Max Caddy night timelapse

David_QC · Jan 5, 2016

First night here at -20F,
I'm happy so far with my furnace.. still need some 2-3 years seasonned wood, I didn't had time/money/motivation this year so i'm burning 1 year 18-20% moisture wood.

Here is a timelapse of a cycle from 22h00 to 6h00 in the morning,
Electric back-up is kicking in at 5h15, meaning temp was at 18.5C upstair at this time.

Cycling On/Off start at 2h00 ( see Dwyer )

Video:

Feel free to ask or comment

Steelerguy · Jan 6, 2016

Super Awesome video, did you do that with a phone? Id like to do the same.
I have a Caddy, with Electric Furnace dual set up.
I can keep an 2000sq Ranch at 70 but the damper is open the whole time. set to just under a 1/4 inch.
I have my on/off set at 90/160.
It runs just about constituently all for about 4-5 hrs before needing loaded. 10 degrees out.
wood is 2yrs seasoned oak 15% ish
Good windows but still drafty, I think the roof is needs attention.

David_QC · Jan 6, 2016

Steelerguy said:
Super Awesome video, did you do that with a phone? Id like to do the same.
I have a Caddy, with Electric Furnace dual set up.
I can keep an 2000sq Ranch at 70 but the damper is open the whole time. set to just under a 1/4 inch.
I have my on/off set at 90/160.
It runs just about constituently all for about 4-5 hrs before needing loaded. 10 degrees out.
wood is 2yrs seasoned oak 15% ish
Good windows but still drafty, I think the roof is needs attention.

Camera in a GoPro, set to take picture at every 10sec. with USB connected to power.... and a fan to keep it cool from the heat of the furnace door :- )
I'm sure their is some App to do that on a phone, but you will need lot of memory or a way to transfer them on the fly in a computer. (20go of picture was needed for this video)

On/Off is set to 97/107F... that explain my constant cycling at half of the burn cycle... I can only set the "107" from 107 to 132, and the Off is always 10 degree less. To get to 160F, it would take a bit longer and i'm not sure it would start the blower again after a few hours... have you tried lowering this setting ?

Damper is always a bit open when closed, I have a drilled and tap for a screw in the damper door, It is open maybe 1/8 inch... don't know exactly, I played with the screw quite often and I didn't look at how open it is right now.

I found out that it is working MUCH better when you fill it up until there is no more space to add more split. The damper is full open for 20-30 minutes than close for most of the time, the TSTAT is set to 19C so it call for heat in the end of the burn cycle only.

In the morning or when I get back home, I use the electric 25kw to boost up temp to 20.5C and the caddy keep the house warm with wood only. It takes maybe 30 minutes for the electric heater to do that, from 18.5 to 20.5C.

For the other settings, the mode is Heat, which mean it start at speed #2, unless the plenum temp get higher than 140F and then blower speed up...
When I run wood only like the video, plenum temp never reach more than 120F, most of the time it will be around 110F or cycling...
I can reach 140F when wood is crossed with lot of space or when the Electric kick in and there is still coal.. or if I open the damper for a long time... but I prefer to boost with electric than eating wood and having to reload after 3 hours...

For chimney temp, when I reload, I put 2 or 3 split, then I wait for the chimney temp to be at least 200F before I load it full ( with coal already there ).
Then most of the time the chimey temp is at 160F, then somewhere around 120F when the furnace start cycling... I tried a controller to regulate the temperature to be not less than 150F to help creosote build up, but it was eating wood like hell... so i stopped worrying about creosote... we will see what happen next time I will clean it... (what you guys thinking ??)

Draft was at -0.07 and plenum at 0.22

House is 48 x 32 (exterior dimensions) one and a half with catherdal ceiling in the living room.. all windows are original '77 wood ( I use plastics pellicule on all windows upstair )... there was a Rodent rave party in the attic that i'm still taking care of when I have time... I'm in this house for almost 2 years now... Basement is uninsulated too...

JRHAWK9 · Jan 6, 2016

that is a really cool video, thanks for sharing! Definitely burns different than my Kuuma.

maple1 · Jan 6, 2016

Very cool. I got a neat Nikon camera for Xmas, and I was wondering if I could do something like that when I was reloading my boiler a couple days ago. I should go read the manual...

David_QC · Jan 7, 2016

maple1 said:
Very cool. I got a neat Nikon camera for Xmas, and I was wondering if I could do something like that when I was reloading my boiler a couple days ago. I should go read the manual...

