Burning Fir and Pine and loving it. :)

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Lumber-Jack

Minister of Fire
Dec 29, 2008
2,007
Beautiful British Columbia
Greetings all
This is my first post in this forum so I better make it a good one. lol
I just started seriously heating with wood again after a very long sabbatical. I guess you could say most of what I knew about burning wood was old school. Things have changed a bit since I last heated with wood, and I suddenly found myself trying to learn, or re-learn a lot of stuff about new clearance regulations, EPA certifications and fire insurance requirements.
Last march we took possession of an older house and spent all spring and most of the summer renovating. From the beginning it was my plan to install a wood stove so I could save a little on heating bills and keep the house and family warm if ever there is an extended power outage, but by the end of the summer I was running short of cash (and energy) and was thinking I would let it go for one winter and just let the newly installed heat pump handle the cold.
Problem was, even though the main part of the house, on a crawl space with a second story, was all very easy to heat (or cool) , there was one large room (14ft x 24ft) with 10 ft ceilings which sits on a slab and the heating duct vents had to be installed from above going though the attic. In the summer it was great, the heat pump, which acts as an air conditioner in the summer, blew the cool air down from above and cooled wonderfully, but when the cooler weather came in the fall and the floor started to get cold, it was obvious that this room ( the floor especially) was going to be uncomfortably cold when the thermometer started to really drop. Long story short, I decided to install the chimney and stove right away. I ended up getting a Regency F2400 and installing an inside, straight up 19 ft metal chimney.
Ok, so what does all this have to do with burning Fir and pine? There doesn't seem to be much talk about burning fir and pine in this forum, and as indicated, this all happened later in the fall and I didn't have a lick of wood to burn. I suppose I could have bought some somewhere, but to me buying wood kind of defeats the purpose of saving on those power bills, also I enjoy going out in the bush and getting wood and have two young boys with lots of energy that needs to be focused.
Fortunately I live in an area (Southern BC) that has plenty of forests and lots (and I mean lots) of free dead standing Pine and Fir. To get it though one usually must drive up in the mountains somewhere, and this is much easier to do before the snow starts accumulating. We had already had a couple snow falls before I was able to even start getting our wood, but a warm spell melted most of it at the lower elevations. My first trip out netted me a load of lodge pole pine (just over a cord by my figuring). On two more trips to higher elevation I brought back a couple more cords of Fir this time. The day after the third trip it snowed like a banshee and pretty much concluded my wood gather for the year.
Now! to test out this new stove. Would it heat the whole house? Will three cords be enough for the winter? These were questions that remained to be answered in my mind, but then I started reading crazy things on the internet about seasoning wood for two years (or more). Years ago when I burned wood to heat my house I always cut the wood (Pine and Fir) in the fall that I would burn that winter, I never had a problem, but now with the internet we often get overloaded with too much information and sometimes we end up wondering if we are doing things wrong????
I had always assumed that the dry standing wood I had burned before was (for the most part) dry enough to burn that same season, but maybe I was just burning wood that was too wet?
Ok, I decided to get a moister meter to check my wood and see just what sort of moisture was in this freshly harvested wood.
Well, I'm happy to report that after splitting and sticking that probe into dozens and dozens of pieces of wood I could only find a few pieces of fir that read a moister content of over 20%, and they read about 23%. My instinct told me these pieces would read high, as they came from the base of a very large, old dead fir tree. Curiously, this old dead fir tree also had some of the driest wood readings (15%) from the wood that was cut from the top portion of the tree. Most of the readings from all the other wood fell anywhere between 16% and 20%. All the new school stuff I'm learning tells me that's just fine, so I guess I will continue to collect my wood the "old school" way and dismiss the idea of trying to store 3 years worth of wood in my city sized lot. LOL
Now as for how the stove and wood are performing? I have to say I am quite happy. :)
We have had some cold weather here so far this winter, colder than we've have had in years.(-25 C , -13 F) This meant that we had to be diligent about keeping that fire going at times, and it was nip and tuck getting through some night without the heat pump kicking in, but we did it. Only once did the furnace kick in in the morning and it was more a mater of negligence than a failure of the system. (nobody stoked the fire before going to bed) Other than that it has been relatively easy to keep the entire 1500 sq ft house heated (rather warmly I might add) with this new stove and cheap, plentiful Fir and Pine. And as for the large room that sits on a cement slab that would have otherwise been the coldest room in the house? Well it turned out to be the warmest (some say hottest ;) ) room in the house.
It took us (my family) 3 enjoyable days to collect and split (well most of it) the 3 cords of fir and pine, if this turns out to be enough for the winter I will consider it to be a bonus, if not maybe next year I'll spend another enjoyable day in the mountains with my family, either way it's been fun, and there ain't nothin better than sitting around with family and friends in front of a warm fire on a cold winter night.

