Hi, first time woodburner here. We just got our permit for our catalytic stove (Dutchwest 2461) and ran it for the first time yesterday. Everything was going fine and our probe temp was up around 1000F before we settled down around 9pm. At 4:30am this morning our carbon monoxide detector woke us up and was going off. Our fire had burned up and there was basically nothing but ashes left. We had closed the damper, had our secondary air control 1 turn open and had our primary air fully open. The only thing I can think of is we should have closed the primary air more before we went to bed but I don't see how that would have contributed to the CO2. Any ideas or suggestions would be very much appreciated. Thanks.
Dutchwest 2461
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Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
Is this a new stove? Normally, the draft should be keeping that stuff in and pulling it up and out the stack. Are you saying you have a pipe damper, and it was closed? Usually a pipe damper is only used to tame down a strong draft. Does the draft seem good? Can you open the door with a fire going, without any smoke coming out the door? How tall is the stack, and is there a liner all the way to the top?
No it is not a new stove. The damper is the stove damper. In the manual it says leave it open during lighting and reloading than close after 20 minutes or something. It can only be open or closed. Once the fire is going I can open the door with no smoke coming out. We have a prefabricated chimney which is roughly 19 feet tall.
It sounds like a possible backdraft. Is the stove in a basement? How is it connected to the chimney? Straight-up and through the house or up a bit, then a 90 to an outside chimney?
Yes, the stove is in the basement. The chimney goes up a few feet than a 90 to an outside chimney. Is there a way to prevent the backdraft?
Keeping the chimney warm will help. Is there a furnace or gas/oil hot water heater in the basement that maybe cycled during the night this happened?
If the basement is tightly sealed, it's possible that the backdraft was caused by the furnace and/or hw heater pulling in combustion air and the stove flue, that being the most convenient source. If so, these appliances may need an outside air supply.
http://www.woodheat.org/all-about-chimneys.html
http://www.woodheat.org/all-about-chimneys.html
Yes, the basement is tightly sealed. What you are saying makes sense. I never would have thought of that. Thank you.
It's possible that the stove is also competing for air. In this case usually a fresh air supply is connected to the stove with an outside air kit (OAK). You can test this if there is a nearby window that is openable. Start the fire and get it burning well. Now open the window a little. If the fire brightens and gains intensity the stove may also be needing air. This is important, you don't want it pulling air from the hw heater or furnace flues.
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
A quesition regarding outside air kits. Where on my stove would I connect it. I don't believe there are any spots underneath but I will check later. The only other spot I can think of is a spot on the back where the optional blower would go.
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
Is this problem more likely with the flue coming all the way to the basement, as opposed to upstairs, or what?
I don't see anything in the manual, either. In any case, once the furnace, etc have their own air, that should take care of it unless it's due to house stack effect...
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ssoucy
New Member
just replaced my dutchwest that was in basement for same reasons. Negative pressure in basement causes backpuffing when the cat is engaged and fire box fills with gasses faster than draw can clear them. 10 years of trying everything imaginable to fix problem led to getting a stove that would fit on our first floor rather than in basement. Installer said high chimney, negative pressure and slow burning cat stove is bad mix.
So over the past few days I have tried a couple different things. When I open a window there is no difference in the brightness of the fire. I have noticed that if I close the damper even while keeping the primary air fully open the firebox temps drop
significantly. If we have a lot of glowing ashes and we close the damper the firebox will stay about 350F but usually closer to 300-325. However, overnight when the stove went out again our carbon monoxide detector went off. I read somewhere to keep the ash door partially cracked and it would help so we tried that. That seemed to work better and our detector did not go off. We have a digital detector and had a high of 27 ppm one night and the other was 29ppm. So I am thinking that because of that the stove is just not getting enough air with the primary air fully opened. Is there anything wrong with leaving the ash door cracked about a ½” or so? Or does anyone know of a better solution? My typical reloading procedure now is close the ash door and open the damper, put wood in. Wait 10-20 minutes or so until wood catches and firebox temp reaches approx. 600F then close damper and crack open ash door.
significantly. If we have a lot of glowing ashes and we close the damper the firebox will stay about 350F but usually closer to 300-325. However, overnight when the stove went out again our carbon monoxide detector went off. I read somewhere to keep the ash door partially cracked and it would help so we tried that. That seemed to work better and our detector did not go off. We have a digital detector and had a high of 27 ppm one night and the other was 29ppm. So I am thinking that because of that the stove is just not getting enough air with the primary air fully opened. Is there anything wrong with leaving the ash door cracked about a ½” or so? Or does anyone know of a better solution? My typical reloading procedure now is close the ash door and open the damper, put wood in. Wait 10-20 minutes or so until wood catches and firebox temp reaches approx. 600F then close damper and crack open ash door.
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
Do not under ANY circumstances run the stove without the ash door tightly closed. I don't think you are getting the cat lit off, so your chimney never gets hot enough to draw well. You should be able to see the cat glowing after you close the bypass, by looking up through the door glass through the baffle. You said the stove is used...did you look remove the top and look at the condition of the cat...or if it's even in there? 
I looked at the cat and it appears to be in fine condition. No cracks or anything. The cat temps usually get around 900-1100 so it should be firing according the manual. I will and see if I can see it glowing next time we use it. The reason being is with the ash door slightly open firebox temps stay around 500F as opposed to 300-325F or so it closed. Is there a reason not to keep the ash drawer cracked if firebox temps never get above 500F? Sorry if these are stupid questions. I'm new to this and trying to figure it out.
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
OK, I re-read your first post, so the cat is most likely lighting off. But if you have wet wood, it may be stalling a couple hours into the burn. My stove top will go to 650 pretty easily once the cat lights. The cat has stalled on me a couple times, though. You may have to start your overnight burn earlier, then open up the primary air a bit more to keep the cat from stalling. Read the manual thoroughly, lots of good info there.
I'd have to look, but I thought I remembered they told you to run the cat probe to 500, then close the bypass.
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
The wood was cut and stacked for 1.5 years so it should be well seasoned. the cat temp is usually around 450-500F when I close the bypass. I have the primary air fully open the hole time the damper is closed so I can't give it any more air than that. That's why I thought cracking the ash drawer seemed like the next logical step but I could very well be wrong.
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
How long has your wood been split and stacked. I've had a couple cat stalls, and that was with dry; Wet wood would be worse yet. I'm working on a couple ideas to avoid the potential stall....
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