january-february heating cost

woodgeek said:

As I understand it a lot of Q Hydro goes south, but wholesale to the NY/CT utilities.

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Interesting. We sell a lot of Hydro but to a smaller market and we are always told that they have to remain competitive and that's why we pay as much as we do here, considering we have it. I have always read that we sell it for the same or cheaper to the US to remain competitive.

Someone is making a lot of money.

Not to get too OT, but it seems that in PA the power is priced at 7-9 cents/kWh, and the rest (about 4-5 cents) is delivery. I think one reason the NYC price is so high is they say the infrastructure/delivery is much more expensive. So Hydro is prob getting <9 cents/kWh for what it ships south.

woodgeek said:

Not to get too OT, but it seems that in PA the power is priced at 7-9 cents/kWh, and the rest (about 4-5 cents) is delivery. I think one reason the NYC price is so high is they say the infrastructure/delivery is much more expensive. So Hydro is prob getting <9 cents/kWh for what it ships south.

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Ok, that actually makes more sense. It fits with what they are telling us here as far as the 7-9 cents goes. So NYC /CTmakes some money on the so-called delivery. All that being said, insulate, insulate and insulate some more. Fix all your leaks. It isn't going to get cheaper.

parthy said:

I do compost, but that much overwhelms even my ability to compost. I just have to find a way to get it to our local dump, they have a huge composting station. The problem is, I used black garbage bags and they won't cart it away unless it is in paper or see through composting bags and they are costly. A first world problem for sure.

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Can you get a trash compactor,,,,make bricks and burn them in the wood stove?

Parthy / Woodgeek,

Are you sure you guys are talking the same number? There's a "price to compare" on my bill each month, somewhere around 8.5 cents, which appears to be only the generation portion of the bill. With distribution, fees, taxes, etc., I'm averaging 16 cents out of wallet, per kWh used.

Parthy is getting a discount for being an 'all electric' house...the all in rate in MB is not 7 cents normally. I used to get 7.5 cents all in in the winter from PECO until recently, nominally because they had to keep the nukes spinning 12 mos/yr and they made too much kWh in the winter.

And I am claiming that the generation price varies less from city to city because it can be traded regionally. But the distribution charge can vary a lot (its monopolistic). Your utility seems high...PECO is running 13.5 cents or so, generation + distribution.

woodgeek said:

My latest elec bill was $408

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WOW! I cried and bought an efergy elite when we hit $72 @ $.155 kwh supply and delivery (highest bill ever by $6). I guess I don't have much to whine about in hindsight.

Oh ya avg. temp of 10f. 1/14-2/14 burned just over 1 cord, 20g K-1, <$5 for direct wired electric fan heaters in bathrooms(toasty toes) for a total of about $250 not counting my time to c/s/s wood. $310 with c/s/s time.

woodgeek said:

Parthy is getting a discount for being an 'all electric' house...the all in rate in MB is not 7 cents normally. I used to get 7.5 cents all in in the winter from PECO until recently, nominally because they had to keep the nukes spinning 12 mos/yr and they made too much kWh in the winter.

And I am claiming that the generation price varies less from city to city because it can be traded regionally. But the distribution charge can vary a lot (its monopolistic). Your utility seems high...PECO is running 13.5 cents or so, generation + distribution.

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Woodgeek is correcto - I get a reduced rate because I am considered all -electric. I am putting in enough baseboard heaters to meet the minimum. However, I expect them to come out and swap out my metre next winter when they see the reduction in useage and freak out. lol Also, I have zoned heat with the baseboards. I have separate thermostats for every baseboard heater with 2 exceptions, the crawlspace heaters are on one and I have 2 in the livingroom that are joined together in one. The regular rate is 11+ cents the last time I paid that, could be more now.

woodgeek said:

Your utility seems high...PECO is running 13.5 cents or so, generation + distribution.

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Here's where I'm at. It's been averaging 16.0 +/- 1.0 cents for more than two years. What am I missing?



You can see where my meter crapped out, mid-November, 2013. They repaired it 1/21, so I'm not sure how I racked up 1772 kWh in the last 14 days of the month, when I normally average 53 kWh per day. Should've been 746 kWh on that bill, unless all of my prior readings were wrong for the last two years.

My listed "cost to compare" is 8.61 cents, whatever that really means.

It means if you found another supplier to sell you power for 7.1 cents, you would save 8.4-7.1 cents per kWh in the future.

http://www.papowerswitch.com/

1.5 cents @ 20,000 kWh = $300/yr, if you like.

And are you PECO or someone else?

I track data like Joful does. usage, degree days, the works. Engineers think alike I guess


Last Dec and Jan where 858 and 1039 degree days here.
This Dec and Jan where 1059 and 1218 respectively.

Excluding our base usage for hot water, last winter we used 538 therms of gas ($650) and about 1.25 cord heating part time with wood for 5235 HDD Oct-Apr.

This year I have burned 298 therms and about 1.5 cord of wood so far. Id guess we are on track to run about 5500 HDD if March and April warm up or 6000 HDD worst case. In the 5 years Ive lived here we have seen from a low of 4600 HDD (11/12) to a high of 5900 ('10/11) so this could end up the coldest winter in this house to date if the pattern continues.

Worst case, I'll end up using about 600 therm and 1.75 cord (I put aside 2 cord for this year, I always like to save the last face cord in case of a long blackout). So something like 20% more energy expenditure due to the cold winter.

EDIT: I didnt figure wood cost, as I purchase some and scrounge some. And dont know how to figure cost of the saw and tools in that. Probably costs me more than natgas so I avoid figuring it out

woodgeek said:

It means if you found another supplier to sell you power for 7.1 cents, you would save 8.4-7.1 cents per kWh in the future.

http://www.papowerswitch.com/

1.5 cents @ 20,000 kWh = $300/yr, if you like.

And are you PECO or someone else?

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Yep, that's about what I figured, when I looked at this during the initial de-regulation. However, what comes with this? The hassle of having to change companies again, when one gets purchased, fails, or changes their rate structure every second year? I'm very much about "zero hassle," and am happy spending $300/year for a zero-hassle guarantee.

jharkin said:

Engineers think alike I guess

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You've got the "knack".

It looks to me like it crapped out earlier than mid-nov.

Take your end of October readings. Take your now readings (figuring out for the new meter, how you do that). From my calculations on your usage, you are pretty close to right on for your price. If you figure on a 1382 usage per month and take it from the end of October chart you posted, it works out. But then I sucked at math.

I take my hydro readings once a week and chart it on spread sheet. I am over this year because of the weather but less than I thought becuase my place wasn't fully insulated till end of Jan last year . Edited because I barely know what day it is let alone the year.