Anyway that's my story, great forum, thanks for reading.
 
welcome to the forum, glad to hear another wood burner has came to his senses!!!! i say if the wood has tested dry, BURN IT.i continue to do like you done before, cut and split my pile the year before. i have never had a problem but i do make sure and sweep the chimney a couple time a year (i like to error on the side of caution esp when it comes to fire inside my house!!) good luck with your new appliance, WG
 
Contrary to some beliefs :lol: you are allowed to burn fir and pine.

You will find that a a lot of people on this forum live back East where only hard woods are available. They have their opinions about pine....BUT there are a few Westerners here who burn nothing but pine and have not suffered any ill results from the practice.

As you have found out, it does indeed work just fine to heat a home.

Keep it up and welcome.
 
Use the search function for "pine". You will find a bunch of us here that burn it.
 
Living on the Cumberland Plateau of TN, I am surrounded by fine hardwoods of all sorts. But I have been burning some pine that my dad took down early this spring, which now tests out to about 15-20% moisture. It starts up super easy, and it throws a nice heat (though it won't hold up over night like oak). It's been great for milder weather and for taking the chill off in the morning and/or evening. I've had zero problems with any buildup in the liner. However, it made my palms hairy, and I now need glasses. ;-)
 
Yes, there has been some misplaced concern here that burning pine will cause creosote build up because of the pitch in the pine. (pine pitch).
While I am not an expert on pine because i live in conn. where it is scarce, I have burned a lot of old pine lumber & it burns hot & fast, & without creosote problems, as advertised.

The main point is that the wood be dry & seasoned & that you burn hot enough to be above the creosote creation range, which is below 300 deg F.

I try not to harvest my wood just before I need it to burn.

I like to let it dry out & season for at least 6 to 9 months & i leave the wood in a pile about 6 ft from the wood stove with a 20 in electric box fan blowing hot air on the wood pile for at least 24 hours before I try to burn it.

This works well for me as I have close by neighbors that don't like smokey chimineys even a little bit & i do my best to see that they don't have to put up with my chimney smoking.

Drier & longer seasoned wood burns hotter, easier & with less smoke. Smaller splits burn faster, hotter, easier & with less smoke.
Small splits dry out & season quicker.

I 1/2 full, 2/3 or 3/4 full stove smokes less that a crammed full to the gills stove because the air has more room to flow around the wood , giving more complete & less smokey combustion.

A big fat split burns slow ,not so hot & may smoke more unelse it is well dried & seasoned, but it lasts a long time for those overnight burns.

One think I noticed is that big fat old bed of red embers that give enough heat for the shoulder months when it is above 30 deg don't do much for heat(read house uncomfortably cool at 62 deg) when it is below 20*F & I need another load of splits burning, to keep warm.

I you want your stove to seem to heat better, insulate your house, better & you won't need to burn so much wood as you do now; relatively speaking.
 
We have a lot of standing dead lodgepole pine courtesy of the mountain pine beetle. That wood is like swiss cheese after they're done. (slight exaggeration maybe) I see two types of dead lodgepole around here. Trees with red needles and trees without any needles. Be careful to NEVER to take a partially red/orange tree because these trees still have bugs under the bark.

Talk about a fire hazard... In some ways it's nice to have such a huge selection of dead wood to cut for firewood but ecologically speaking it's a disaster.
 
Thanks for the welcome WG

And Pagey I will be checking my Palms regularly for signs of handling my "pine" too much. ;)

As for the mountain pine beetle, there are cautions about transporting it from one region to another during the beetles active season, but it is my understanding that by the end of September they are dormant around here, so as long you harvest infested trees in Oct, and burn it all that winter you are actually helping to reduce their populations. They do commercial logging of infested pine, so they must be following similar procedures to ensure they are not spreading the infestation when transporting the timber. This may be a good case against not storing (seasoning) pine.
 
