We need to have the liner in my brick chimney replaced, but it won't budge. We've had a chimney company come out and try for 3 hours, including using the drill tool that bangs around the inside thinking it would rattle it loose. They used a portland/vermiculite mix around it. Any suggestions on getting it out? Some suggest a liquid to react to the mix. Would creosote play a part in binding the liner and cement?
Liner won't budge to remove.
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Fsappo
Minister of Fire
this is a stainless insulated liner you are trying to remove from a clay tile lined masonry chimney?
Yes. I forgot to add that.
Another question is this: We currently have an 8" liner to accommodate our VC Vigilant. We are more than willing to give that stove up for a new one, which would only require a 6 inch pipe. Could the 6" be run down the 8" without the first one being removed?
Another question is this: We currently have an 8" liner to accommodate our VC Vigilant. We are more than willing to give that stove up for a new one, which would only require a 6 inch pipe. Could the 6" be run down the 8" without the first one being removed?
mstoelton
Feeling the Heat
I think the answer to your questions are:
The vermiculite/Portland cement mix is sticking to the liner because it was made to do so. That is why it has portland cement in it. So that it solidifies around the flue.
If you can get the 6 inch down the 8 inch it could work. You will likely need a pulling cone.
Not sure if it is legal.
Any liquids that would react with the vermiculite/portland is going to be something you don't want to be putting in your chimney.
If the liner is a continuous coil type liner, you may have success by uncoiling it (rip it out by uncoiling the pipe). It will be a pane in the backside, but it may work.
The vermiculite/Portland cement mix is sticking to the liner because it was made to do so. That is why it has portland cement in it. So that it solidifies around the flue.
If you can get the 6 inch down the 8 inch it could work. You will likely need a pulling cone.
Not sure if it is legal.
Any liquids that would react with the vermiculite/portland is going to be something you don't want to be putting in your chimney.
If the liner is a continuous coil type liner, you may have success by uncoiling it (rip it out by uncoiling the pipe). It will be a pane in the backside, but it may work.
Fsappo
Minister of Fire
I can't think of a way to read that code in a way where putting a 6" liner down an 8" liner would not be allowed. In the real world (code aside) doing so would make for a very safe chimney installation in my opinion. The little bit of air space between the two liners would act as another barrier of insulation. Air space is great for that.
Fsappo
Minister of Fire
You need to insulate a liner that is placed inside of an insulated liner? Unless I am missing something huge, you may want to hear from some of the smarter folks on the forums, or ask this chimney guy what data, rule, code etc he is basing that statement on.
I am almost at peace that we may just have to demo the chimney-with that liner-and have them run new pipe up on the outside of the house. The thought of the SS pipe running up a somewhat focal point of the house was the stickler for being desperate to salvage the chimney. We now realized we can box in the pipe and have it blend into the house.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
The 8" is already insulated. Run 6" down inside there and be done with it.
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What i would do is run the 6" inside and pour mix between the 2. But really you dont need any additional insulation just seal the top and bottom and you should be ok. What type liner are you trying to remove? If it is flex like said before unravel it it is a pain but it works if it is rigid with no elbows attach a hoist to the top it will pull out. We have done both of those options and they work. never had one we couldn't get out
CenterTree
Minister of Fire
Is this a straight chimney you are dealing with?
I think an insulated 6 inch liner would fit inside of an 8 inch liner if it did not include too many bends.
* 6 inch liner plus 1/2 inch insulated is 7 inches,,, (plus mesh wrap and hose clamps) is still a tad under 8 inches diameter....right?
But as has been stated, why the need for more insulation if the outer 8 inch liner already has it??
You will still need to deal with the bottom end of the liner if it has a TEE there. You should be able to cut off the 8 inch TEE and attach the new 6 inch TEE to the new liner. (unless you have a straight down install)
I think an insulated 6 inch liner would fit inside of an 8 inch liner if it did not include too many bends.
* 6 inch liner plus 1/2 inch insulated is 7 inches,,, (plus mesh wrap and hose clamps) is still a tad under 8 inches diameter....right?
But as has been stated, why the need for more insulation if the outer 8 inch liner already has it??
You will still need to deal with the bottom end of the liner if it has a TEE there. You should be able to cut off the 8 inch TEE and attach the new 6 inch TEE to the new liner. (unless you have a straight down install)
then you will need to run the 6" down through the 8" it probably wont come out if it is rigid with an elbow in it
Have another company here today and he has a different way to fix it. Still requires getting the liner out but he feels confident that it will come out. We are also resolved that we will be replacing my baby, the Vigilant, with a newer model so we can run a 6 inch liner. He does not feel that we have to take down the chimney to do what he suggests. Crossing our fingers.....
mellow
Resident Stove Connoisseur
Yes, she's a tough old lady with a very warm heart. If you have a Quadrafire dealer nearby check out the Isle Royale and in Jotul the F600.
Are these similar in output size of the Vigilant? We have a 2 story colonial- ish house built in the 50's, added on in the 70's. Not the greatest insulation but anytime we do an outside wall, we insulate. The old stove kept a good part of the house very nice during extreme cold.
They are both radiant stoves with similar output to the Vigilant. They both will want seasoned wood, but that is best for the Vigilant too.
Checked out a couple of Jotuls and the VC at our local store. Haven't decided yet. Plus we're still unsure of how we are going to proceed to get this done. The first chimney company just sent us the estimate for running the pipe on the outside of the house and hooking up the new stove- $3400. The company yesterday quoted $3k to remove liner, reline and connect new stove. He also said if he could not get the liner out, he would not charge us at all, unlike the first company. They spent 3 hours attempting to remove it, charge us a good pretty good chunk of change and don't apply that to the next phase? And while talking to the guy at the stove shop, he mentions that he took a class from the first company's owner who kind of alluded that "when you go to do a sweep at a house, you should always find "something else". Or else you aren't a good sweep." Really? Are people really that deceitful? And they have a good reputation but now I'm not so sure. We have a name of another chimney guy who may be the final estimate before we figure this mess out. No idea who to trust. And one mason quoted us $2900 to remove the chimney- that would be on top of the install from the other company- plus the new stove. Never ends....
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