If your camera can do it, You can download GoPro Studio for free, it will do the timelaspe with the pictures even if it's not a GoPro camera. It would be nice to see more video around here... I think the hardest part was to have just enough lighting in my basement to see the furnace without having the front glass reflect everything and not seeing the flames inside...

lexybird · Jan 9, 2016

So far ( my first year with mine heating 2000 sqft ) I seem to get much better results than you get ....however it's not nearly as cold here ( we see around 15-30F) on nights here in northern Pennsylvania so far this year . Usually I load mine at 3:30 in early morning ..work an 11 -12 hour day and come home at 4-4:30 in evening . Always a heavy coal bed the thermostat temp is at same setting I left it at (71/72f) and fan still cycling on low . I see Useable burn times are typically 12-14 hours with good seasoned hardwood on a full load . I can get the 25 k electric unit at cost ( around 750$) but I just don't see a need for it in our climate and electric rates are a ripoff in my opinion to justify it . Now if it was -20 Like you have I could see it burning 8 hours instead but then again that is asking alot out of any typical air furnace to heat a 2000+ sqft home in a frigid windy climate below zero for extended times I don't care what anybody says .its a wonderful clean burning easy to run high tech unit . Personally I'd rather have this extra size and automated variable speed fan than say a smaller More temperamental furnace like a kumma

David_QC · Jan 9, 2016

lexybird said:
So far ( my first year with mine heating 2000 sqft ) I seem to get much better results than you get ....however it's not nearly as cold here ( we see around 15-30F) on nights here in northern Pennsylvania so far this year . Usually I load mine at 3:30 in early morning ..work an 11 -12 hour day and come home at 4-4:30 in evening . Always a heavy coal bed the thermostat temp is at same setting I left it at (71/72f) and fan still cycling on low . I see Useable burn times are typically 12-14 hours with good seasoned hardwood on a full load . I can get the 25 k electric unit at cost ( around 750$) but I just don't see a need for it in our climate and electric rates are a ripoff in my opinion to justify it . Now if it was -20 Like you have I could see it burning 8 hours instead but then again that is asking alot out of any typical air furnace to heat a 2000+ sqft home in a frigid windy climate below zero for extended times I don't care what anybody says .its a wonderful clean burning easy to run high tech unit . Personally I'd rather have this extra size and automated variable speed fan than say a smaller More temperamental furnace like a kumma

Interresting, my brother who have the Caddy is telling me the same thing, he get better result than me with his smaller unit.. could be wood, could be how 'Cold' I run it too... Still need to do some tests to improve.. tonight I will try running it hotter and longer at first before closing damper and will close damper air tight.

I will post the timelapse of the result to compare

-Edit : Started timelapse, it is around 0C / 32F, I filled it up like last video, changed Kick in Temp from 107F to 120F and Fan speed from no.2 to no. 1 and the damper will close air tight (factory default)

Edit 2: Forget that with damper air tight, i'm losing secondary quickly...

JRHAWK9 · Jan 9, 2016

lexybird said:
Personally I'd rather have this extra size and automated variable speed fan than say a smaller More temperamental furnace like a kumma

The automated variable speed fan would be awesome for sure, although the temperamental part I don't see

STIHLY DAN · Jan 9, 2016

I'll stick with variable burn over variable fan all day.

lexybird · Jan 9, 2016

I'm basing that off the thread with people having the cycling issues with their kummas and low house temps and burn times , I'll take the 14 hour clean burns with a 5 cubic foot firebox . Not trying to start anything it was just a personal opinion I had on what I prefer in a furnace and my experiences show size matters when the Mercury drops and my work schedule demands a large furnace that heats for long burn times past 10 hour mark ....now for original poster David Qc ....I have the max caddy not a regular caddy .there is probably a lot more in your unit to be had after some trial and error .

brenndatomu · Jan 9, 2016

David_QC said:
Forget that with damper air tight, i'm losing secondary quickly...

That is telltale of either wet wood or low chimney draft...
If the firebox is up to temp when the damper is closed, the wood is good and dry, and you have -.04 to -.06"WC draft...you won't lose secondary burn until the wood is done out-gassing (couple hours at least)

David_QC · Jan 10, 2016

brenndatomu said:
That is telltale of either wet wood or low chimney draft...
If the firebox is up to temp when the damper is closed, the wood is good and dry, and you have -.04 to -.06"WC draft...you won't lose secondary burn until the wood is done out-gassing (couple hours at least)

It is what I think too... I will have to wait 2 winter from now to get better results, this spring I will have space/money/time to have enough wood for 2 years... I'm still happy with results I have, could be worst... I'm definelty saving money and have better comfort than my last Oil furnace.

