What exactly is the difference between Cat & Non-Cat

Squisher said:

I don't want my postings misinterpreted, all meant in good fun. Honestly I really wanted a BK king but my chimney couldn'taccommodate it. I am very happy with my stove though, it kicks a ton of heat which was the most important thing to me.

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No offense taken. It's just the internet!

I like the cat option. I got an IS hybrid this year and I gotta admit I love pulling that lever and getting that cat hot. It's pulling heat out of the wood that would have gone up your chimney. This stove is very easy to run. Get the fire going until the probe thermometer hits 500, pull the lever and adjust the air. Done. You can tweak it if you want by adjusting the air but unless I'm gonna be in the den I just set it and let it do it's thing. I'm not trying to get the perfect burn every time.

I haven't found the maintenance to be a burden. I brushed off the cat once, it took a few minutes. No big deal.

This stove is a pleasure to run.

Three letters and a hyphen . . .

I think both style stoves work great.

I have a hybrid. I love having both technologies available. If the cat is being finicky I can just turn the air up a bit and get a nice secondary burn. Usually that just means the cat needs cleaning.

I am a little skeptical about the idea of having a cat only stove. . That is just me. Since I have both now I don't think I would want to go back to a tube stove or go to a full cat. This setup just works very well for me.

I believe we will see more hybrids going forward.

A BK hybrid would be cool. I like both cat and non cat. Its just what works best for you. I dont think a cat stove is any harder to operate having had both, id say its about the same. If you really want consistent long all day burns i think the cat stove is the way to go.

BK has tried sold hybrids in the past and went back to cat only. I am pretty sure they found no benefit to the added secondary tubes, plus it is just one more thing to have to tweak with the tstat.

My hybrid will burn full cat as well.

My problem with full cat mode is the temperature inside the firebox drops to a point where the wood is just giving off its gasses and then turns to a charcoal body. So you have major coal buildup. This is great in the shoulder season so I can keep reloads to 24 hours, but not when it's very cold out. It makes 12 hour reloads difficult because of the coal mass taking up room in the stove.

If I add air and get a little more secondary burn in the cycle it gives me a great 12 hours of heat and my load of wood is burned more completely. I always have plenty of coals for a reload either way.

I know you can turn the air up in a cat only stove too, but then you get more of a non cat burn cycle which takes away the benefit.

It really depends on your heating needs.

begreen said:

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Well Said.

If your heat load is very high a cat stove may not provide any advantage ,if you need to burn it on high all the time.

begreen said:

When it gets cold outside they all start to run about the same.

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You've never owned a cat stove and I've never had to run mine at full throttle but one member @Poindexter has. As I recall, even at 100% output with fans on high he still only reloads three times per day. I do own a noncat and run it hard. Just last night I had to reload after three hours. True there are only so many btu in a # of wood but at high output it seems the noncat is puking that heat up the flue. So I propose that they never run the same.

Babaganoosh said:

I like the cat option. I got an IS hybrid this year and I gotta admit I love pulling that lever and getting that cat hot. It's pulling heat out of the wood that would have gone up your chimney. This stove is very easy to run. Get the fire going until the probe thermometer hits 500, pull the lever and adjust the air. Done. You can tweak it if you want by adjusting the air but unless I'm gonna be in the den I just set it and let it do it's thing. I'm not trying to get the perfect burn every time.

I haven't found the maintenance to be a burden. I brushed off the cat once, it took a few minutes. No big deal.

This stove is a pleasure to run.

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I agree. I havent found there to be any extra burden or complexity running a cat vs non cat. The extra burn time far outweighs the inconvenience of pulling a lever once each burn cycle. Not to mention the constant tweaking trying to keep the non cat in the sweet spot.

Highbeam said:

You've never owned a cat stove and I've never had to run mine at full throttle but one member @Poindexter has. As I recall, even at 100% output with fans on high he still only reloads three times per day. I do own a noncat and run it hard. Just last night I had to reload after three hours. True there are only so many btu in a # of wood but at high output it seems the noncat is puking that heat up the flue. So I propose that they never run the same.

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I agree with this. I dont buy into the theory that all stoves put out the same heat but just distribute it over different time periods. Cat stoves keep more heat in the home due to lower flue temps and velocities. BKs in particular have perfected the art of not sending heat up the flue. My previous non cat was great at blasting heat out of the house.

After reading this thread, I realized that other than possibly in a couple links the answer wasnt really given...

So, to answer the question, a cat stove has a catalytic converter (similar to that in an automobile) placed in the exhaust stream that facilitates the combustion of unburned smoke. A non-cat stove does not.

Having the cat allows the stove to be burned at a lower temperature, while still providing complete combustion, thus a 'clean' burn, of the wood outgas. Thus longer clean burn times are achievable.

Less heat going out of the house means less cold air coming into the house.

It never ceases to amaze me that those people that are supposedly tired of addressing the same question year in and year out insist on clicking on the thread and adding their same old shop-worn 2 cents.

