Just found out the 150 year old house I recently bought needs a new chimney liner and a new wood stove. Liner is cracked and insulation is falling into T (?) and stove has broken grate, missing gaskets, broken combustor (?).House has 2 floors and is 1300 square feet. Presently there is a Vermont Castings Defiant Encore from 1986. I'm totally new to owning a house and have never used a wood stove. Just found this news out yesterday after I had an inspector come. I want to purchase and get this setup fast so that I can enjoy my new digs. Was told by the guy that came that I couldn't go wrong with an Avalon. Want a quality, no bells or whistles, efficient and easy to use stove. Any suggestions would be gratefully welcomed. So glad I found this site last night!
newbie needs help!
- Thread starter jilski
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JimWalshin845
New Member
Figure out your BTU needs and go from there. Tons of info on new stoves and technology here so peruse the forum. I think a lot of your questions will be answered.
Also, are you going to continue to heat with wood or go to a bio-fuel?
Also, are you going to continue to heat with wood or go to a bio-fuel?
Theres a great wood stove by Morso , the Morso 7110. It heats up to 1300 Sq. Ft, at 38,000 BTU's,m and it's affordable! CSM Stoves and Furnaces in Monson, MA carries it at a cost of $1,550.00! Cant go wrong with this model stove.
as for alternatives to wood, we sell BioBricks, which is compressed wood Pellets. $4.95 for a package(20 bricks) or $225.00 for a pallet (50 packages)
One pallet of BioBricks is the equivilent of more than a cord of seasoned hardwood!
Burns longer, hotter, and cleaner, which means little to no creosote, Little maintaining, and little stoking
as for alternatives to wood, we sell BioBricks, which is compressed wood Pellets. $4.95 for a package(20 bricks) or $225.00 for a pallet (50 packages)
One pallet of BioBricks is the equivilent of more than a cord of seasoned hardwood!
Burns longer, hotter, and cleaner, which means little to no creosote, Little maintaining, and little stoking
jilski said:
Soopah 27
New Member
I imagine that would be quite a commute (to Monson) from upstate NY...
Although it might be interesting during Hill-climb season. Never made it up there for one of those, but heard many stories.
Jilski - Congrats on the new house.
Opinions on stoves are as varied as their users, so most here will refrain from recommending one stove over the other (as everyone is of course, biased)
Please describe further: size of the room where stove will be, level of insulation, ceiling height etc... where the stove sits in relation to other areas you may want to heat & what you want to do with the stove (i.e. warm the room or heat the house)
As for the current chimney, current situation sounds bad. Was this found on new home insp by home inspector? Please provide flue size, height, type of insulation etc... how deteriorated is it?
Some pics may be in order.
Also for more learning check out Woodheat.org another great informational resource.
It sounds by your post like you may be in a hurry - Take your time, there's LOTS to learn.
Best of luck,
Although it might be interesting during Hill-climb season. Never made it up there for one of those, but heard many stories.
Jilski - Congrats on the new house.
Opinions on stoves are as varied as their users, so most here will refrain from recommending one stove over the other (as everyone is of course, biased)
Please describe further: size of the room where stove will be, level of insulation, ceiling height etc... where the stove sits in relation to other areas you may want to heat & what you want to do with the stove (i.e. warm the room or heat the house)
As for the current chimney, current situation sounds bad. Was this found on new home insp by home inspector? Please provide flue size, height, type of insulation etc... how deteriorated is it?
Some pics may be in order.
Also for more learning check out Woodheat.org another great informational resource.
It sounds by your post like you may be in a hurry - Take your time, there's LOTS to learn.
Best of luck,
Thanks for the replies. The stove will be in the living room 14.5 X 16 with an 8' ceiling. The house doesn't have great insulation (that's as scientific as I can get). One side of the room has a full opening to the dining room which is about the same size. Dining room opens into kitchen. Another wall has an open doorway to a hallway with a staircase up to the bedroom. I would like to feel the stove's warmth on the first floor. When I go to bed... would like the stove to keep the chill out of the rooms... and in the morning...put some wood in the stove...which will readily ignite for another days work. Don't expect the stove to heat top floor.
