Out of control?!?

A-Team · Jan 20, 2014

Hello all. I finally had a Hearthstone Clydesdale installed about eight days ago and have been learning how to use it. I've been meaning to post some pics and some info about it but a recent death in the family has knocked me down a bit.

Anyway, I came home from work today and put a few splits in it from a cold start. A coal bed formed after the flames died down. I raked them down a bit (they were red hot at the time) and opened up the air all the way. I kept it like this for about a half hour and loaded it up with some big oak splits and a few smaller ones. It flamed up after a good half hour or so and I started pushing in the air intake (this unit only has one lever). As the temp climbed and the flames were getting bigger I kept pushing in the primary until I had nothing but lazy secondary burns which were really something to see. I also have the fan on high, which usually cools it down after a little bit. But then it started taking off again and the temps kept going above 600. I closed the primary air all the way and it hasn't slowed down. Everything I've learned so far that has worked to slow and cool it down isn't working. I'm pretty sure that I should not open the door so I'm out of ideas. What should I do??

Treemoss · Jan 20, 2014

A-Team said:
Hello all. I finally had a Hearthstone Clydesdale installed about eight days ago and have been learning how to use it. I've been meaning to post some pics and some info about it but a recent death in the family has knocked me down a bit.

Anyway, I came home from work today and put a few splits in it from a cold start. A coal bed formed after the flames died down. I raked them down a bit (they were red hot at the time) and opened up the air all the way. I kept it like this for about a half hour and loaded it up with some big oak splits and a few smaller ones. It flamed up after a good half hour or so and I started pushing in the air intake (this unit only has one lever). As the temp climbed and the flames were getting bigger I kept pushing in the primary until I had nothing but lazy secondary burns which were really something to see. I also have the fan on high, which usually cools it down after a little bit. But then it started taking off again and the temps kept going above 600. I closed the primary air all the way and it hasn't slowed down. Everything I've learned so far that has worked to slow and cool it down isn't working. I'm pretty sure that I should not open the door so I'm out of ideas. What should I do??

Most people here will tell you to start lowering the air sooner. But 600 650 is good. You will see it will lower down in a little while. It happens to me all the time when I forget to lower the air sooner. Start sooner and all will be good.

transmogrifire · Jan 20, 2014

Open the door if it's too hot. Fastest way to cool it down.

Woody Stover · Jan 20, 2014

Have you got some ash to smother it with?

pen · Jan 20, 2014

Sounds perfect to me. If you were to say things hit 800 and you couldn't slow them down, now we have an issue!

As @transmogrifire said, if things really can't get under control, watch yourself with some ember protection, but let that door full open......... That turns the stove into an open fireplace and the rushing air from the house will actually cool things. Just watch for sparks and stay in the immediate area as long as the door is open! (a hearth rug is a good idea for extra protection here)

However, unless you are getting up over 750 regularly and can't keep it down, then you are fine.

BrotherBart · Jan 20, 2014

What pen said. My stove has just settled in to 600 from its load-up romp to 750 and it will cruise there for a good while.

A-Team · Jan 20, 2014

Phew!! I feel a little better now. But the reason I was getting nervous is that the flame is dancing like crazy as if the air was wide open when in fact it was completely closed. My infrared thermometer was showing "OH" which means is over 615 but not everywhere in the box. Which by the way may. It be the right thermometer for me. I also don't know where to point the thing so I'm shooting it everywhere to get an idea of where its running and looking at consistency over the last week. (Also don't know if it's reading the glass or looking "through" the glass and into the box.) thanks for the responses.

begreen · Jan 20, 2014

Congratulations. Your wood appears to be dry and the stove seems to like it. If you want less heat, give it less fuel.

pen · Jan 20, 2014

A-Team said:
Phew!! I feel a little better now. But the reason I was getting nervous is that the flame is dancing like crazy as if the air was wide open when in fact it was completely closed. My infrared thermometer was showing "OH" which means is over 615 but not everywhere in the box. Which by the way may. It be the right thermometer for me. I also don't know where to point the thing so I'm shooting it everywhere to get an idea of where its running and looking at consistency over the last week. (Also don't know if it's reading the glass or looking "through" the glass and into the box.) thanks for the responses.

Pointing the thing at the glass is useless. What is of interest is the hottest spot of the top plate. Sounds like this IR has a rather low high-end temp reading.

Get so you are comfortable with where that IR maxes out in a certain spot on the stove top with a burn that you consider "high end". If it exceeds the reading there, then start paying attention...... You might even find this to be a spot on the side of the stove, just above the firebrick. Play around tonight and start getting a feel for where the hot spots are, and you can use these as a guide for future burns.

As BG said, it sounds like you are doing it right. Well done!

BrotherBart · Jan 20, 2014

You aren't going to learn anything aiming an IR thermo at the glass or the fire. What you want to know is the temperature of the top of the insert itself.