Below is the last night time lapse... not much difference in my opinion... just good to compare apple with apple when talking about outside temperature. All night was 0C, Furnace started at 20C and went up to 24C and then back to 20C in the morning. ( The kid wireles temp sensor is 1C Off )
First video on the thread the damper was open 30 minutes, here is about 60 minutes...
TSTAT never called for heat...

Here are some pictures to show
1. when i closed the damper air tight... I shimed it open after that for the remaining burn cycle... wasn't a good idea...
2. A random picture in idle mode to show draft and flue temp (195F / -0.07)
3. remaining coal before and after racking it.

laynes69 · Jan 10, 2016

You should only need 10 to 15 minutes of the damper open to establish the fire. I've found you don't need a raging fire to burn cleanly, and if the damper remains open too long initially it will affect the length of burn. As your wood improves, performance will improve.

JRHAWK9 · Jan 10, 2016

lexybird said:
I'm basing that off the thread with people having the cycling issues with their kummas and low house temps and burn times , I'll take the 14 hour clean burns with a 5 cubic foot firebox . Not trying to start anything it was just a personal opinion I had on what I prefer in a furnace and my experiences show size matters when the Mercury drops and my work schedule demands a large furnace that heats for long burn times past 10 hour mark ....now for original poster David Qc ....I have the max caddy not a regular caddy .there is probably a lot more in your unit to be had after some trial and error .

I think a lot of what was posted on here (minus the obvious DOA components which were replaced ASAP by Lamppa) are people trying to get their system setup correctly and dialed in for their own situation, as everybody's situation is different. They are just doing so via the forum. I know when I had questions last winter when getting mine dialed in I'd either do it via PM or call Daryl directly.

Having said that, with your temps and size house, IMO, you made a good choice. The Max Caddy is capable of putting out more heat, hence, consuming more wood.....which is not a bad thing if your situation requires it.

lexybird · Jan 10, 2016

ll can tell you from experience on mine if that damper opens your secondary's are gone . If your wood is dry you should be able to close off the damper ( I drop my digital thermostat down one degree below the current house temp ) in 10-15 minutes . Then you should get a couple hours of secondary's flaring off .secobdary combustion adds hours to a burn time and saves wood . Two things that will kill secondary combustion : wet wood being number one and having a demand that opens up your damper . The longer that damper is down the longer your burn . These must have dry seasoned wood to get the awesome effiency we all love

STIHLY DAN · Jan 10, 2016

Ahh, that's not so easy. Flue gasses burn at different temps, the highest I believe is 1,800 degrees so your damper may need to open a bit during secondary burn to keep internals hot enough to burn all the gasses. A small amount of air at the coals should not stop secondary burn at the top of the unit. Close damper when temps stabilize at a high enough temp.

sloeffle · Jan 11, 2016

lexybird said:
ll can tell you from experience on mine if that damper opens your secondary's are gone . If your wood is dry you should be able to close off the damper ( I drop my digital thermostat down one degree below the current house temp ) in 10-15 minutes . Then you should get a couple hours of secondary's flaring off .secobdary combustion adds hours to a burn time and saves wood . Two things that will kill secondary combustion : wet wood being number one and having a demand that opens up your damper . The longer that damper is down the longer your burn . These must have dry seasoned wood to get the awesome effiency we all love

In the past two years I have been unable to find that magic. My wood is a two - three year old mix of split and stacked hardwoods. Mostly ash due to EAB. Finally got a manometer hooked up and have my barometric damper dialed in.

When I start a fire I will run the damper wide open for about 10 - 15 minutes. If it shut the damper down completely the furnace will generally run for another 30 minutes or so and eventually kick off. I usually have to use a small finish nail to prop open the damper to keep it going. On the Tundra thread some guys were saying that they were having better luck loading the furnace all of the way vs half or one-third of the way. Are you essentially doing a batch burn ? You load er up and don't touch until that load is fully burned. I generally only load my furnace about one-third of the way and then add wood as needed.

David_QC · Jan 11, 2016

sloeffle said:
On the Tundra thread some guys were saying that they were having better luck loading the furnace all of the way vs half or one-third of the way. Are you essentially doing a batch burn ? You load er up and don't touch until that load is fully burned. I generally only load my furnace about one-third of the way and then add wood as needed.