The present chimney has an 8" flue. I'm looking at the Morso 2100 wood stove. Thanks for the site woodheat.org... just realizing how much there is to know/learn about using the stove to the best of it's ability!
The present chimney has an 8" flue. I'm looking at the Morso 2100 wood stove. Thanks for the site woodheat.org... just realizing how much there is to know/learn about using the stove to the best of it's ability!
What's your budget and aesthetic choice? There are several freestanding choices. If you are ok with a catalytic stove and intent to heat with it 24/7 I would suggest another VC Encore or a Woodstock Fireview stove. If not I would consider the 2100 or the larger 3610 in upstate NY. Also you might want to look into a Jotul Oslo for cast iron stoves. If a steel stove, Avalon, Lopi, Quadrafire, Regency, Pacific Energy and Napoleon are some good brands to look at.
JimWalshin845
New Member
OK... sounds like you can heat, with the help of ceiling or pedistal fans, 3 rooms. Difficult to kick the heat all the way back to the stairwell to help keep the upstairs warm. The bedroom(s) right above the stove will get some aux heat from the downstairs ceiling.
Keep reading and maybe put a diagram up. Somebody has a home just like yours that is using a stove and definitely posts here on H.C.
Get square and cubic feet together along with window/door space. Calc your BTUs. What is your source of fuel. Where will you store it? How much will it cost? Who will haul it? Who will clean the unit? If you worked a few more hours at your job will it make up to just burn oil/gas instead for the time that you will spend feeding/caring for a stove?
I am not being negative here, just trying to make you see the realities and dedication to run a stove. We love doing it and endorse it to the max. Just make sure you AND your family feel the same.
BTUs and the fuel system will help you narrow down the search. Get that done first.
HTGD,
J&K;
Keep reading and maybe put a diagram up. Somebody has a home just like yours that is using a stove and definitely posts here on H.C.
Get square and cubic feet together along with window/door space. Calc your BTUs. What is your source of fuel. Where will you store it? How much will it cost? Who will haul it? Who will clean the unit? If you worked a few more hours at your job will it make up to just burn oil/gas instead for the time that you will spend feeding/caring for a stove?
I am not being negative here, just trying to make you see the realities and dedication to run a stove. We love doing it and endorse it to the max. Just make sure you AND your family feel the same.
BTUs and the fuel system will help you narrow down the search. Get that done first.
HTGD,
J&K;
JimWalshin845
New Member
BeGreen said:
You are suggesting a stove yet the poster hasn't even figured out his basic need?
Why put the horse before the cart?
You may be excited about this stove, but if it doesn't meet his needs why waste his and your time?
Get the BTUs... then go for the stove.
??? Considering these folks have just moved into the house, I don't expect a detailed assessment or heating records to determine btus. A range of medium to med. large sized stoves to consider was suggested based on the sq ft, location, 24/7 heating, house condition. I lived in the area for 30 years. Relatives are still living there, heating with wood. Northern NY has serious winters.
JimWalshin845
New Member
BeGreen said:
OK... Basicly anything north of the Bronx or Westchester is consider 'UPSTATE' for many NYer's. I was born NYC, raised in Westchester, lived in Oswego for a while and before moving down to S. NJ lived in Dutchess County for 30+ years. I never lived in the western part of NY. So maybe the original poster gave you a 'heads up' exactly where in "U P S T A T E " "N Y"he lives.
Oswego is brutal and so is Buffalo the 'W E S T E R N ' part of ... AKA 'U P S T A T E'.
Sooo, which part of "UPSTATE" did you live? I think it would be a good idea for the poster to state which quadrant of NY they live?
NY is a HUGE state. When we go to Florida there is a HUGE temp difference during any season. On the LEFT COAST, the State of California is very different as per temp and weather.
What is wrong with starting out with the basics?
House design, BTU's, areas to be heated, wood/fuel source, maintainance, PROs/CONs?
If I lived in 'UPSTATE' Westchester I would drive a Caddillac/Lexus..... in Oswego/Buffalo I would drive a Ford pickup F250/350 or Dodge Ram.
The poster is NEW to wood burning, no matter where he lives start him off RIGHT. Don't put him on the track of buying a stove that may NOT suit the family's needs.
