Too many coals???

Smokeless said:

Been burning 24/7, crazy cold snap here in CT...
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Am I doing something wrong? Not enough air, etc?

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My RSF Onyx has no adjustment for primary air, just a fixed size hole. I had to drill it out from 3/8 to 5/8 to get more air to the coals. I'm thinking about drilling it out bigger still and putting an adjuster on it.

Now I can rake the coals to the front where the air wash and the primary air jet hits them and they burn down quicker. Laying smaller splits on top of the coals in such a way that plenty of air can still get at them helps too.

I find that removing the ashes also helps to burn down the coals and it helps to extract more heat from the stove. I move the coals to one side and shovel out the ashes, then move them to the other side to get the rest.

Glad to read others dealing with coal build up.

I had a small insert and had to scoop coals out by mid-afternoon on cold days here. Hated doing it but tried many ways to deal with them but none solved the problem. Being home all day makes a difference in how I burn wood. One load in the morning will not get house temps. up to a comfortable level. If I leave it it will burn down and leave minimal coals - which can be done on mild days.

Anyway, last winter I bought a larger insert thinking it would solve the coaling problems....it didn't.

Moral of this saga is that, like a baby, my insert needs attention throughout the burn cycle in order for me to get the most out of my fuel....

I can shut down the air once the unit is hot enough but then I have to start opening it back up once the coaling stage hits and the temp. begins to drop.

I also have to go in and rake the coals forward at some point - I play it by ear/eye - to get them to burn down more.

THe video someone added to this thread about throwing one log on at a time sounds good and I will have to give it a try. I know I would do that with my old insert but after reading here that anything less than 3 pieces of wood put on a time is a waste of wood I felt like I had been doing it 'wrong'. Now I feel like I have 'permission' to use that method again.

This being my second insert has taught me that different stoves/inserts operate differently and that there are a lot of factors involved. There are no simple solutions and practice over time seems to be what gets things done. I am so grateful for this forum because it gives me lots of things to try that I would never think of on my own....Great experience and lots of comfort knowing I am not the only one fumbling around playing with fire. :ahhh:

I love having a bed of coals. I stir them a bit, pulling the hot coals up from the ash, Pull it toward the front of the stove pile on more wood and get it burning much faster. much easier than startign from a cold stove and I think the coals make your stove hotter over all because your stove hasn't eaten all the fuel yet.after 6 hours I will have a big bed of coals. but by 8 hours(when I wake up) it's usually down to almost nothing. I need a bigger stove.

DavidV said:

I love having a bed of coals...

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I think maybe you missed the point. The OP is running out of room in the firebox for more wood until the coals burn down to make room.

I have only had this problem under two conditions (burning a Jotul 3). In cold weather I have tried to keep heat output at max. all the time by cramming more wood into the firebox as soon as it has burned down a little bit. Not surprisingly, I did get a coal buildup. I found that by opening the draft more and just waiting for the coals to burn down more was the only solution. The other concition where I had coal buildup was when burning cherry at night with the draft cut back. Cherry coals like crazy. Makes for a good all night wood, but builds up an excess of coal if used continuously. If I could only burn one species of wood it would be oak. Good dry oak gives off a lot of heat, lasts well and produces coals that burn down fairly quickly.

grizzly2 said:

I have only had this problem under two conditions (burning a Jotul 3). In cold weather I have tried to keep heat output at max. all the time by cramming more wood into the firebox as soon as it has burned down a little bit. Not surprisingly, I did get a coal buildup. I found that by opening the draft more and just waiting for the coals to burn down more was the only solution. The other concition where I had coal buildup was when burning cherry at night with the draft cut back. Cherry coals like crazy. Makes for a good all night wood, but builds up an excess of coal if used continuously. If I could only burn one species of wood it would be oak. Good dry oak gives off a lot of heat, lasts well and produces coals that burn down fairly quickly.

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Interesting about the cherry. I don't have any of that, but I do have some apple I won't be using until next year. Does that do the same? In other words, is three something about fruit trees, or only stone fruit trees, or it's just sort of random?

I have never burned apple. Chery is the only wood I have run accross that coals up significntly. I have also burned significant amounts of oak, hard maple, soft maple, beach, poplar and white birch. I have burned a little cedar, pine, basswood, box elder, ironwood and hickory. Ironwood is the longest lasting of all, and burns slowly giving off a lot of heat, but even it doesn't seem to stay in the coal stage as long as chery. There are some advantages to most of the hardwoods I have burned. Idealy I would like to have soft maple to light a fire with, ironwood for daytime burning, and chery for overnight. This isn't practical where I live because ironwood is rare and chery is a valuable cabinet and furniture wood. Hickory is very good but also has high commercial value. We have a lot of oak and hard maple around here and I do burn alot of them.

No need for more wood to "burn down the coal bed". That's sort of like eating ice cream because you can burn a lot of fat with those extra calories.

Just pull the coals forward, open the primary air, and it will burn through the coals faster and generate more temperature.

