Englander pdv-25 steel wool mod.

  • Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.

    We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.

    We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
Carbon will take longer than that to build up. Usually a week and it was mounded up so much the auger started scraping.
Maybe you'll get lucky...
 
OK guys I'm going to add to the conversation. I have the Hillman plugs in my pdv and I do notice more heat with a higher flame. But, I still have a molten mass of clinkers and unburned pellets. Clean stove, setting on C and running on feed 6 fan on 8. Am I missing something or doing something wrong.

Possibly. from what i've been reading here I gather the PDV has more than just 2 holes under the burn plate. Someone mentioned there are holes above the burn plate too. Investigate other causes first. I know you said your stove was clean. How are the gaskets? dollar bill test? venting? too many 90 deg elbows etc? See basically you want to fine tune the stove as best you can before trying this. This has improved my pdvc but only after it was running as good as i was going to get it without this.

This doesnt turn it into a high end stove. the burnpot still needs to be cleaned out periodically. It will still fill with ash. Depends on the pellets but you could still have clinkers. What we're trying to do here is to direct as much of the air as possible right through the pellets in the pot.

I'm more than a week into it and its def. putting out more heat with less pellets. I dont have your particular model. maybe someone with the PDV can chime in. They are similar but not exactly alike.
 
Carbon will take longer than that to build up. Usually a week and it was mounded up so much the auger started scraping.
Maybe you'll get lucky...
Thanks, I will keep an eye on it. When mine starts to build up it starts to make a squeaking sound when it rubs so i'll def. be paying attention to it.
 
OK guys I'm going to add to the conversation. I have the Hillman plugs in my pdv and I do notice more heat with a higher flame. But, I still have a molten mass of clinkers and unburned pellets. Clean stove, setting on C and running on feed 6 fan on 8. Am I missing something or doing something wrong.

What pellets are you using?
And as stated earlier, plugging the holes does not garuntee anything. It helps to a dagree. But does not make everything better.
 
Update: well my foil tape idea from my previous post worked great, but it didnt last long. This morning when i shut down to check the burnpot and check for any increase in carbon deposits, the foil was crispy. I dont think its designed for that high of a heat. so now i have to figure out some other way to close them. Learning to weld has been on my to do list for a while, but not in the middle of winter. i think in the spring I might actually pick up a small mig welder and give it a go. I could do so much more if i had this capability.

for now i'll have to resort to just putting 2 bolts though to reduce the airflow in that spot.

btw there was no additional carbon deposits. In fact there wasnt any at all ever since i've plugged the 2 holes under the burn plate.

Partially plugging those 2 holes will help a bit but plugging them completely will not help.
Until you run the stove for a week without plugging and unplugging, it is going to be very hard for you to give any accurate info on how its going to respond.

What you plug may work excellent with the brand pellet you burn. At the same time, another guy will plug the same hole and wonder what he is doing wrong because it only made his stove burn worse. The pellets being used will play a major part in this.
 
What pellets are you using?
And as stated earlier, plugging the holes does not garuntee anything. It helps to a dagree. But does not make everything better.
I am using Hammers. I definitely butns hotter but fills with moten material then the heat drops until I clean out the pot then it cranks up again
 
I am using Hammers. I definitely butns hotter but fills with moten material then the heat drops until I clean out the pot then it cranks up again

I cannot comment on the hamers but i hear they are good.
Some pellets burn much faster compared to other pellets. So maybe try another good pellet just for comparison sake.
 
I've been plugging mine since I first started running it over night in November. Prior I was getting a huge pile of clinkers/lava/whatever after an over night run. Enough to make it appear as if 1/3 of the auger was covered. I was surprised the stove was still running. That was after 10 hours or so. Not to mention the glass going from entirely clean to half covered with black soot in the period, too. With the steel wool in place below the wear plate in both holes, after about 10 hours, the clinkers/lava was greatly reduced but still needed to be broken up and removed, and the glass only had the light haze to it.

We'll never get away from 2-3x daily burn pot cleaning with this mod, but it really does help the stove run better. In a pinch, one could probably let the stove go for 24 hours without a scraping, but that would be pushing it.

The steel wool needed to be replaced about every week or two, although it seemed if I made the ball denser it would last a bit longer. I tried to find some Hillman plugs as suggested here but couldn't find any that fit (store selection wasn't good and I didn't feel like making multiple trips). So on Saturday I found some gasket cement I had from doing the top gasket on my old VC Vigilant. I smeared that all over one side of a quarter and stuck it too the hole, on both sides. Use some additional cement and applied it with my finger around the quarter to seal it in further. A US 25 cent quarter is slightly larger than the holes, so it seemed to seal just fine. I let it sit about and hour per the cement instructions, then fired it up. We'll see how long that will last. The cement tube said it was good to 2000 degrees. After 2.5 days it seems to be holding up. Time will tell...

There's a possibility the cement won't stick to the metal very well. If so, I'll try some copper-based automotive exhaust gasket maker.

Note: my stove was built in late 2014. I think the older burn pots had more holes, different size holes, etc.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1Oldguy
Just a suggestion here, you guys should specify which holes you are saying you plugged.. along with a quick picture if possible. Just for the new guys or less mechanically inclined viewing these discusions.. i only say this because so far there are 3 different areas of holes discussed here so far. Hate to have someone join just to say we broke their stove.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1Oldguy
So after a few days I noticed a huge difference in the stoves performance.. The ash build up in general has gone down tremendously and the heat output has definitely increased.. Running the stove In C mode I can run the stove on feed rate 3 or 4 and keep my house really warm, even when it's windy and freezing out.. So I will say it's worth it, I'm burning way less fuel and have a lot less ash.. Never mind the stove can go a easy 12 hours with out the burn pot being cleaned out..
 