He stated:
That was a great intro by him.
He also states:
I beleive all modern EPA stoves are fairly efficient and easy to use. But the work involved is not exactly what most people think!
I love the whole idea of wood stoves and alternative fuels. I started back in 1978 with a combo unit with all the tax credits and a solar panel unit for hot water; but I also know a few that spent oodles of $$$$$ and did not know how much time and effort it took.
I don't mean to be disrespectful, but when we have experience and knowledge we should pass it along. We should leave out the points of whether we drive a Caddy/Lexus or a F250 or Dodge Ram.
Yes, you gave a good list of stoves, but as a MODERATOR and hopefully a MENTOR you would not endorse a stove but point them in the right direction as per WHY they are buying a certain product. Maybe point them to past threads on good/bad stoves but I think the important part here is to get them to investigate before they even consider a purchase.
Let the poster start off right and point him/her to a position where they know what they need, decided on a budget, have support for install and maintanance and be VERY VERY comfortable with their decision because of a full investigation of what satisfies their needs.
Off my wood box,
Jim
Thank you for the passionate replies. I actually had someone else come to my home today to see what my chimney/hearth story is. Found out my hearth would not stand up to local inspection without getting an "ember floor protection only" stove. The local store that has gotten great reviews from the "locals" for installation, etc only sells two types of these stoves. So today I purchased a Scan Anderson 10. Really looking forward to the installation...and in the meantime I will be avidly reading this forum for insight into using wood stoves. Thanks everyone... I love this forum and the level of expertise that abounds here. A total newbie such as myself truly needs this site for info!
Now on to how to best build a fire!
Now on to how to best build a fire!
Spammer
My opinion is, post useful information or go somewhere else. If you are here to advertise your shop and nothing more, take a hike.
Sorry guys, but this was blatant advertising and nothing more...this guy didn't want to help, he wanted to sell product.
My opinion is, post useful information or go somewhere else. If you are here to advertise your shop and nothing more, take a hike.
Sorry guys, but this was blatant advertising and nothing more...this guy didn't want to help, he wanted to sell product.
CSM-StovesandFurnaces said:Theres a great wood stove by Morso , the Morso 7110. It heats up to 1300 Sq. Ft, at 38,000 BTU's,m and it's affordable! CSM Stoves and Furnaces in Monson, MA carries it at a cost of $1,550.00! Cant go wrong with this model stove.
as for alternatives to wood, we sell BioBricks, which is compressed wood Pellets. $4.95 for a package(20 bricks) or $225.00 for a pallet (50 packages)
One pallet of BioBricks is the equivilent of more than a cord of seasoned hardwood!
Burns longer, hotter, and cleaner, which means little to no creosote, Little maintaining, and little stoking
jilski said:
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
Jim,
the poster asked for suggestions & advice as to a stove. The moderator did just that.
He is a moderator because he is capable and knowledgeable.
No need to give him crap about about giving advice that was asked for in the first place.
Take 2 Midol and have a chill.
the poster asked for suggestions & advice as to a stove. The moderator did just that.
He is a moderator because he is capable and knowledgeable.
No need to give him crap about about giving advice that was asked for in the first place.
Take 2 Midol and have a chill.
x2, not the first time
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/11167/
[quote author="fayman" date="1195718242"]
My opinion is, post useful information or go somewhere else. If you are here to advertise your shop and nothing more, take a hike.
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/11167/
[quote author="fayman" date="1195718242"]
My opinion is, post useful information or go somewhere else. If you are here to advertise your shop and nothing more, take a hike.
Gooserider
Mod Emeritus
jilski said:
OK, You have a bunch of different options, and two different inter-related problems, the chimney and the stove. While they slightly influence each other, IMHO you should consider them seperately.
1. The chimney - it may limit your stove choices - Posting a picture or two of the current setup will help.
What is the configuration?
Is the stove partly in an existing fireplace?
Does the stove vent (exhaust pipe) come out the top of the stove, or the back? You mention a "T" so I'm guessing the back.
What does the vent do then? Does it go immediately up into the flue of the fireplace, or does it go up a ways using stove pipe, then do a 90* turn and go into the chimney (possibly above a fireplace opening?)
