I'm looking at installing a pellet boiler and the Kedel seems much more maintenance friendly than the Okofen so I am leaning in that direction. Does anyone have experience with vacuum feeding the Kedel? Most people I've seen on here are using the bin and auger feed. The Okofen seems to vacuum feed with little issue. I'm hoping the Kedel does as well.
Kedel Vacuum feed.
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Tim04757
New Member
Sorry coalburner, can't help you with the vacuum system as I use the 700 lb hopper. As for the maintenance of Kedel, there is very little, and it's very simple. I've considered going with the vacuum but with my installation I can easily store enough pellets for the winter and I can buy bagged 20% cheaper than bulk, so I'll hold off on the bulk for now.
velvetfoot
Minister of Fire
What method is utilized for the vacuums filters when they get clogged with fines. All my shop vacs have this issue with saw dust as well as drywall dust and I have to remove filters and blow out or wash. Seems I remember a shop vac with a filter beater built in.Do the boiler vacs have this feature?
PassionForFire&Water
Minister of Fire
I can only speak for the Windhager BioWIN.
The BioWIN pellet vacuum feed system has no filter bag.
There was not one reported issue for the 2013/2014 heating season in this regard
The BioWIN pellet vacuum feed system has no filter bag.
There was not one reported issue for the 2013/2014 heating season in this regard
sinnian
Minister of Fire
Sinnian, why do you hate the Kedel so much? I do agree the Bio Win is an excellent unit, but I constantly read your negative posts about Kedel or doubting others claims of positive experiences including my own. Do you have a personal grudge with someone there? I see you own a Pinnacle... have you even operated the Kedel and seen it's features to realize it's not that bad Of a machine??
sinnian
Minister of Fire
~In terms of the boilers, all things being equal (price, installation, and who I bought it from) I would rather buy a product made in Austria than Eastern Europe.
~YOU got a heck of a deal on your unit, and until you explained it I had a hard time believing that you got it for less than a Harmon.
~I would not do business with ReVision and/or Interphase.
I am sure the Bio Win is a decent unit but the service is too far away for me to even consider it.
sinnian
Minister of Fire
My oil boiler is at its end of life. Thus I either replace it with a new oil boiler or something else. I'm not going to pay for two new systems.
I turned on the new Bio Win on Oct 5 just shut it of on May5. Once i got it adjusted for the size of building and hot water temp i needed,( Marc came to help me) it just did its thing. I burned 14.67 tons in that period. I vacuumed the fire chamber and pot every 600 hours ( 15 minutes of work) it takes longer to shut off boiler that it does to clean it, and cleaned the heat exchange tubes once ( another 10 minutes). These tubes were barely dirty as the unit does such a great job cleaning them. Dumped the ash bin 4 times. Total run hours 3806. The vacuum system worked with no problems. A few fines at bottom of bin now so i am going to clean that before next year. Not sure why service is a problem with this unit, unless you want someone to do the 600 hr. cleaning. Any boilerman can do that. The fire pot pieces show no wear. I love this unit. Service is not a problem.
Why do you say you are too far away? I know there are several people in Maine that have purchased Biowins.
I know next to nothing about the Kedel so I won't knock it. I do however own a Biowin and I would recommend it without reservation. My personal experience has been that Marc will stand behind the product 100% regardless of where you live. I would highly suggest at least taking a look at the Biowin and comparing it to the Kedel. Demo them both. It's a major investment either way and the very last thing you want is to be regretting your decision after you've pulled the trigger.
Dana, if I was out of town and something went wrong I would like to be able to have it looked at right away and not have my wife worry about it. With the Bio Win it would take 3 hours travel to have a service rep there.
How many square feet are you heating?
How many square feet are you heating?
So Kedel has garuanteed you that they will have someone at your home right away? I doubt that any manufacturer can live up to promises like that. You will probably have a local plumber install the unit. They might be able to come out quickly and they could always contact Windhager for guidance. I understand your concern but I know that there are Biowins operating in parts of the country that are much further away than you.
