I talked to my insurance agent about the insert today.

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karl

Minister of Fire
Apr 9, 2007
1,058
Huntington, West Virginia
I talked to my insurance agent about the insert today. He didn't seem to care. He said becareful they burn alot hotter than a fireplace and create alot more creosote fires. I was thinking, what is this guy talking about. I disagreed with him. He then clarified that alot of people put inserts in fireplaces and the extra heat causes a chimney fire as soon as they light it from all the creosote in the chimney already. I told him I was going to have the chimney cleaned and inspected and then run a stainless steel liner all the way up the chimney. He said in that case you're doing it right. I asked what he needed to know about the insert, and the installation. He said,"Nothing. We're in the business of assuming risk." I ask specifically asked about getting a permint and having an inspection done. He said, "You may need to do that for legal reasons with the city but we don't care." So I asked him if it was ok just to have the chimney cleaned and inspected and then take pictures of the installation if I ever needed to make a claim. He said, "If you want, but it's our job to assume the risk and you're already paying extra for two chimneys you haven't been using." He added, "We can replace your house, but we can't replace your children." I told him I hadn't managed to get anybody pregnant yet, but I didn't want to run in to a claim problem if the house burnt down and an extra $20.00 would have been all it would have taken to keep you guys happy. He said, "You're fine. Just make sure you have a couple of smoke detectors in the house so you can get out."

I was shocked. This is from a State Farm agent.
 
That insert made wood burning much more safe than that of an open fireplace big time! With insert you can "fire" and forget, and go to bed, leave the house or shovel snow!

Make sure you save your receipt too, and deduct it on this years taxes,....I did the year I bought mine!
 
Deduct it on my taxes? Tell me more. I didn't think these things were eligible for the energy credit. What type of deduction are you talking about?
 
karl said:
Deduct it on my taxes? Tell me more. I didn't think these things were eligible for the energy credit. What type of deduction are you talking about?
Click to expand...

+1. I'd love to recoup some of the cost of my Jotul.
 
detmurds said:
Make sure you save your receipt too, and deduct it on this years taxes,....I did the year I bought mine!
Click to expand...

When did you buy the stove? I'm not sure if you mean some state deduction in WA or not, but as far as I can tell, there's been no credit or allowable deduction (for Fed tax purposes anyway) for installing a wood stove.
 
It wasn't under an "energy" name, but I did get some credit on my federal tax form. I had my taxes done by the pros. I did it for the 2006 taxes. (Yes, you couldn't do this when Clinton was president)
 
detmurds said:
It wasn't under an "energy" name, but I did get some credit on my federal tax form. I had my taxes done by the pros. I did it for the 2006 taxes. (Yes, you couldn't do this when Clinton was president)
Click to expand...

Sorry to go off topic, but now I'm really curious - do you know where on the form they took that deduction or credit? I really don't know how they would have put that in there. If you could let me know, maybe it would help other people to get some benefit from it. I could probably help explain how or why to do the credit or deduction.
 
karl said:
I talked to my insurance agent about the insert today. He didn't seem to care. He said becareful they burn alot hotter than a fireplace and create alot more creosote fires. I was thinking, what is this guy talking about. I disagreed with him. He then clarified that alot of people put inserts in fireplaces and the extra heat causes a chimney fire as soon as they light it from all the creosote in the chimney already. I told him I was going to have the chimney cleaned and inspected and then run a stainless steel liner all the way up the chimney. He said in that case you're doing it right. I asked what he needed to know about the insert, and the installation. He said,"Nothing. We're in the business of assuming risk." I ask specifically asked about getting a permint and having an inspection done. He said, "You may need to do that for legal reasons with the city but we don't care." So I asked him if it was ok just to have the chimney cleaned and inspected and then take pictures of the installation if I ever needed to make a claim. He said, "If you want, but it's our job to assume the risk and you're already paying extra for two chimneys you haven't been using." He added, "We can replace your house, but we can't replace your children." I told him I hadn't managed to get anybody pregnant yet, but I didn't want to run in to a claim problem if the house burnt down and an extra $20.00 would have been all it would have taken to keep you guys happy. He said, "You're fine. Just make sure you have a couple of smoke detectors in the house so you can get out."

I was shocked. This is from a State Farm agent.
Click to expand...

That was basically my experience. They were more concerned about the insured value (so adding 3K to the policy) than about the insert itself.

Steve
 
You have the option to deduct state income or sales taxes on your federal tax return. Some states are so lucky that they don't pay income tax so they automatically get to use sales tax. Using the sales tax method you can either use the amount furnished by the government or you can produce a number with your sales tax receipts.
 
JBinKC said:
You have the option to deduct state income or sales taxes on your federal tax return. Some states are so lucky that they don't pay income tax so they automatically get to use sales tax. Using the sales tax method you can either use the amount furnished by the government or you can produce a number with your sales tax receipts.
Click to expand...

Ahhh... now I follow... you are right -you are deducting the sales tax paid on the stove (and any other purchases during the year), not so much as a credit for the stove purchase itself. Thanks for clearing that up - I was rattling my brain last night trying to see where that deduction might have been taken.