If you have a "T" and then go up into the chimney, how high could the "T" be located and still be reachable?
In essence what I'm trying to figure out is if - without major reconstruction - you can use a top vent stove, or if you are limited to a rear vent, and if so how tall a stove you can fit.
What is the current chimney construction?
What sort of liner is there currently? Does it go all the way to the top of the chimney, or is it just a short section of pipe that sticks up a few feet into the throat of the fireplace?
What size is the existing flue? (cross section dimensions and approximate height from the floor of the stove room to the top of the chimney)
From what little info you've given us, it sounds like you need a full length insulated liner, probably 6", however if you have an 8" flue, then you may need to go down to a 5.5" in order to get the room you need for insulation.
On a related question, how big is the hearth area, and what is it made from? Some of the codes have changed, and you may need to plan on extending it to bring it into compliance with current codes. Especially, what is the clearance between the loading door and the edge of the hearth?
2. The stove...
What sort of budget do you have? Are you after spending as little as possible, or do you want to spend enough to get the stove you want?
Do you have any preferences for style?
Was the guy that inspected your place a stove shop? Did he by any chance sell Avalons? (I get paranoid when inspectors try to sell me stuff...)
- First option MIGHT be to try getting a price on rebuilding the Defiant/Encore that you have - The grate and combustor aren't that expensive, and gaskets aren't that bad either. It will require you to do some of the work yourself, (it would probably NOT be cost effective to have the stove rebuilt professionally, but it can be done as a DIY project) but could still be your cheapest option. If you have lots of other bad parts, it will be more of a problem, and the cost / benefit analysis gets trickier. However all the internal parts are still available for that stove, so don't rule it out...
- Next choice might be another VC Encore (note, the model name has changed over time, the "Defiant-Encore" is equivalent to today's Encore, and the Defiant is the next model up) The Encore is a well proven design that is still being made today in Cat and non-Cat versions. In light of some of the other threads currently going on the board I would have trouble reccomending the Non-cat (Everburn) model, however I just aquired a used CAT model, and find that it's a wonderful stove. The Encore is a little big for 1300 feet, but Monson gets tough enough winters, and in view of your poor insulation, it seems like a good fit. I also consider the Encore to be about the minimum size for people that want to do 24/7 burning as primary heat, as smaller stoves don't have the burn time ability.
- Last, but not least, would be to put in some other stove, and there are lots of options. If you have to do a rear vent, that will limit you A LOT, as there aren't that many rear vent stoves compared to the numbers of top vent units. I would look for something in the roughly 2.5 to 3.0 cubic foot firebox size in order to get overnight burn capability, as well as about the right heat output (Note that I don't think you should even LOOK at BTU or area heated numbers, as they tend to be mostly figments of the sales departments imaginations - Firebox size is the key value to consider)
Lastly, how much of a DIY guy are you, and how much of this do you want to do yourself VS. having it done? Stove stuff involves a lot of different skills, but it's not overly complex, and we can walk you through most all of it if you need the help.
Gooserider
Sandor
Minister of Fire
Soopah 27
New Member
Nice stove - checked out one of these at the local dealer - HUGE viewing window... :wow:
jilski said:
I am glad to see someone focused on the chimney system. As I read these posts I kept wondering about the chimney system and the hearth protection. I have seen many people buy wood stoves with out considering these imporant factors and then find out on the install what they wanted to do can't be done or cost much more than antcipated. I know they mentioned they needed a new liner but as Gooserider mentioned there were a lot of unanswerd questions. It was great input by all and I am sure the "newbie" appreciated it all. HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO ALL!!
!!This newbie loves all the advice, comments and questions. The questions lead to finding answers which lead to knowledge of what I now own! Old liner and insulation will be removed and new liner, insulations, thimble(?), tee (?) will be put in. Thanks for the site about building a fire. Loved it! A Happy Thanksgiving to all who celebrate. jill
fayman said:Spammer
My opinion is, post useful information or go somewhere else. If you are here to advertise your shop and nothing more, take a hike.
Sorry guys, but this was blatant advertising and nothing more...this guy didn't want to help, he wanted to sell product.
