2014-2015 Blaze King Performance thread (Everything BK)#2
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alforit
Feeling the Heat
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
Yessir.
In other news, for long burn times in shoulder season, turn off the darn fan kit. St00pid n00b.
Finally, I tried the durn trapdoor to the ash drawer tonight. It took a bit longer than the shovel and dump method, but I don't need to dust the living room, so net time measurement its faster for me to use the trapdoor, go figure.
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
Joful, I was fooling with fake BTUs, which I am going to go back and edit to be "wife warming units". With the fans running, I have hard time getting the stove to put out less than 1 WWU (wife warming unit) per hour, but I can run it up to 4.5 WWU/ hr.
I just turned my fan kit off today for the first time since like October, I expect to see long burn times again, at less than 1 WWU per hour.
I just turned my fan kit off today for the first time since like October, I expect to see long burn times again, at less than 1 WWU per hour.
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
I think having the fan kit installed but not running it makes zero difference, zip, nada, zilch. Except for the aesthetics of the power cord for the fan kit coming out of your colonial hearth to the nearest electrical receptacle of course ;-)
The 10 yr warranty may be for defects, but according to the presentation the 6 yr. EPA warranty requirement is for performance. At least that is the way I currently understand it, though maybe I have it wrong. This is what was presented at HPBA that I am referring to. Go to the Presentation section here: http://www.chc-hpba.org/chc_news.htm
The EPA standards appear to be set to assure performance over time. Otherwise you could have an EPA certified cat stove that in a few years was completely out of range of certification.
"All catalyst used in an approved EPA wood-burning appliance must receive approval from EPA.
Test result cannot show an increase from the appliances certified emission rating of more than 2.5 g/hr of particulate matter to demonstrate catalyst equivalency."
"The anticipate operational life is 12,000 to 50,000 hours."
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Yes, a few times. There were no hoops to jump through. File Warranty claim, install new one, mail old one back.
Of course you will likely need a good dealer to get it done quickly.
Now, if you were blowing through cats every few years it would not be so easy. This would mean you have an issue with your set-up, they would want that addressed.
That's my guess, sounds like those stoves were used in the Pacific NW. Aren't you guys cutting grass already?
I've pushed anywhere from 4-5 cords a year through mine for 4 seasons that puts me at the mark or beyond for their high end example. My stack is still clean, I can tell that the performance isn't what it used to be though. Maybe I only notice since I typically burn my stove on a lower setting with no flames in the stove, now I notice the t-stat has to open more to create the same heat I used to get with a dark stove.
bobdog2o02
Minister of Fire
Probably depends a lot on the operator, not every bk owner is so fascinated that they come to this site to perfect their operating technique.
Ex. Opening loading door before allowing cat to cool.....
Dieselhead
Minister of Fire
Agreed, this is probably true for most cat stove owners. How would the average user know this? Is it in the manual? Seasoned owners that do know this here are reporting more towards the 12K hrs. it appears.
BKVP
Minister of Fire
I would like to clarify that Condar purchases combustors from suppliers, such as Applied Ceramics (www.Firecatcombustors.com) Applied Ceramics and Clariant (use to be Sud Chemie and before that Corning) are the two formost experts in this field of combustors for wood stoves.
Additionally, EPA asked for a cat study to be performed by a third party lab. That study showed that in specific brands of cat stoves tested, the life of the combustor (as far as particulate is concerned) is just over 10 years of substantial particulate destruction. a cat that was 9.5 years of age was burning only 1 gr/hr dirtier as I recall.
The "hours" qouted by certain suppliers is a very dated figure and has not changed as the technology has. The most recent study was the one cited above.
Efficiency or burn characteristic changes can be linked to many other causes. Changes in weather and the effect that has on draft, fuel (wood cut from different trees over many years), gasket seals etc...
BKVP
Minister of Fire
Nah, just trying to make sure I speak correctly when recommending a cat stove. Not having owned one I have to go by other's experience.
BKVP
Minister of Fire
As you burn wood, deposits are formed OVER the precious metals (catalyst). First the substrate is made (either stainless or ceramic) and then it is coated with a wash coat. The wash coat helps with increasing surface area and also gives the precious metals adherence.
After years of burniing (varies with amount of fuel burned) there is an overplating and that overplating will take place.
Washing the combustor with vinegar and distilled water creates an acidic wash that will remove the build up on top of the precious metals.
Often, users will try this process and sometimes they drop or otherwise damage their combustors. That is why we do not encourage too frequent handling or cleaning. In house, we have found 6-8 (again varies with amount of fuel burned) is ideal for a "wash cleaning".
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BKVP
Minister of Fire
Highbeam,
If the combustor fails structurally, we replace it. The 10-year extended warranty applies to the OEM cat and NOT subsequent combustors. We figure everyone could have a mistake or not have read the manual or not read these posts, so we are willing to help through that learning curve. As for decrease in efficiency, read my comments is this thread.
Thank you
Chris
I've read many different posts that talk about this vinegar and water cleaning of the cat. That process isn't mentioned in our BKK manual. It says to use a soft brush and brush off the cat face if needed. It also says, "A nice hot fire will usually prove to be the best method of cleaning the combustor of deposits."
We turn our stove up to high at least once a day and let the cat temp get into the high temp range. Seems to be keeping everything clean. I personally would not want to take the cat out unless absolutely necessary. Maybe in a few years, we will have to do this vinegar and water wash?
So to clarify for the folks here with 3-4 yr old combustors that maybe approaching 12K hrs on them...
Would you recommend jeff_t carefully pickle the cat at this point?
Usually a bad door gasket. I've had 2 that have liners that exceed 30', they overdraft and have to learn to use the stove differently. IE: running on low most of the time.
Stump shot
Member
Tomorrow I will try to get a 24 hour burn with the fan and stove on low. Normally when the fan is running I reload every 12 hours.
Highbeam
Minister of Fire
Thank you Chris. 6-8 years or cords? I have no intention of removing the cat for cleaning or replacement until it really needs it.
I'm a bit afraid to take it out at this point, without a replacement on hand. I'm afraid handling it will do more harm than good. As long as it lights off and the gasket is good, it's staying in there.
Hopefully it's a non-issue for me. I didn't plan on being in here this far thru the winter. The weather the last couple of months has made it really hard to sell a house.
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