This is what I did to mine. Two metal clips to cover the holes and a new burn plate with sides, it works really well on low and on high.
 

Attachments

  • DSC01739.JPG
    DSC01739.JPG
    102.9 KB · Views: 574
  • Like
Reactions: Hot Foot
This is what I did to mine. Two metal clips to cover the holes and a new burn plate with sides, it works really well on low and on high.
Looks nice.
Other than blocking the two large air holes, how does the redesigned wear plate improve your burn?
 
The burn plate works well I tried about 6 different designs this one has bigger holes 3/16 in the center and a few 1/8 hole close to the auger. The slanted sides keep the fire centered so the stove burns at very low settings heat level1 with the lowers at 2 4 1 I do this when its 40 degrees outside with the stock plate the fire would go out. Most time I have the lower setting at 5 4 1. it all depends how much heat I need. The other thing I do is I limit the amount of air entering the stove with a gate valve. I know that I most likely would no longer meet emissions but the exhaust temps with out the valve is 400 degrees plus when on high, by limiting air keep more heat in the stove.
John
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hot Foot
This is what I did to mine. Two metal clips to cover the holes and a new burn plate with sides, it works really well on low and on high.

I kind of wish i had the burn pots you guys have to work with. What you guys are esentially doing is incorporating your larger burn plate with the old style burn pot.
There isnt a whole lot i can do to mine without pulling out the grinder with a cutting disc and being creative with the welder... but just in case you are curious now, i do not have those large holes above or below in mine. Just some 3/16" holes across both top sides of the pot and 2- 1/2" or so holes just below the auger. Along with the few holes in the burn plate itself. But not a single hole beneath the actual pile of pellets. Its much harder to explain than it seemed. :rolleyes:
 
Thought you guys might be interested in this. You may have seen it already but for those who havnt. if you take time to read thru it, it gives some pretty good info and answers to alot of the questions asked lately.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/25-pdvcs-original-burn-pot.123615/
Ok , I made the prototype 1 which restricts to burn area down to a 3"x3" burn area along with closing off the air hole outside this area. I must say there is a better flame and more heat now. But when I checked on it after a 8 hour burn the new burn area was full and over flowing with a molten mass and clinkers . I could not even see the bottom auger , it was completely covered and pushing pellets under the mass. I am going to list this as a fail. Wondering is Cladmaster had the same result on the 1st prototype? Also if the bottom auger is buried can you get a back fire up through to the hopper?
 
Ok , I made the prototype 1 which restricts to burn area down to a 3"x3" burn area along with closing off the air hole outside this area. I must say there is a better flame and more heat now. But when I checked on it after a 8 hour burn the new burn area was full and over flowing with a molten mass and clinkers . I could not even see the bottom auger , it was completely covered and pushing pellets under the mass. I am going to list this as a fail. Wondering is Cladmaster had the same result on the 1st prototype? Also if the bottom auger is buried can you get a back fire up through to the hopper?

If it continues to feed long enough without the fire going out i would say it is very possible for the pellets to catch inside the auger.
 
If it continues to feed long enough without the fire going out i would say it is very possible for the pellets to catch inside the auger.
Kinda what I thought. Just hope with all the info going around here no one has a fire. I still think my issue is that I'm not getting enough air to blow out the ash. There is no way to turn up the combustion air , correct?
 
Kinda what I thought. Just hope with all the info going around here no one has a fire. I still think my issue is that I'm not getting enough air to blow out the ash. There is no way to turn up the combustion air , correct?

Thats why i proposed everyone included pics and details on which holes they refer too as well. ...
It is to my understanding the combustion blower is running at 80% speed on the lower heat range with the factory settings and increases with the heat range.

Making a good seal between the pot and the new burn plate will help put the air thru the plate instead of around it too.
 
Thats why i proposed everyone included pics and details on which holes they refer too as well. ...
It is to my understanding the combustion blower is running at 80% speed on the lower heat range with the factory settings and increases with the heat range.

Making a good seal between the pot and the new burn plate will help put the air thru the plate instead of around it too.
Agreed, the plate that I built was out of 1/4 " plate steel welded and set on top of the original burn plate and covered it completely . I had what I think is a very good seal. It just seems to be pushing more pellets then it can burn completely, so they start to pile up. I'm wondering if I need to lower the burn plate so the pellets drop in. I should mention to that I am running in c mode and settings are 641 and heat is on 4 and fan on 7 if that helps. Also burning Hammers
 
Agreed, the plate that I built was out of 1/4 " plate steel welded and set on top of the original burn plate and covered it completely . I had what I think is a very good seal. It just seems to be pushing more pellets then it can burn completely, so they start to pile up. I'm wondering if I need to lower the burn plate so the pellets drop in. I should mention to that I am running in c mode and settings are 641 and heat is on 4 and fan on 7 if that helps. Also burning Hammers

You would need to make a burn plate that takes the place of the original instead of doubling it up.
 
You would need to make a burn plate that takes the place of the original instead of doubling it up.
That's what I'm thinking. In everyone's opinion would making the holes in the burn plate larger help or hurt the air flow. I would think a larger hole would allow more air to the pellets but might decrease the velocity. Thoughts
 
That's what I'm thinking. In everyone's opinion would making the holes in the burn plate larger help or hurt the air flow. I would think a larger hole would allow more air to the pellets but might decrease the velocity. Thoughts

You are thinking correctly :) smaller means plugging faster but bigger decreases the ability of the air to blow away ashes. But this will also depend on the number of holes drilled and the locations. Most of mine are 3/16". And those are factory holes. I have added more 1/8" and plugged others. Its all a guessing game until the right combo is found.