any drawback of putting too large of an insert in?

I think the Summit is a lot of stove for 1600 SF even with 16' ceilings.

atom631 said:

I am leaning towards a PE Summit insert, assuming it fits. From the measurements I took, it will be close. If that doesn't fit then I am either going with a Hearthstone Clydesdale or a PE Alderlea T5

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I don't know the numbers but I'd guess if the Summit won't fit then neither will the Clydesdale. Are you ruling out the Super insert? Same firebox and operation as the T5. You'll get 8+ hours between reloads with the Super/T5.

atom631 said:

My next question, is anyone has an idea of how I can get some of the heat the insert will put out down to my basement?

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Not going to happen. Getting heat to go upstairs is often quite difficult. Getting it to go downstairs is pretty much impossible.

Welcome to the forums !! Always nice to see another LI'er here !!

My PE Pacific does a good job of heating the level (1200 SF) of my house that it is on, if the Summit had fit into the FP (interior chimney), I would have gone with it. With this past winter that we had, I would have been really happy with it, I am sure. The Pacific struggled, but mainly got the job done.

One thing I have learned is that heat does NOT move down stairs. Trust me, I've tried. Another stove is the answer there.

The bigger firebox of the Summit will give you flexibility in your fires. You can build a smaller fire when needed, and pack it when you have too.I don't think it's a bad choice.

Do you know how much oil you used last winter, maybe even broken down to how much you needed during the coldest month? Using those numbers you can estimate how much stove you need.

In any case, wood is not like oil that comes delivered in a burnable state at moments notice. Your wood needs to be dry which usually requires to have it split and stacked in your yard for one to three years. Did you already get several cords?

Grisu said:

Do you know how much oil you used last winter, maybe even broken down to how much you needed during the coldest month? Using those numbers you can estimate how much stove you need.

In any case, wood is not like oil that comes delivered in a burnable state at moments notice. Your wood needs to be dry which usually requires to have it split and stacked in your yard for one to three years. Did you already get several cords?

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Given this bit, I'd also point out that a larger firebox gives you a lot of freedom to manage heat output. For example, with ideal wood my 30 will heat pretty much all 2700sf of my house, but if the wood is subpar (read- not as dry as it needs to be), the 30's big firebox allows me to supplement with BioBricks or similar and still stay warm. A smaller box would not give you this freedom.IMHO, there's almost no such thing as "too big" a stove. You can build a smaller fire in a bigger box, but absolutely not the other way around.

atom631 said:

Doing The Dixie Eyed Hustle said: ↑
Welcome to the forums !! Always nice to see another LI'er here !!

Great seeing another LI'er here. Where did you purchase your PE? I am working the folks over at Main Street Fireplace in Patchogue. They seem very nice and willing to work with me.

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From the same place. I was happy with the deal, etc.

Start getting firewood NOW. What is usually advertised here as seasoned, is really not. Get it, and get it stacked, with a lot of air flow.

bluedogz said:

there's almost no such thing as "too big" a stove. You can build a smaller fire in a bigger box, but absolutely not the other way around.

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+1 to that blue.

If an 8" liner would fit through my existing chimney, the first line of my signature would look a little different

atom631 said:

Looking over my oil bill - I got my first fill in this house on 11-25. Between then and right now, I have used 720 gallons. I am sure the oil company will be by here any day to give me more. I would say a safe number is 850 gallons between 11-25 and 5-25. I will probably use around 1100-1200 gallons for the year. How can I use this number to determine what size stove?