I only got my Biowin last fall and in just one season I've actually learned a lot about the operation and maintenance of it. My wife has too. We left our existing oil boiler in place so if there's ever a problem with the Biowin we can flip a few switches and ball vales and we're back on oil. You mentioned your oil boiler is at it's end of life so that doesn't sound like an option for you. In any event if the distance from Windhager is an absolute deal breaker for you then that's too bad but if not you should check them out.
I'm heating 2400 sq ft. I went through a little under six tons with the Biowin this winter.
How are you doing DHW now? How are you planning on doing DHW after you get the pellet boiler?
Dana,
There are two Kedel dealers within a half hours drive so my chances are greatly increased. I only run my oil burner now to heat hot water in an indirect tank. It was originally set up for a demand coil so it is not really a cold start so it is inefficient. I have the baseboard but don't use it. I have 2300 sq feet that needs to be heated but I'm currently heating the basement as well making it a total of 3500 sq ft. I accomplish this with a coal stove in the basement and supplement that with a woodstove on the first floor. I go through 2.5 tons of coal and 2 to 3 cords of wood per year for a maximum cost of $1400.00. Thus I have thought about using just a heat pump tank for the hot water and avoid any oil burning. However if we needed to go away we still need an automated heat source. If I shut my old oil burner off the gaskets will leak and it will have issues firing back up after a long period. Thus the thought of a pellet boiler and plumbing that into the existing indirect tank. Another point about the Kedel is it will notify you and your dealer if it is having an issue. They could service it while you are away and prevent any pipe and water damage. I will see if there are any Bio Wins in my area to look at before I make a final decision.
There are two Kedel dealers within a half hours drive so my chances are greatly increased. I only run my oil burner now to heat hot water in an indirect tank. It was originally set up for a demand coil so it is not really a cold start so it is inefficient. I have the baseboard but don't use it. I have 2300 sq feet that needs to be heated but I'm currently heating the basement as well making it a total of 3500 sq ft. I accomplish this with a coal stove in the basement and supplement that with a woodstove on the first floor. I go through 2.5 tons of coal and 2 to 3 cords of wood per year for a maximum cost of $1400.00. Thus I have thought about using just a heat pump tank for the hot water and avoid any oil burning. However if we needed to go away we still need an automated heat source. If I shut my old oil burner off the gaskets will leak and it will have issues firing back up after a long period. Thus the thought of a pellet boiler and plumbing that into the existing indirect tank. Another point about the Kedel is it will notify you and your dealer if it is having an issue. They could service it while you are away and prevent any pipe and water damage. I will see if there are any Bio Wins in my area to look at before I make a final decision.
PassionForFire&Water
Minister of Fire
Most pellets now available have a low fines percentage. PFI standard.
If there is the normal amount of fines, then this will burn with pellets.
I do not see any need for a filter bag.
There are over 60,000 BioWINs in use in Europe with a vacuum feed system with no filter bag
velvetfoot
Minister of Fire
There the trend of expanding natural gas infrastructure, it may be possible to buy a gently used oil boiler replacement, for backup. The European pellet boilers seem to require a chimney as well, so you'd have to account for that.
I received a call from a bulk pellet supplier/manufacturer about island delivery that I met at the show. In conversation he stated that some of his customers (mostly commercial boilers) experienced clogging of vacuum filling due to fines on filter. He said it wasn't any one brand over the other, just the vacuum system. I asked my question in this thread to see what the experience has been.
PassionForFire&Water
Minister of Fire
If the vacuum system has a filter bag then the manual for that pellet boiler brand/model will for sure state the minimum frequency of checking and cleaning this filter bag.
If you're in Central Maine, you might be able to get "Foamit up" who posted above, to show you his Biowin boiler. He was nice enough to give me a tour earlier this season.
maple1
Minister of Fire
Do you have propane at your house or access to natural gas?
With your oil boiler in the shape it's sounding like it's in - I would very seriously consider getting rid of it & everything oil related, and for backup heat replace it either with a propane unit if you have propane on site, or an electric boiler. And install a pellet boiler for primary heat. And maybe an electric hot water heater for DHW. It is a shame to have baseboards installed and not be using them.
You mentioned your oil boiler is end of life. Does that mean it's completely dead and you absolutely need some type of new heating appliance or it's almost dead and you might be able to get another season or two out of it?
sinnian
Minister of Fire
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