What's the Current Quality on Heat Pump Water Heaters?
- Thread starter Otis B Driftwood
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DBoon
Minister of Fire
I have to say that I agree with Otis. For the last 20 years, I've been worried about my refrigerator failing, and we all know that a refrigerator uses the same basic technology as a HPWH. So I finally took the plunge and replaced my refrigerator with an old-fashioned ice box. It's a little more difficult to use, but it is very quiet. The only downside is that I have to arrange for a thrice weekly ice block delivery, but I sleep better at night knowing that the reliability will probably be better.
I am in CT as well. I have a GE Geopsring purchased from Lowes with the Energize CT rebate and federal rebate.Total cost around $200.
Only problem in the past 2 years was a bad element. I blame that on running it in heat pump only mode from day 1 and never using the elements. GE sent 2 new elements out no questions asked. The compressor on these is made by Embarco in Brazil. I work in refrigeration and they make very reliable compressors.
Buy one. My energy use from last August with my wife and I. Average cost around $10-15 a month and thats with CT's crazy high electric rates.
Only problem in the past 2 years was a bad element. I blame that on running it in heat pump only mode from day 1 and never using the elements. GE sent 2 new elements out no questions asked. The compressor on these is made by Embarco in Brazil. I work in refrigeration and they make very reliable compressors.
Buy one. My energy use from last August with my wife and I. Average cost around $10-15 a month and thats with CT's crazy high electric rates.
I just put a 50 gal Geospring in a month ago. Bought it online, a "open box" one from Interstate appliance upon a recommendation from someone who posted on here, 899 plus free fed ex liftgate shipping to my door. My co-op had 650 rebate. It arrived in a factory sealed box and no dents or scratches with full mfg 1 yr full 10 yr parts warranty, so far i love the thing!
I just replaced a Montgomery wards branded fridge last fall. It has a 10 year compressor warranty. I hope it is a high quality unit.
Brian26 - how did you know the element went bad if you weren't using it? Just wondering what I need to keep an eye out for. I've been running in heat pump mode from day 1 as well. Thanks.
Put in electric only see if it gets hot. I try to exercise mine every few months for a day. Just to help keep any build up at bay.
B-b-but what about February? Looks GREAT in August though.
Gotta agree with Steely ... methinks that running the element
is a good idea. Interesting that the last installer mentioned
running the boiler a few times in summer to keep buildup
down. It doesn't run in the summer now anyway, we've
got oil-fired HW ... the noise between either engine is
practically identical.
The unit gave an error code that was for check upper and lower elements. I called GE and they send out 2 new elements. I noticed the new elements were like twice the thickness and had twice the element looped back. I replaced them and try and run them once or twice a month. I suspect maybe they get buildup on them and it needs to be burned. off.
I will try and pull my usage off my electricity monitor for some winter months. My below ground basement stays just about exactly the same temp year round so I don't think there is much difference.
See my previous post in the thread. I've never directly compared before and after bills in the summer time, but my wintertime bills were cheaper AFTER I replaced a propane WH with the Geospring, likely due to less dehumidifier usage.
It's fairly obvious that you don't want to put a HP WH in, and that's fine. If your current WH works fine, I wouldn't replace it either. My old propane unit was 17 years old, and I really wanted to get off the propane. I still have a propane furnace in the basement and a tank in the yard for backup, but haven't used any propane since I took the WH out. For me, it was a no brainer. I've eliminated $50 of propane every month. $600/year pays for a HP WH really quickly, even if it breaks in 5 years. I'd still be ahead.
None if I shut the boiler off.
(boiler is cold start)
But we've found that really isn't practical because every now and then circumstance change and we run out of hot water grandkids taking baths staying overnite, a whole bunch of showers prior to going out to eat instead of in the morning, etc..
I have shut the emergency switch off weeks at a time which saves a bit more and then turn it back on in anticipation of need/use.
In our last house we had a separate electric heater that had it's own meter and power from 9PM to 5AM or so. We'd run out of hot water and sometimes last person to take a shower only took a warm one or none.
We've played the game before so it's really not that much of an inconvenience and it's not an inconvenience very often and we have a back-up if it is.
We don't have to play the wait-for-the-electric-water-heater-to-heat-back-up game and I've played that game in the past too.
maple1
Minister of Fire
Yes, but since you don't have hot water with the boiler turned off (or enough of it) - so how much oil would you burn over the course of a summer? Then since I think the rest of your summer DHW heating is done by solar, the cost of that system would also have to be factored in by someone considering doing that also.