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BeGreen already gave you the result but to show you how to get to that number:
One gl oil = 140,000 BTU. Oil boiler at 80% efficiency = 112,000 BTU of heat per gallon. It sounds like you have oil hot water, so let's assume you used 700 gallons for heat this winter. 700 gl * 112,000 BTU = 78.4 million BTU
For the wood: 1 cord mixed hardwood approx. 23 mill. BTU, burned at 70% efficiency equals 16.1 mill. effective BTU per cord.
78.4 divided by 16.1 = 4.9 cords
Given that this winter was rather cold, you may need only about 4 cords in a "normal" winter. I would still try to get 5 cords for the next one. Does not hurt to have more; any wood left can be burned the following year. When you need to burn 4 to 5 cords per winter, a stove with a 3 cu ft firebox sounds about the right size. If the Summit should not fit, I would not recommend the T5 and even the Clydesdale may be slightly on the short side although would probably still work for you. Check back if you have problems with the install of the Summit as we can probably point you to another large insert that will fit. Some tips for the install:
- For an exterior chimney an insulated liner is almost a must. Draft will be better and you will get less accumulation of creosote.
- For retaining the heat, have a block-off plate installed: https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/make-a-damper-sealing-block-off-plate/ Stuff also first some Roxul insulation up there, before putting the plate in.
- You may not have enough space, but putting some Roxul behind and next to the insert may reduce your heat-loss to the outside: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/finally-got-around-to-insulating-my-fireplace.75755/
- Have you talked to your insurance company yet? Most are ok with inserts but it should be put into your policy. They may also require an inspection of the install.
- How tall is your chimney? I think the Summit requires 15 ft although you may get away with less. I have only 13 ft for its smaller brother the Super and the draft is fine. Still, you don't want to go much below that.

I have around 3/4 of a cord that I bought last year in hopes to use it in my fireplace...but stoking the fire every 10 minutes was annoying. As for purchasing cords - Im not sure if this is for every area, but here on LI many people offer pre-aged wood that is usually 2+ years old. Either way I have a really good hook for great wood for very cheap.

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It is rare that firewood sellers really sell seasoned wood. Most of the time they have only logs sitting there and cut and split them as needed. However, that wood (although often advertised as "seasoned") is still as wet as the day the tree was felled. In order to dry, the wood has to be split and stacked in a sunny and windy location for one to three years depending on the wood species. When calling around, ask how long the wood has been cut, split and stacked in the open. I doubt you will find a place that has done that for more then a few months at best. In any case, I would suggest getting the wood now, to stack it up in your yard. Ask specifically for ash as that has a relatively low moisture content to begin with. Covering the top, single rows, loose stacking to allow lots of air movement and splitting thick pieces smaller will help. Should it not be quite ready next winter, you can supplement with compressed wood logs like Ecobricks or Biobricks or dried wood like lumber scraps.

It would also not hurt to get the wood for the following winter (2015/16) already that it has time to dry over two summers. Some dense species like oak need two to three years to achieve the desired 20% or less moisture content.

Don't take the importance of dry wood too lightly. Most of the problems that people new to burning wood have are due to wet wood.

You don't need to bake yourself out of that room since you will control the amount of heat the insert will put out. Just load less wood and burn only two times a day and you will be fine. Now, that is not the most efficient way of using the insert and you are spending extra money on something you may not really need. If you think that maybe 1/4 of your oil heat went to the basement, you will only need to burn about 3 to 3.5 cords in a normal winter. For that a larger medium-sized insert would probably be enough. The Hearthstone Clydesdale would fall into that category, the Enviro 1700 series (many happy owners here), or the Osburn 2000 or Matrix (ditto). A new model would be the PE Neo 2.5, which uses the same baffle design as the Summit.

For heat distribution you can try the CAC and I doubt its power consumption will be high enough to reduce savings from replacing the oil heat considerably. A small fan at the end of a corridor on the floor blowing cold air towards the stove room can also help getting a convective loop going. That power consumption will be hardly noticeable in your electricity bill.

When the wood gets delivered, split a few pieces in half and press the electrodes of a moisture meter into the fresh surface along the grain. For truly seasoned wood it should read below 20%, although if it is below 30% you may get it there drying it during the summer.

If you are definatley going to do this, get the firewood NOW. and get it stacked so it has time to season.

This is mucho importante!!

I just looked at your picture.... those 2 ceiling fans set on "down" will move the heat down into the room, thus helping it get down the hallway & to the other bedrooms. It takes time for the warm air to move through the house, and also to get the thermal mass of the house warm.

Give us a floor plan, please.

Plain, drawn out on paper, will work.

Get your firewood !

Insulation does not block air flow.
Insist the block off plate be installed.