Kinda like working as a barista at Starbucks and insulting the new patrons as they walk in the door for the first time.

billb3 said:

It never ceases to amaze me that those people that are supposedly tired of addressing the same question year in and year out insist on clicking on the thread and adding their same old shop-worn 2 cents.

Kinda like working as a barista at Starbucks and insulting the new patrons as they walk in the door for the first time.

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Personally I don't mind seeing the same questions/discussions come up in forums. It helps move the body of knowledge forward and keep it relevant rather than just ignoring or linking back to past discussions.

As forum members get old and bitter you will see some of them actually posting to a thread to tell someone to use the search function! If you don't like talking about stoves then a stove forum isn't the right place to be. Up next we can start an oak debate!

It's a very relevant topic. I spent months researching wood stoves and weighing different options. If I was going to spend a set amount of money I wanted to get every last bang for my buck I could. People might only buy a new stove every 20-30 years. You might as well get the best of the technology out there.

Highbeam said:

you will see some of them actually posting to a thread to tell someone to use the search function

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Nothing wrong with this, plenty of knowledge already exists on this site, that is why the search function exists.

Time fur an oldie but goodie

Highbeam said:

You've never owned a cat stove and I've never had to run mine at full throttle but one member @Poindexter has. As I recall, even at 100% output with fans on high he still only reloads three times per day.

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When I opened this thread yesterday begreen, Highbeam and begreen again had already posted in it. I figured the OP had a good thorough answer without actually reading the content of their replies and moved on. Now that I have been tagged...

We upgraded from an Ovation Country Flame (c. 2000) non cat stove to a Blaze King Ashford 30 in May of 2014.

Before I carry on, I readily agree the more modern non-cat stoves are "better" or "more controllable" than my 14 year old non-cat model was. However, from reading here about current production non cat stoves I suspect the differences are incremental compared to my old stove. If I was shopping for a non-cat I would look at the NC-30 (Englander I think) first, and look it over hard before I looked at anything else.

Caveat out of the way, I run 7-9 cords per year in 1200 sqft of suburban ranch, 9 month burn season, central Alaska, 5 star plus rated insulation envelope. I ran the BK wide open full throttle for about six weeks in the depth of winter last year, but also enjoyed 24 and 30 hour burns at the tips of the shoulders in May and August.

When I switched stoves I kept the telescoping flue pipe with the same thermometer on it, same hearth, same chimney. But, my youngest daughter also moved out, taking two bushel baskets of hair products with her. I do use an oil burning furnace as backup heat for when the stove is cold, but the same furnace also makes domestic hot water.

I can say, without reservation the BK runs a cooler flue temp than my old non cat did, in all operating conditions. Wide open full throttle maximum heat output on the BK flue temp is ~roughly~ equal to the lowest flue temp I could readily achieve with the non cat running as low as it would go.

Roughly the same heating degree days over the burn season, higher average indoor temperature range on the BK/cat, confounded by the daughter moving out, I burned about 25% less wood in the BK than I did in the older/ obsolete non-cat. Clear advantage BK/ cat.

Second, with the BK I can keep the interior of the house in a +/- 3 dF window for weeks at a time (+79 to +85dF). With the non-cat I was looking at +/- 10 degrees F daily swings, +70dF and +90dF twice a day, every day. Clear advantage BK/cat. I am sure the new non-cat stoves can do better at this than my old one did, but I doubt the technology can do as good as a well managed cat stove no matter how skilled the operator.

I did have to forget everything my grandpa taught me about running smoke dragon stoves. He would have the door open every half hour or so to wiggle the splits around with a poker to keep the burn going just right. With the BK, load it, shut the door and DO NOT OPEN THE DOOR AGAIN until the end of the burn. Just keep your cotton picking hands off the loading door, twiddle the TStat all you want, you'll be fine.

My stove/ my envelope I run a 12 hour burn cycle from about +10 or +15dF down to -30dF or so. Colder than -30dF I do run a hot/fast load of spruce when I get home from work, with full loads of birch on the overnight and workday cycles. Colder than -40dF, full loads of birch at workday and bedtime cycles, with a hot fast load of spruce when I get home from work in the afternoon, and when I get up in the middle of the night to pee. Only had to do that twice last year.

M2c

Highbeam said:

You've never owned a cat stove and I've never had to run mine at full throttle but one member @Poindexter has. As I recall, even at 100% output with fans on high he still only reloads three times per day. I do own a noncat and run it hard. Just last night I had to reload after three hours. True there are only so many btu in a # of wood but at high output it seems the noncat is puking that heat up the flue. So I propose that they never run the same.

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All non cats are not created equal. Iv never had to load my harman 3 times in a 24 hour period, its either one load a day or 2. Then again thats a downdraft top loading stove, so a little different than your run of the mill non cat. IT does seem to go a lot further on a load of wood than my other non cat burn tube stoves but then again it seems like i can get more wood into it.

begreen said:

If one is burning through 3 cu ft of wood in 3 hrs then something is wrong or the stove is being pushed well beyond design capacity.

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Why would you say that? Sounds like an opinion based on? I did it again today, twice.