Adios Pantalones said:

No need for more wood to "burn down the coal bed". That's sort of like eating ice cream because you can burn a lot of fat with those extra calories.

Just pull the coals forward, open the primary air, and it will burn through the coals faster and generate more temperature.

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From the experimenting I've been doing with this over the last several days, it appears to me the key using this tactic is to do it before those surface of coals starts to turn to ash on its own and the stove temp starts to drop very much. If I can catch it at just that point and open the primary back up completely, I get another hour of 400-plus out of the stove and the coals really burn down to ash very efficiently.

If you wait until you've got a mess of small hot coals, charcoal and ash and the stove temp is way down, it doesn't really work-- at least with my wood and my set-up.

It also seems to me that once you've got lots of actual chunks of charcoal, it's much more difficult to get burned down. I don't have much success with burning those down by putting a few dry splits in and letting 'er rip. If a bunch of that has formed during the day because I've been out for a long time or ignored the stove, I've got to build up a fire pretty much like starting from scratch since they're not hot enough to ignite a big chunk. But once I've reestabilshed a good fire and high temps, the charcoal burns up pretty much on its own.

So at this point, first thing in the morning after a slow overnight burn is the main time I have a problem, and then the only option is to get a few shovelfuls of them out of there in order to make room for the day's accumulation of ash.

Two years ago, I spent several weeks playing around with various methods for burning down oversized coal beds in my Regency F2400. The most effective solution I could find is the 'wind tunnel' method:
1) Make sure draft is fully open
2) Push hot coals to the sides of the firebox, creating a deep tunnel which runs from the front to the back of the firebox
3) Place 1 medium to large split across the tunnel, near the back of the firebox.
As the new split burns, combustion air is drawn from the airwash down the entire length of the tunnel, behind the split, and past the secondary air tubes. This produces a very hot, clean burn which will reduce an oversized coal bed to proper size in about 2 hours. Using this method, I was able to raise my house temperature from 69F to 77F while outside temperature was -4F.
If you try this, I'd be interested to hear how it works for you.

Blaine said:

The most effective solution I could find is the 'wind tunnel' method:

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My primary air injector is front and centre which naturally creates a burn tunnel that combines with the air wash system. I routinely run the poker through the ashes to keep it open. What you, I, and others have discovered is that the coals need an abundant supply of air.

Separating the coals from the ashes helps give them air so it is the ashes I shove off to the side and back. Just running the poker casues the lumps of coal to "float" to the top where they can get air. If/when I have an overabundance of coals, I drag them into the tunnel as air can still get around them.

Blaine said:

Two years ago, I spent several weeks playing around with various methods for burning down oversized coal beds in my Regency F2400. The most effective solution I could find is the 'wind tunnel' method:
1) Make sure draft is fully open
2) Push hot coals to the sides of the firebox, creating a deep tunnel which runs from the front to the back of the firebox
3) Place 1 medium to large split across the tunnel, near the back of the firebox.
As the new split burns, combustion air is drawn from the airwash down the entire length of the tunnel, behind the split, and past the secondary air tubes. This produces a very hot, clean burn which will reduce an oversized coal bed to proper size in about 2 hours. Using this method, I was able to raise my house temperature from 69F to 77F while outside temperature was -4F.
If you try this, I'd be interested to hear how it works for you.

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Oh, good idea. I will try this and let you know for sure.

As Glacialhills said rake the coals forward near the air intake making sure the ash is removed and put a split on that has poor coaling qualities and keep the air lever open 100% to reduce the coal base. The other option is to remove the excess coals, transfer them in your ash bucket and use the overflow of coals to cook a meal in a cast iron camp style dutch oven outdoors.

JBinKC said:

As Glacialhills said rake the coals forward near the air intake making sure the ash is removed and put a split on that has poor coaling qualities and keep the air lever open 100% to reduce the coal base. The other option is to remove the excess coals, transfer them in your ash bucket and use the overflow of coals to cook a meal in a cast iron camp style dutch oven outdoors.

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In the tiny Tribute, the entire firebox floor is near the air intake. ;-)

Adios Pantalones said:

No need for more wood to "burn down the coal bed". That's sort of like eating ice cream because you can burn a lot of fat with those extra calories.

Just pull the coals forward, open the primary air, and it will burn through the coals faster and generate more temperature.

Click to expand...

I'm burning cherry almost exclusively right now (lost a couple of huge old cherry trees in a bad winter storm a couple of years back) and it does tend to coal up a LOT. But I agree completely with the advice above. I just rake the hot coals forward and open up the air and that seems to do the trick. The temp goes up and the coals burn down. Sometimes it will take a couple of rakings over 2 - 3 hours if the coals have really built up heavy.

Wrigley said:

Adios Pantalones said:

No need for more wood to "burn down the coal bed"...

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...I agree completely with the advice above.

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I disagree. A select split properly placed will induce more air flow and reduce the amount of coals rather than add to it.

