Shipping Cost -- What to do

Isn't Magnaflex the shipper? Do you mean Magnaflex never paid the carrier? If Magnaflex was the shipper and they never paid the carrier for transportation cost, then it would be marked "freight collect" or some such, not prepaid.

In my experience, either the shipper pays the shipping on such items and the carrier delivers it asking only for a signature, or, it's C.O.D. and I've NEVER seen a common carrier leave anything C.O.D. without collecting a check. IF you owed the carrier any money I'm pretty sure, unless you entered into a contract with the carrier directly, they would have never left the package. I've had common carriers drive away with literally thousands of pounds of steel because the paperwork said it was COD when it was supposed to be third party billing. They'd come back a day later when they figured it all out.
I don't know all the details, I'm in no way a legal expert, but I've been dealing with common carriers for over 20 years and I doubt you own them anything. Sounds like someone is trying to recoop their loses from a business that went under while owing them money.

And:
"Item 110 of the Classification contains the following definitions:

Section 5 (a) A "prepaid shipment" is one on which the charges for transportation service rendered at the request of the consignor, including charges for any accessorial services performed at the request of the consignor, are to be paid by the consignor.

Section 5 (b) A "collect shipment" is one on which the charges for transportation service, including accessorial services rendered at the request of the consignee, or requested by the consignor for the consignee, are to be paid for by the consignee. "

1. The consignor, in a contract of carriage, is the person sending a shipment to be delivered whether by land, sea or air. Some carriers, such as national postal entities, use the term "sender" or "shipper" but in the event of a legal dispute the proper and technical term "consignor" will generally be used.

Taken from:
http://www.parcelindustry.com/ME2/d...91&tier=4&id=AA29BBFA830C47A981BB629996AD513A

lostDuck said:

Could I really be liable to the carrier for a bill of lading marked prepaid that is over 18 months old?

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To answer your question - NO.
If you paid Mangaflex for the product and it included shipping, you are off the hook. If there was a clerical error and the bill of lading was marked wrong, then they could try to get the money from you but a court would not likely find you liable for the error. They probably will try to come after you for the money, which is probably why you are posting. Just say NO.

Yes, I have had fights worth thousands of $ with shipping companies and it's no different from anything else. Know your rights and stand up to their BS. If they send it to collection, you need to send documentation to the collection company with the order for them to stop contacting you.

Check the link I posted. It's a direct quote out of the UCC. Forward the law and a copy of your bill of lading to whoever is harassing you, done. End of story.

Too bad Magnaflex sold out. They were great to deal with IMO. Great price, product and service. I bought a 6" x 20' pre-insulated liner kit and I wanted the chimney top cover to be 18" across instead of the standard size, whatever that is. They shipped out the kit and before I received it they called saying they shipped me the wrong top cover and were gonna send the right one, no charge. Had extra ceramic blanket insulation as packing material in both boxes too!
I would guess the dollar amount they say they are "owed" for shipping a liner is too low for them to bother following their threats out too far, tell 'em to pound sand. Chances are they were paid and just have their records screwed up or are outright trying to get money out of whoever they can to "make up for losses" from other places...it happens. More than one weasel shipping company out their these days! I had a buddy that worked for a trucking Co that contracted to Fed Ex. Some time after my buddy left the Co, he heard the guy lost his biz because he got caught screwin FedEx, IIRC it was for double charging them or some such nonsense. FedEx "took 'em to the cleaners"

Don't turn your back when dealing with an "online broker" either, that's another way to get a good screwin. An example of this would be, say you want to rent a tent for a large party. You get online and find ABCXYZ tent rentals, make arrangements, give them your credit card info and then somebody brings the tent to you in a truck marked "Bubbas tents". ABCXYZ is just an online broker for whatever service/product, they call local vendors to do the work and then often screw them out of their fee. To make matters worse, they usually charge you much more (double) than if you had just dealt directly with Bubbas. I know someone in the porta pottie biz that has had to quit dealing with brokers for this very reason

Sorry, end of my sidetrack excursion...

You've paid for the shipping once, end of story. They are likely just trying to strong arm you into paying. If they attempt to bring you to small claims court I couldn't possibly imagine a judge ruling against you as long as you have proof of payment.

Once a company pays a team of lawyers to make a bunch of nasty collection letters, they use the letters as much as they can. Some people get worried and pay up. For a few bucks in postage, they get a huge payoff.

They may give this to a collection agency who only get paid when they collect. Once again, people desperate for a job work for these agencies and follow orders so they can feed their kids. Don't get angry, don't say a word, just hang up.

We have a VOIP phone and every call I receive gets logged. I gave up on blocking numbers after my blacklist to block callers reached 100 numbers and every call was from a different number. The idiocy of US politics is beyond me. I get calls almost every day telling me to contribute $$ to eliminate the horrible people running the USA. You would think with all this technology they would know that I am in Canada and I have no money and never give anything to politicians (other than my expert opinions). Now we also get calls from local numbers that have been hijacked trying to give me a free trip to Cancun. Free trip, we just need your credit card for security. If I didn't have a business, I'd get rid of all my phones.

The whole world has gone nuts. End of my rant. I feel so much better when I can whack some wood, throw it in the stove and watch it while it burns with a drink in my hands.

No way do I pay this. This is small claims material, and it's very unlikely that a small claims judge is going to rule against a consumer who
has already paid shipping once. It's going to cost that company more than the claim to hire a lawyer to represent them. Make it clear to the company and to any collection agency that it's your position that you owe nothing. The shipper has the burden of proof.

The UCC was drafted for commercial transactions. This is a consumer transaction. Your state probably has a consumer protection office. You might want to contact them for information specific to your state.

How much? out of curiosity

northwinds said:

No way do I pay this. This is small claims material, and it's very unlikely that a small claims judge is going to rule against a consumer who
has already paid shipping once. It's going to cost that company more than the claim to hire a lawyer to represent them. Make it clear to the company and to any collection agency that it's your position that you owe nothing. The shipper has the burden of proof.

The UCC was drafted for commercial transactions. This is a consumer transaction. Your state probably has a consumer protection office. You might want to contact them for information specific to your state.

Click to expand...

This.

northwinds said:

No way do I pay this. This is small claims material, and it's very unlikely that a small claims judge is going to rule against a consumer who
has already paid shipping once. It's going to cost that company more than the claim to hire a lawyer to represent them. Make it clear to the company and to any collection agency that it's your position that you owe nothing. The shipper has the burden of proof.

The UCC was drafted for commercial transactions. This is a consumer transaction. Your state probably has a consumer protection office. You might want to contact them for information specific to your state.

Click to expand...

Magnaflex, a company, contracted with a common carrier (abf, benkins, whoever), also, a company, one that does business in multiple states. Correct?
Bill of lading is filled out per specs of UCC that state the shipper will pay all charges.

So two companies did business across state lines and have a legal contract (bill of lading) stating the shipping company will pay the cost of shipping.

Again. Simple. No need to over complicate things.

sounds like a racket