and you can see the flames going straight into the cats throat? I get so mad I disengage and rearrange the burnt wood to get the flames to go up and not back 
stupid design flaw!
stupid design flaw!
JV_Thimble
Feeling the Heat
Love this thread. I have one of these finicky stoves as well. I've found it best to 1/2 load the stove. Easiest way to avoid over-firing without too much messing with it. Still too tricky for my wife to operate this unit, though.
Excavator
Feeling the Heat
tricky yes but sure heats up the house. My wife will through just few pieces in as reload and leave it to me when I get home to crank it up.
I thought about replacing the 0028 encore at end of last season but elected to do complete rebuild few months back. Now with the ss insulated liner and rebuild it works better then it ever has since 1989 when I installed it.
I thought about replacing the 0028 encore at end of last season but elected to do complete rebuild few months back. Now with the ss insulated liner and rebuild it works better then it ever has since 1989 when I installed it.
grobinson2
Member
Good morning Guys,
Well it would figure that I move on to some other threads about your rebuild and I figured I would get an email telling me there were updates on this thread. Obviously I was wrong so when I checked this morning I was a bit dismayed that I did not get to try your suggestions this weekend. Anyway, thank you for getting back to me. I do have the end irons in place and have made sure that I do not have any of the burning wood touching the glass or doors. Yes my 1945 does have the air wash above the doors and I am looking forward to trying your suggestion this weekend. As far as filling each fireplace with a different model that is still the plan plus I have a Coalbrookdale Darby (Worlds worst wood stove but one of the best coal stoves) and a few others that will be moved into place when time permits.
Thanks again guys,
Glenn
Well it would figure that I move on to some other threads about your rebuild and I figured I would get an email telling me there were updates on this thread. Obviously I was wrong so when I checked this morning I was a bit dismayed that I did not get to try your suggestions this weekend. Anyway, thank you for getting back to me. I do have the end irons in place and have made sure that I do not have any of the burning wood touching the glass or doors. Yes my 1945 does have the air wash above the doors and I am looking forward to trying your suggestion this weekend. As far as filling each fireplace with a different model that is still the plan plus I have a Coalbrookdale Darby (Worlds worst wood stove but one of the best coal stoves) and a few others that will be moved into place when time permits.
Thanks again guys,
Glenn
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
I load both stove full. Neither stove runs away, but the Defiant likes to climb.
When things start to run away, that's when you have to check your gaskets. All of them.
Last edited:
Ive been away for a bit... cold, snow, kids birthday.. stove going 24/7 the last 4 days
I finally got a chance to get back there and take a picture. My encore looks like it closes completely?
Yeah, I have to keep experimenting. I know Joful uses this method on his Jotul F12, close the damper early and just wait it out as the cat slowly climbs to 1000+ over 20 minutes or so. I had been getting it really hot on big loads for a fast light off because when I tried the wait it out method I would get tons of smoke from the stack.
I also had another one of the mid-load semi stalls (cruising along at 1300 then drop to 900 for no reason). This time I tried waiting one out and it did catch again and go back up to 1200 within 30-40 minutes. I just hate smoking out the neighborhood while I wait. These mid cycle stalls.... I dont know if I have a potentially bad steelcat, or its just that the rebuild has the stove so tight its burning much lower than it ever could before.
The wood is dry, this stuff has been in the shed for 2-3 years, re checked it and its all under 15%.
I am not really seeing any significantly longer burn times, but I am getting a lot better heat, managing to maintain the house at low-med burn with temps in the teens that would have required pushing it hard before. Control is a lot better and I can finally open the air wide on a big load and let the griddle heat up while the cat cools down as it should
(possibly due to the secondary tweak).
the big tell will be how the chimney looks. I'll pull the clean out cap for a peak at mid season after the new years...
I finally got a chance to get back there and take a picture. My encore looks like it closes completely?
Yeah, I have to keep experimenting. I know Joful uses this method on his Jotul F12, close the damper early and just wait it out as the cat slowly climbs to 1000+ over 20 minutes or so. I had been getting it really hot on big loads for a fast light off because when I tried the wait it out method I would get tons of smoke from the stack.
I also had another one of the mid-load semi stalls (cruising along at 1300 then drop to 900 for no reason). This time I tried waiting one out and it did catch again and go back up to 1200 within 30-40 minutes. I just hate smoking out the neighborhood while I wait. These mid cycle stalls.... I dont know if I have a potentially bad steelcat, or its just that the rebuild has the stove so tight its burning much lower than it ever could before.
The wood is dry, this stuff has been in the shed for 2-3 years, re checked it and its all under 15%.
I am not really seeing any significantly longer burn times, but I am getting a lot better heat, managing to maintain the house at low-med burn with temps in the teens that would have required pushing it hard before. Control is a lot better and I can finally open the air wide on a big load and let the griddle heat up while the cat cools down as it should
(possibly due to the secondary tweak).the big tell will be how the chimney looks. I'll pull the clean out cap for a peak at mid season after the new years...
Cold and snowy today, and have been watching whats coming out of hte stack.
Starting from a cold start, got a big load going and lit off the cat. This is 15 minutes after closing the damper, griddle temp ~ 500, cat temp 1200.
1.5 hours later and its clear. Cat temp is still around 1250.
The wood is dry (< 15% most of it). It is very cold today, barely into the teens as these photos where shot and the "smoke" is mostly white. Maybe its just a lot of steam in the cool flue gasses condensing in the cold air?
Only thing else I could figure is somehow my brand new steelcat is bad.
Starting from a cold start, got a big load going and lit off the cat. This is 15 minutes after closing the damper, griddle temp ~ 500, cat temp 1200.
1.5 hours later and its clear. Cat temp is still around 1250.
The wood is dry (< 15% most of it). It is very cold today, barely into the teens as these photos where shot and the "smoke" is mostly white. Maybe its just a lot of steam in the cool flue gasses condensing in the cold air?
Only thing else I could figure is somehow my brand new steelcat is bad.
BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
All I can say is that I can have three stoves going and only the VC stoves will show "steam."
At least I feel a little better that Im not alone. After the rebuild and new cat there is not much more that I can do with this thing, Im starting to resign to the fact its just how VCs work....
Interestingly I see reports of smoke at times during the cycle on the BK thread.
And they get the same black glass as we do... or rather worse.
Maybe its only Woodstock that knows the magic recipe to a clean catalytic burn?
- Status