Here is anecdotal evidence:
http://www.woodheat.org/tips/toomuchcharcoal.htm

I am already weary from running my Hearthstone Heritage. It is an EPA soapstone model that looks great and runs beautifully when fired with an empty, clean, chamber. The stove is soapstone, and has a shallow design north/south, with the longer dimension east/west. I am heating an 1800 square foot home, well within its capacity rating. For an evening burn I load the stove up fully. I get it into the gasification stage of the burn, and then throttle it back for the night. I can get about 6 hours out of it like this with a warm house. My problem is excessive coaling. I have read and tried every trick I can find, to no avail. The stove leaves a bed of coals that vary from coarse to fine as they burn. I can rake the course pile towards the front air intake and get more heat, but instead of reducing to ash the pile yields finer and finer coals that just choke out the burn. Every day I have to empty out a large pile of small coals and restart the stove from cold. I am wasting wood and carrying a pan of hot coals through the house to my ash can. I am now considering getting rid of this stove and going with a catalytic. Are there any other tricks for this stove? I do not have a ready supply of pine tinder to use to burn out the coals. Thanks for any advice -

A very frustrated wood stove operator.

After an overnight burn, I, too, have a good amount of coals - some that aren't all that hot. If I am going to be home for a few hours I will rake most of these to the front (where the main air feed is on my Quadrafire 4100i) and then place a medium size split either N/S across these coals, or E/W behind them. I then let this burn with my primary air mostly open. This rapid combustion seems to burn down the coals fairly well, as well as keep the firebox hot and throw some heat. As others have suggested, once that split has gone to coaling stage I will open my primary control all the way and try to get that to burn down well before I load up again - either the same sequence, or load it right up for a long burn. The single split on a piled coal bed, burned mostly wide open, works well for me to get the coals burned down.

MarkG

I have a bucket with lid, I don't mess around, I shovel the dang coals outta the stove and make room for more WOOD!

Done deal, lickety split, over and out.

Why play? Just leave enough of the nasty little glowin' hunks in there to fire up another load!

I had the same problem with coals with my jotul 100. I'd need to add firewood to kick out more heat and couldn't wait for the coals to burn down because the house would chill down too much in the waiting. They'd quickly build up when it was real cold out and before long I was out of room for more firewood. The stove was too small for the house and I needed to have a constant peak burn for the deep cold.

Since I've moved up in size to the castine I've had no such problem this season. By loading larger as well as more splits I'm kicking out more heat, and when the fire dies down to coals, because of the larger splits and volume, that coal bed is putting out enough heat to keep the house comfortable. The ash drawer also makes a big difference.

The only sacrifice if you'd want to call it that is that I can't load up the stove for an overnight burn unless it is cold to an extreme or else it gets much too hot.

Had the same problem on my NC 13. Found that most of the problem was from burning locust that was only seasoned for 18 months. Red oak cut the same time is doing much better. I also found that I can seriously reduce the coal bed by burning differently. What I do is rake coals to the middle front. Then I load one split at the rear E/W. Then I load two smaller splits N/S at the ends creating a u-shaped burn chamber. I might also kitty corner diagonally on top of the first three splits. The coals concentrated in the middle surrounded by all the heat burn up pretty quickly.
Al

lobsta1 said:

Had the same problem on my NC 13. Found that most of the problem was from burning locust that was only seasoned for 18 months. Red oak cut the same time is doing much better. I also found that I can seriously reduce the coal bed by burning differently. What I do is rake coals to the middle front. Then I load one split at the rear E/W. Then I load two smaller splits N/S at the ends creating a u-shaped burn chamber. I might also kitty corner diagonally on top of the first three splits. The coals concentrated in the middle surrounded by all the heat burn up pretty quickly.
Al

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Oooh, that's a great idea I sure hadn't thought of. I have a very small stove, and some of my wood clearly hasn't seasoned enough despite having been split well down and stacked in sun and wind since April. So i have more coaling than it's comfortable to deal with. I'll defintely try your techinque. That' "u-shaped burn chamber" sounds like a really good idea.

Really great idea! I have to try that next - Got to cut some splits down to make a short box, the middle section usually burns ok when I put small kindling on top of the raked up pile to burn. The center opening is like a blast furnace area - so we build a combustible chamber to hold the coals and incinerate them. Sounds good -

grizzly2 said:

Cherry coals like crazy. Makes for a good all night wood, but builds up an excess of coal if used continuously.

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Thanks for the tip on cherry. You are absolutely correct on this. I had a massive amount of coals to contend with constantly, as I was mixing cherry throughout all my burns. I have over a cord of cherry but have now stopped burning it during the day. No problem with coals now. I'll save the cherry for my night time burns. This is my first year 24/7 burning and I am still figuring things out. Thanks again.

The U shaped burn chamber with the coals in the middle works even better if you put a split across the top of the sides, about 1/3-1/2 way back, a couple of inches above the coals.

Ken