In my young furnace padawan experience, It works much better when I fill it up... I feel like when there is not much space for gaz to circulate on top (when furnace is full) it is then easier for the gaz to get hot and getting hit by flames with wood close to the tubes to ignite it... would be nice to try raising a one-third load close to the tubes to confirm my theory :- P

Full and with a good bed of ash... try it :- )

brenndatomu · Jan 11, 2016

I was looking at the Max Caddy/HeatPro specs over the weekend. I found it interesting that the firebox on the Max Caddy/HP is actually shorter (height) than the original Caddy box. Over the years I have noticed that it is easier to get/keep secondary burn going on a partially filled firebox if it is short n wide (Max) VS tall n skinny (Caddy)...just sayin...

brenndatomu · Jan 11, 2016

David_QC said:
In my young furnace padawan experience, It works much better when I fill it up... I feel like when there is not much space for gaz to circulate on top (when furnace is full) it is then easier for the gaz to get hot and getting hit by flames with wood close to the tubes to ignite it... would be nice to try raising a one-third load close to the tubes to confirm my theory :- P

Full and with a good bed of ash... try it :- )

Yup, If I let the ashes build up big time, say 4-5" deep, and then throw in 4 splits, it burns real nice, with only 2" of ashes, not nearly as well.
FYI this is in a Tundra...

lexybird · Jan 11, 2016

For a comparison sake I'll give you what I experienced with mine in our coldest day ( today) so far here in northwestern pa in my 2,000 sq ft split level house. I have 20" of cellulose blown in the attic and new argon Windows . I saw it was going to be a high of 16 today and windy so I filled the firebox to the gills at 3:25 am this morning. This was the first time I actually filled it all the way up to the top so I wasn't sure what to expect . I have a webcam aimed at my furnace front so I can moniter temperatures and see the status of the furnace anytime in my iPhone at work ( love having that giant glass door to see everything) . At approximately 6:35 ( secondary's were still rolling great 3 hours into the burn ) my load peaked and held over 600 degrees on front of furnace above damper till about 9:30 ish then it gradually tapered down every hour to about 275 degrees to the time I came home at 4:05 pm .(12.50 hours total) I had the thermostat upstairs set for. 70 degrees before I left in the morning when I arrived it was actually 5 degrees warmer at 75 degrees on my Honeywell focus pro . It was calm and 14 degrees outside at 4:05pm today . I had approximately 4" thick of glowing cherry coals on the floor of the firebox with some partial log pieces I could have likely got another 2 hours of heat from the unit .wood was packed with cherry slabs two large hunks of beech and several 6" round diameter logs of maple. Not nearly as cold as your getting there of coarse but it's the closest comparison I could do this year so far in my climate

brenndatomu · Jan 11, 2016

lexybird said:
75 degrees on my Honeywell focus pro . It was calm and 14 degrees outside at 4:05pm today . I had approximately 4" thick of glowing cherry coals on the floor of the firebox with some partial log pieces I could have likely got another 2 hours of heat from the unit

Dang it man! Tell me you didn't reload at 75*! !!!

Man, here I'm feeling like running a 10 hour load and still being within 1-2* of tstat setting was really doing something...then I sit down n read this!

We were a couple degrees warmer than you today, but kinda windy...very raw feeling! I'm guessing 0* with wind chill

lexybird · Jan 11, 2016

brenndatomu said:
Dang it man! Tell me you didn't reload at 75*!
Man, here I'm feeling like running a 10 hour load and still being within 1-2* of tstat setting was really doing something...then I sit down n read this!
We were a couple degrees warmer than you today, but kinda windy...very raw feeling! I'm guessing 0* with wind chill

sorry Dave I regret to inform you I did reload even though it was 75 lol I figure I got plenty of wood might as well waste it . Wife likes to be toasty and baby has a cold lately so I wanted it Comfy

sloeffle · Jan 11, 2016

Sometimes I wish I would of gotten the Max Caddy. I am jealous of your burn times. I couldn't justify having that and a geothermal furnace. Our house is 2200sq ft ( newer house ) and on days like today ( 9F this morning ) the Caddy can keep up but it runs pretty much runs all day. Woke up at 3AM and threw a couple splits in and the house was 67. The house got down to 65 around 730 and I was finally able to get it up 70ish around noon or so.

Been playing around with loading it differently. Normally I rake all of the coals to the front and then load the wood behind it. Per @brenndatomu last post I raked all of the coals out, loaded er about 5/8 full, opened the damper about a 1/4" for 10 - 15 mins and shut the damper down. Furnace has been running for about an hour now with the damper shut and seems to be putting off some pretty good heat. Fingers crossed.

Max Caddy night timelapse

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