Bigger is better if your relying on an insert to heat your home 24/7 in the winter, anything less, you will be kicking yourself......

In response to the OP title, yes there are drawbacks to going too big. Having to choke down your stove all the time creates additional creosote, in addition to often being too hot in your house, especially during shoulder season. Picking the right size stove for your application is a lot better than a stove that's too large or small that you're often trying to compensate with.

begreen said:

Choosing a "right size" stove is a bit more difficult, particularly if one lives in an area with a wide outdoor temperature range or one has a house that has a high heat loss. A 2 cu ft stove may work fine for the 15-40 range, but need supplemental heat when it gets below 15. Some folks don't have a backup source or refuse to use it. A 3 cu ft stove may need a smaller fuel load for the 35-40 range, but can be ideal for the 0-35 range. The main difference is that with good dry wood one can run the 3 cu ft stove like a 2 cu ft stove by simply loading in less fuel. The reverse is not true with a smaller stove. I know, we tried it before finally going to a larger stove. Now if the installation is in an area where the average winter outdoor temperature range was between 30-50, then yes, one would probably be choking down the stove a lot. But for most people here, that is not the case.

Another variable that requires a stove capable of a wide range of output is a home that has a high heat loss. This is our case. We live in an old farmhouse with too much glass area. Houses with cathedral ceilings (higher cu ftg to heat), with poor sealing, low insulation, etc. can also need a larger reserve capacity. It's a myth is that the stove will need to be choked down all the time. This is either a fault of the installation (poor draft) or the person running the stove. When conditions don't warrant the full output of the stove just load less wood. Our 3 cu ft stove runs quite cleanly on 4-5 splits which is about 1/3 its capacity. This is how we run it in milder weather. When the house is warm enough we simply let the fire go out. The flue stays clean, there's good secondary burn and there's no smoke is coming from the chimney. We have friends that heat a smaller, well insulated home with the same 3 cu ft firebox, 24/7. This is their sole source of heat. The electric furnace has been turned off for the past 2 years. They do a brisk morning fire burning a partial load during the shoulder season and then let the stove go out. We just cleaned their chimney for the first time in 2 yrs and got about a cup of soot.

Some other things that will affect the appropriateness of a larger stove are room/area size, convective or radiant stove, the ability for heat to easily convect throughout the house. In a small room that only has a single door a large stove could be overwhelming, regardless of home size. But the same stove in a house with a more open floorplan it could be fine.

So, while I agree that go large is not always the best advice, there are many cases where it is a good decision, particularly for those that live in a northern climate or that have a less than ideally insulated house. If the house is very well insulated and the heat loss is low, then a smaller heat source or a stove that can consistently put out a low amount of heat cleanly, will be a better fit. This could be a cat stove, particularly if the goal is to heat 24/7.

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Welcome to the forum 631. When I was looking this was the same advice begreen gave me, and it was sound advice. I heat about 1700sf with a 3.2 cf beast of an insert. I usually only have to fill the firebox partially, but love the extra firepower when it's super cold. This past winter I was so glad to have the extra capacity in the firebox. We burn 24/7 and do not ever need to turn run the oil burner. To be honest, we do run the oil burner once in a while if my wife is too busy, or just doesn't feel like loading the stove before I get home from work. But if we both were super diligent, we would never need to run the boiler. The 3.2 cf insert can keep our house above 70 even in the sustained cold we had this past winter. I hope that's helpful. Regardless of which unit you get, I'm sure you'll get weirdly addicted to wood burning. Good luck!

I'm in a similar situation with the blockoff plate. My retailer/installer both insisted it wouldn't be necessary, but they said they would do it for a little extra $$ and experts here all seem to swear by them. Long story short- I'm almost certain I'm going to have them do it for the marginal cost difference. The installer was tossing around numbers like $100 and at that price it seems like I'd be foolish not to have it taken care of. It may not be necessary, but if it's impact and inexpensive then it's an easy decision.

Side note - I just looked at your picture again and had a thought - anyone care to weigh in on the proximity of the TV to the fireplace? Will that be an issue?