CSM-StovesandFurnaces said:Theres a great wood stove by Morso , the Morso 7110. It heats up to 1300 Sq. Ft, at 38,000 BTU's,m and it's affordable! CSM Stoves and Furnaces in Monson, MA carries it at a cost of $1,550.00! Cant go wrong with this model stove.
as for alternatives to wood, we sell BioBricks, which is compressed wood Pellets. $4.95 for a package(20 bricks) or $225.00 for a pallet (50 packages)
One pallet of BioBricks is the equivilent of more than a cord of seasoned hardwood!
Burns longer, hotter, and cleaner, which means little to no creosote, Little maintaining, and little stoking
jilski said:
First off, I recommended a Morso 7110. Read the threads, I also said that you can use biobricks, and yes, I inadvertantly advertised the business I work for, but thats not why I posted. the Biobricks page post was also relevant, and not spam. the post was asking for places in massachusetts to buy biobricks, so I said that we do. so therefore relevant.
If you have a problem with my posts, please take it up with me. Thank you.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
Getting in late to this one!
Couple issues - first of all , we all make mistakes, especially when we are relatively new to a place (this forum). So I would ask folks to give people the benefit of the doubt. There are a lot of "levels" between helping, pimping, selling and spamming.
CSM is clearly (based on user name) not trying to hide anything, and may also not be familiar with forum policy....and, actually we have no hard and fast policy. We EXPECT that companies and manufacturers who participate here WILL get business (in fact we know it for a fact).
What we (the mods) look for is whether a person is here to help. If they are here to help, they are welcome. If they are here to learn, they are welcome. However, if the primary reasons for being here is to promote their own store, etc....well, that is something that would ruin the forum really quick.
If I still had my store in NJ and someone came on here from the Philly area, I would tell them (by PM, email or right here) that I had a store and they could come in a talk to me. I would not tell them I will beat any price (at least until I talk to them privately)....
Also, in terms of terminology, SPAM would be considered as completely off-topic (usually email) which is 100% unsolicited. In this case, we are really talking about self-promotion, with a little bias.
I think the best thing is for newer users to dig through the forum and see how relatively muted most of the posts are.
Keep in mind that the forum is not a public place, nor a free-for-all. It is part of a commercial (and independent, and education) site, and we do have some "rules" and standards. All in all, they are pretty loose and most of our users have been happy with them.
Couple issues - first of all , we all make mistakes, especially when we are relatively new to a place (this forum). So I would ask folks to give people the benefit of the doubt. There are a lot of "levels" between helping, pimping, selling and spamming.
CSM is clearly (based on user name) not trying to hide anything, and may also not be familiar with forum policy....and, actually we have no hard and fast policy. We EXPECT that companies and manufacturers who participate here WILL get business (in fact we know it for a fact).
What we (the mods) look for is whether a person is here to help. If they are here to help, they are welcome. If they are here to learn, they are welcome. However, if the primary reasons for being here is to promote their own store, etc....well, that is something that would ruin the forum really quick.
If I still had my store in NJ and someone came on here from the Philly area, I would tell them (by PM, email or right here) that I had a store and they could come in a talk to me. I would not tell them I will beat any price (at least until I talk to them privately)....
Also, in terms of terminology, SPAM would be considered as completely off-topic (usually email) which is 100% unsolicited. In this case, we are really talking about self-promotion, with a little bias.
I think the best thing is for newer users to dig through the forum and see how relatively muted most of the posts are.
Keep in mind that the forum is not a public place, nor a free-for-all. It is part of a commercial (and independent, and education) site, and we do have some "rules" and standards. All in all, they are pretty loose and most of our users have been happy with them.
JimWalshin845
New Member
CSM-StovesandFurnaces Posted: 11 December 2007 05:35 PM
Your name sorta reflects that you are a dealer. We don't jump down your throat?
Good that dealers and manufacturing reps post here and hopefully they will pay the dues to post their products on H dot C.
Stay cool and stay warm!
Your name sorta reflects that you are a dealer. We don't jump down your throat?
Good that dealers and manufacturing reps post here and hopefully they will pay the dues to post their products on H dot C.
Stay cool and stay warm!
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