Speaking of sales tax, this weekend in MA, purchases are sales tax free.... the retailers of higher ticket items are going to be mobbed!!! My brother sells furnitutre, and I don't think I'll be talking to him until after the dust settles on Monday or so.... I'm sure he's going to be a little cranky!
 
Harley thats a very great deal. I am sure that day in MA is just about as big for retail as the day after Thanksgiving. Wish I had something like that here. Missouri's tax free day is limited to $100 in clothing, computers, and school supplies and it is only available in certain jurisdictions.
 
I beleive the other tax deduction you can take is off the sales tax on the house when you sell it. From what I understand you can do that for trees you plant, or a fence you build.
 
If you run a home based business the portion attributable to heating the part that is used exclusively for the business is deductible also. The little F3CB rang the bell this year on the return since it is the sole heat for the office and the F100 for the warehouse. And the wood at market value.
 
BrotherBart said:
If you run a home based business the portion attributable to heating the part that is used exclusively for the business is deductible also. The little F3CB rang the bell this year on the return since it is the sole heat for the office and the F100 for the warehouse. And the wood at market value.
Click to expand...

Now you got me thinking, BB. My accountant takes that deduction for my home office already--my guess is the amount just went up. Value of the wood? Based on what, $200 per cord?
 
Eric Johnson said:
BrotherBart said:
If you run a home based business the portion attributable to heating the part that is used exclusively for the business is deductible also. The little F3CB rang the bell this year on the return since it is the sole heat for the office and the F100 for the warehouse. And the wood at market value.
Click to expand...

Now you got me thinking, BB. My accountant takes that deduction for my home office already--my guess is the amount just went up. Value of the wood? Based on what, $200 per cord?
Click to expand...

Any costs attributable to your home office would be deductible. The problem here would be the "cost" for the deduction... not necessarily its fair market value. If you are cutting it yourself, and pay nothing for the wood, then your cost is pretty low.

You could probably get away with a simple calculation line: "3 cord for office heat X $200 per cord" and very likely get away with that since you are talking about some relatively low #'s. I can't really imagine an auditor asking for reciepts for the wood in this case, though I've met a few that might.
 
More like 10 cords. I get the wood for free, but I do have to haul it 60 miles (my 3-day a week commute). Three loads to a cord, so that's 1,800 miles. I'll just lay it all on my guy and let him do his thing. That's why you guys make the big bucks.
 
Eric Johnson said:
BrotherBart said:
If you run a home based business the portion attributable to heating the part that is used exclusively for the business is deductible also. The little F3CB rang the bell this year on the return since it is the sole heat for the office and the F100 for the warehouse. And the wood at market value.
Click to expand...

Now you got me thinking, BB. My accountant takes that deduction for my home office already--my guess is the amount just went up. Value of the wood? Based on what, $200 per cord?
Click to expand...

Ours is based on $160 a cord, the price charged by the processor down the road. My neighbor runs her business from home too and buys her wood from the guy. Harley is right, an auditor could give ya grief. The labor isn't deductible but a good arguement can be made for the tangible value of the wood since it comes off of our property. Like most grey area deductions you take it and argue about it if you have to. If a person figured the fully burdened cost of home cut firewood it would probably be a grand a cord.
 
karl said:
I talked to my insurance agent about the insert today. He didn't seem to care.
...
I asked what he needed to know about the insert, and the installation. He said,"Nothing. We're in the business of assuming risk." I ask specifically asked about getting a permint and having an inspection done. He said, "You may need to do that for legal reasons with the city but we don't care." So I asked him if it was ok just to have the chimney cleaned and inspected and then take pictures of the installation if I ever needed to make a claim. He said, "If you want, but it's our job to assume the risk and you're already paying extra for two chimneys you haven't been using." He added, "We can replace your house, but we can't replace your children." I told him I hadn't managed to get anybody pregnant yet, but I didn't want to run in to a claim problem if the house burnt down and an extra $20.00 would have been all it would have taken to keep you guys happy. He said, "You're fine. Just make sure you have a couple of smoke detectors in the house so you can get out."
...
Click to expand...

karl,
I understand that the insurance companies are in the business of "assuming risk" but that risk is carefully calculated. Make no mistake they do have underwriting standards. That begs the question of what those standards are. You may have good reason to be shocked at the information he's giving you and you may want to CYA by sending him a confirmatory email, just so you'll have something in writing if he turns out to be wrong. You don't want to find out the hard way after you have a chimney fire.

My working assumption is that you need to be in compliance with state and local regulations, although that's not absolute, it's just a rule of thumb.
~Cath
 
my ins. co. said the same thing. I'm safer now than with on open fireplace.
 
wxman said:
my ins. co. said the same thing. I'm safer now than with on open fireplace.
Click to expand...

Assuming the insert was properly installed and assuming that you used the fireplace as often as you do the insert that may be true. Those seem like big assumptions to me.
~Cath
 
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