I used oil for 17 years, and did consider updating my oil side with a new efficient boiler and also incorporating some solar thermal when I made my system changes 3 years ago. I concluded those just didn't make sense here $-wise, we got rid of all our oil stuff & replaced with electric resistance. And wood of course. We (family of 5) have no shortage of hot water for $25/mo of $0.18 electricity when just using the electric in the summer - hard to beat when also factoring in capital cost & other factors. Every situation is different though.
velvetfoot
Minister of Fire
I don't know if I said this before, but the pellet boiler, or the oil boiler runs longer (when heating the house)with the indirect buffer tank. I was bothered with what seemed to me like short cycling when we had only oil.
That's why I'm thinkin' Rob's idea of an indirect with electric bkup
is a rational compromise. Plus, I can add a wood boiler down the
pike. Not likely though – limited space. Besides, Mrs Driftwood
may tell me where to pipe those logs.
Here is a better idea. Get a HPWH with an indirect coil in it for back-up. Hubbell Electric hot water heater company are based out of CT. They are built in Massachusetts. You can get a nice big 80 gallon tank (I have the 65). Will you pay more than the GE? Yes, I'm sure but you'll have an American made product. You'll have a local company standing behind it. You'll have back-up from your oil burner in the event of a problem. And you get a cement lined tank that will last 20+ years.
john193
Minister of Fire
I've had my geospring for exactly a year now. I purchased it with the 10 years warranty on labor for another $99, it already comes with 10 years on parts. No issues to report. Have been running on HP mode for the past year. I did once run it on all electric to "exercise" the elements after reading another user had issues here.
My basement is unfinished and unconditioned. The heater is in a utility closet roughly 9 by 9. the geospring has reduced the temp in the room by up to 3 degrees F when running. In the winter when the basement can go as low as 49 it runs longer, I'd guess an hour or so then when the basement is 68 in the summer.
As for electric usage, I seem to be averaging about an extra 100 kW per month in the winter and maybe 50 kW in the summer to run the unit. Less than half of what I paid in oil and I have the added benefit of dehumidification.
My basement is unfinished and unconditioned. The heater is in a utility closet roughly 9 by 9. the geospring has reduced the temp in the room by up to 3 degrees F when running. In the winter when the basement can go as low as 49 it runs longer, I'd guess an hour or so then when the basement is 68 in the summer.
As for electric usage, I seem to be averaging about an extra 100 kW per month in the winter and maybe 50 kW in the summer to run the unit. Less than half of what I paid in oil and I have the added benefit of dehumidification.
maple1
Minister of Fire
and I have the added benefit of dehumidification.
There's the zinger. A pretty understated benefit IMO.
There's the zinger. A pretty understated benefit IMO.
velvetfoot
Minister of Fire
Here is a smoking deal on a HPWH. Of course no warranty, but $500 is cheap. If you could get rebates on this unit it might be almost free.
https://www.gpconservation.com/airg...EuBRj4pZfhuQ83OAg9VSz-wwrmUmTWBx1KBoCJ7zw_wcB
https://www.gpconservation.com/airg...EuBRj4pZfhuQ83OAg9VSz-wwrmUmTWBx1KBoCJ7zw_wcB
john193
Minister of Fire
The utility rebates are tied to serial numbers. I wouldn't chance it. My local lowes had the 50 gallon discounted to 599 for earth day. A fantastic price considering the 400 rebate in my area. But it was very store specific.
The 80 gallon version is only $699. (My 80 gal had a $2100 MSRP).
https://www.gpconservation.com/airgenerate-ati80.html
I get a $300 rebate, so I could get that one for $400 with free shipping. (And no warranty.)
https://www.gpconservation.com/airgenerate-ati80.html
I get a $300 rebate, so I could get that one for $400 with free shipping. (And no warranty.)
That sounds like a great deal, if shipping is free I will look into it, Tie it in series with the geo.
Here is my usage since January 1st. The spikes in Febuary and March are due to me running the 4500 watt elements after having issues with the elements after running the unit in heat pump only mode. I replaced the element in January and will fire the elements twice a month.
So far average cost is $17.04 a month this year and thats with the most expensive electricity in the lower 48 here in CT.
Is that graph just the water heater? If so does it have the option of average usage in the month or just highest day?
semipro
Minister of Fire
These appear to be made in China per Don's post here: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/anyone-buy-an-airtap-lately.68659/#post-867594
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