Dix · Jan 20, 2014

A-Team said:
Phew!! I feel a little better now. But the reason I was getting nervous is that the flame is dancing like crazy as if the air was wide open when in fact it was completely closed. My infrared thermometer was showing "OH" which means is over 615 but not everywhere in the box. Which by the way may. It be the right thermometer for me. I also don't know where to point the thing so I'm shooting it everywhere to get an idea of where its running and looking at consistency over the last week. (Also don't know if it's reading the glass or looking "through" the glass and into the box.) thanks for the responses.

Sounds like you're burning seasoned wood, and the stove is doing what it's supposed to do.

Nice job !!

How much more seasoned fire wood do you have?

pen · Jan 20, 2014

Doing The Dixie Eyed Hustle said:
How much more seasoned fire wood do you have?

It's nice to see someone with seasoned wood and a concern that the fire might be too much, especially when oak is mentioned! Once an individual gets a taste of the good stuff, there is no substitute.

Dix · Jan 20, 2014

pen said:
It's nice to see someone with seasoned wood and a concern that the fire might be too much, especially when oak is mentioned! Once an individual gets a taste of the good stuff, there is no substitute.

Ya got dat right, Pen !

molly1414 · Jan 21, 2014

You need to locate where your rear secondary air comes in on your stove. Most of the time there will be either a hole on the bottom of the stove at the rear or holes on the corners. When your stove has cooled off see if you can locate where this is. If the stove gets a little out of control you can use some tin foil to cover part of the air Intake and get control of the fire. Your primary air control will not let you close off the intake all the way.

etiger2007 · Jan 21, 2014

I welcome 700 degree temps its when I hit 800 I start watching it close. Welcome to wood burning.

BobUrban · Jan 21, 2014

The only concern is that you have a stone stove I believe and they do not like the top temps as high as the steel stoves. I have not burned one but many here do that will be along to mention suggestions. Look to your manual for manufacturer high temps and try to keep it below that by closing the air sooner.

Nice stove BTW - I think Hearthstone stoves are the best looking available but too pricy for my budget. Post some pics of your stove and hearth.

begreen · Jan 21, 2014

The OP's Clydesdale is a steel and castiron insert with a stone liner if I remember correctly. Most folks report it running in the 600-650F range.

lindnova · Jan 21, 2014

How tall is your chimney? Inside or outside? Type?

I have had similar problems on my PE Spectrum. The max temperature is different for every stove in location etc. I measure mine 18" up with a probe in the double wall pipe. I was having problems with it going nuclear - up to 1500° in the flue -yes had some cherry red on top of stove. My stove would read 600° on the top front corners though. On a reload, I would load on the coal bed that had burned down and no matter how early I would turn it down it would eventually work its way up to high temps with the secondaries going crazy. I couldn't get a burn to go overnight with any decent amount of coals and ended up using it with small loads only for a while. I ended up modifying it by bending the stop to allow me to turn it down more which works great. Now I can load full with oak and after it gets going turn it down to where it is all shut and it will burn the flue temp up to 850° for an hour and then cruise and last all night with good coals left over. When the tall chimney gets warmed up it is a lot of draft. Sure does suck & whistle the air thu the shutoff plate gaps. The EPA stoves do not allow turning down all the way for emission reasons. By the way, I have a 28 ft chimney stove to top that is run up thru the house in a chase. I did try the foil tape as Moly1414 said, but I couldn't access the secondary shutter in back, so it was useless at slowing the upside down fire down.

I have opened the door and that usually works to cool it down, but sometimes it almost seemed to rage worse even though the flue temp does go down, but when the door is shut it would heat right back up with all the hot air and less velocity.

Here is an article worth reading I found on this site. I would find out what your flue temps are and go from there if it is getting too hot. I wouldn't recommend modifying your stove yourself if you had it installed by a pro. They should be able to help you out if you have issues. Good luck! http://www.gulland.ca/florida_bungalow_syndrome.htm

A-Team · Jan 21, 2014

Doing The Dixie Eyed Hustle said:
Sounds like you're burning seasoned wood, and the stove is doing what it's supposed to do.

Nice job !!

How much more seasoned fire wood do you have?

Dixie, I have about a 60-70 ft x 18" x 6' pile that was three big oak, one big maple and two smaller cherry trees that's been cut, split, stacked and sitting since April 2013. I'm guessing its seasoning pretty well because of the heat and temps I'm getting out of it. I'm hoping hat I have two years worth of wood.

begreen said:
The OP's Clydesdale is a steel and castiron insert with a stone liner if I remember correctly. Most folks report it running in the 600-650F range.

Yes Begreen, you are correct. The manufacturers guide says "The surface temp on the top front of the insert (firebox body under the grill) should not routinely exceed 600...". I don't think I read this correctly when I first read this because I thought the internal temp should not get that high. lol The reality is that I have never seen the spot that they are taking about exceed 350. I guess it can handle more. I feel silly now.

BobUrban said:
The only concern is that you have a stone stove I believe and they do not like the top temps as high as the steel stoves. I have not burned one but many here do that will be along to mention suggestions. Look to your manual for manufacturer high temps and try to keep it below that by closing the air sooner.

Nice stove BTW - I think Hearthstone stoves are the best looking available but too pricy for my budget. Post some pics of your stove and hearth.

BobUrban- here is a pic of everything as it is now. I'm in the tail end of a renovation and this is my crown jewel. Here's a pic of what it looked like before I started the renovation as well. I like it much better now. Click on the thumbnail and it will enlarge so you can see the whole photo.

I have a lot to learn, but I'm having fun along the way. By the way, its nice to hear my wife saying that its getting too hot in the house - I've never heard her say that, literally or figuratively lol - last night the house was a steady 75!!

bsruther · Jan 21, 2014

Very nice looking rebuild. The floor looks great too. What kind of stain did you use on it?

BobUrban · Jan 21, 2014

Very nice! I like that a lot and I stand corrected on my stone stove prediction. I was just assuming it was a soapy.

Fortunately others are much more savvy than I on here - I didn't even know Hearthstone offered an insert. Never stop learning here on Hearth.

mstoelton · Jan 21, 2014

Very Nice Clydesdale build.

I am in the process of installing Clydesdale #2 with a white marble hearth and hearth extension. The fireplace and hearth date back to 1964.

OldLumberKid · Jan 21, 2014

A-Team said:
BobUrban- here is a pic of everything as it is now. I'm in the tail end of a renovation and this is my crown jewel. Here's a pic of what it looked like before I started the renovation as well. I like it much better now. Click on the thumbnail and it will enlarge so you can see the whole photo.

I have a lot to learn, but I'm having fun along the way. By the way, its nice to hear my wife saying that its getting too hot in the house - I've never heard her say that, literally or figuratively lol - last night the house was a steady 75!!

Gotta ask cos a Hearthstone Clyde is on my wish list -- is the white material surrounding the marble wood or some other material? (As I try to figure out what clearances in my fireplace are from exactly which part to what to exactly which other part)

A-Team · Jan 22, 2014

lindnova said:
How tall is your chimney? Inside or outside? Type?

I have had similar problems on my PE Spectrum. The max temperature is different for every stove in location etc. I measure mine 18" up with a probe in the double wall pipe. I was having problems with it going nuclear - up to 1500° in the flue -yes had some cherry red on top of stove. My stove would read 600° on the top front corners though. On a reload, I would load on the coal bed that had burned down and no matter how early I would turn it down it would eventually work its way up to high temps with the secondaries going crazy. I couldn't get a burn to go overnight with any decent amount of coals and ended up using it with small loads only for a while. I ended up modifying it by bending the stop to allow me to turn it down more which works great. Now I can load full with oak and after it gets going turn it down to where it is all shut and it will burn the flue temp up to 850° for an hour and then cruise and last all night with good coals left over. When the tall chimney gets warmed up it is a lot of draft. Sure does suck & whistle the air thu the shutoff plate gaps. The EPA stoves do not allow turning down all the way for emission reasons. By the way, I have a 28 ft chimney stove to top that is run up thru the house in a chase. I did try the foil tape as Moly1414 said, but I couldn't access the secondary shutter in back, so it was useless at slowing the upside down fire down.

I have opened the door and that usually works to cool it down, but sometimes it almost seemed to rage worse even though the flue temp does go down, but when the door is shut it would heat right back up with all the hot air and less velocity.

Here is an article worth reading I found on this site. I would find out what your flue temps are and go from there if it is getting too hot. I wouldn't recommend modifying your stove yourself if you had it installed by a pro. They should be able to help you out if you have issues. Good luck! http://www.gulland.ca/florida_bungalow_syndrome.htm

Thanks linnova, interesting reading. I live in a single story "L" ranch. The liner is approx. 18' long and the chimney is inside my attached garage, so that definitely helps. I guess that makes sense that the EPA wont allow you to completely turn down the air.

OldLumberKid said:
Gotta ask cos a Hearthstone Clyde is on my wish list -- is the white material surrounding the marble wood or some other material? (As I try to figure out what clearances in my fireplace are from exactly which part to what to exactly which other part)

OldLumberKid - the marble surround is actually Super White aka White Fantasy quartzite which came from the same slabs as our kitchen counter tops (I've been told that its harder that granite but with the look of marble - who really knows). The mantle is poplar custom made by a co-worker who does wood working on the side. The whole thing came out exactly as my wife and I imagined. I had to jack hammer and sledge the original hearth and façade (circa 1968ish?). The only thing left now is crown and base molding and paint. I'm so burnt out from this project I've been working on this reno since March 2013!!

A-Team · Jan 22, 2014

OldLumberKid - This wasn't easy to do I must say considering that I never did anything like this before. The firebox and the hearth are off, if you look close in the pic you will see that I had to have the stone fabricator cut me a filler after his install when we decided to with the Clydesdale. If I was home when he measured everything I probably would have caught that and had him add 1 1/4 inches to the sides of the hearth to make everything even. Because of this difference, I almost went with the Fireplace X flush mount shadowbox because it may look better "floating". But this quick filler fix will do and it doesn't look horrible with the Clyde sticking out. I didn't want to break up the hearth just for this. Way too costly. I'm glad I went with this unit.

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