Carbon_Liberator said:
Thanks for the welcome WG

And Pagey I will be checking my Palms regularly for signs of handling my "pine" too much. ;)

As for the mountain pine beetle, there are cautions about transporting it from one region to another during the beetles active season, but it is my understanding that by the end of September they are dormant around here, so as long you harvest infested trees in Oct, and burn it all that winter you are actually helping to reduce their populations. They do commercial logging of infested pine, so they must be following similar procedures to ensure they are not spreading the infestation when transporting the timber. This may be a good case against not storing (seasoning) pine.


Yeah that is my understanding but the Forest Service says that cutting needle free trees is safe and bug free and yet I have gotten home and had them in the fresh cut wood pile. I wouldn't trust the time of year guarantee either because if it's warmer than normal bugs could still be present especially in early October.

With all that said though, I don't think you or I could spread the little buggers any faster than their current fast pace. I might try de-barking as much as possible when I return to the forest to cut this spring.

I think the little buggers live in the ground for the winter so I don't think we will reduce any populations by burning pine. Storing it should be ok since they seem to eat on live/dying mature trees only.
 
Yes Roac I did some more reading about the pine beetles and you seem to be mostly right , They say "Usually once the needles turn red, the tree is dying or dead and the majority of the beetles have moved to another tree.". So I guess that there may still be some remaining in the bark.
However they also say "Usually the larvae over-winter in the tree, develop into pupae and in the summer emerge as adult beetles. They then exit the tree to find another pine tree host, and the cycle continues." But I guess that while they are in the larvae stage the tree will still be mostly alive and green.
I Pretty sure they are all dormant around here by Oct. , so I will continue to harvest and burn as I have been, however in more Southern climates they may still be active.
The pine that I burn is , as far as I know, mostly all Pine Beetle kill, so it's nice to know as much about it as possible.

Here is the source of pine beetle info I was quoting from.
http://www.pc.gc.ca/apprendre-learn/prof/sub/mpb-ddp/page3_e.asp
 
sounds like you have a great new hobby. Gathering wood is also a great way to get some exercise and to catch up with your kids (when the saw isn't roaring!). I also love the fact that you could survive if the power went out for a few days. It feels good to be self reliant (even if you don't need to be). Also there is no other way for me to keep my house as warm as I like it. I have a lot of good memories of working on firewood with my dad and brothers.



Jon
 
Welcome to the forum, but you have already annoyed me. I was just thinking that I needed a profile pic, and that some molecule/atom, carbon, carbon dioxide, type think would be cool, and would go with my user name....

Back to the drawing board (literally)... :)

I will be burning pine/hemlock in the shoulder seasons (i.e. probably in a few weeks) - easy to get here in the NE....
 
Welcome, C-L, to the forum. And greetings from the other coast.
Glad to hear you're doing well with the softwood. I'm harvesting a bit off my own land right now, for next year's burning - poplar, spruce and fir.
Normally I buy tree length maple and process it myself. Do you have access to any hardwoods? Can you harvest any "free" ones while cutting the pine and fir?
As others have noted, the stove gives you a bit of freedom from the power grid. You'll be cozy during the next power failure.
Happy burning.
 
Boy this is an old thread, but thanks for the welcome guys. However I have been here for a while (Joined 2008-12-29), I just haven't posted for some time. Not that wood heating hasn't been on my mind, in fact I've been busy spitting and filling up my new wood shed which I just posted about in a thread in the wood shed forum.

CN, sorry for the annoyance, I guess it's true that great minds think alike :)

MW I do have some limited access to hard wood around here, but I find the extra hassle of dealing with the kind of hardwood we have around here not worth the trouble. The biggest advantage of hardwoods over softwood of course is the longer burn times and greater BTUs per volume of wood, but there are some distinct disadvantages too. 
One disadvantage of hardwood is the seasoning time. Generally any hardwood I get is going to need to be cut and split and stored for up to two years for it to burn properly and benefit from the extra BTUs. Yes I know in this forum that is generally the rule of thumb, but that rule is not really necessary when cutting dead pine or fir, not for 2 years anyway. The stuff I try to get is already < 20% moisture content, and if it happens to be a bit over it dries out quickly, usually within a month or two after it is split and stacked. So NOT having to store wood for two years ahead is a real space saver.
Second reason is split and stack ability of softwood over hardwood. Long straight tree lengths of oak just don't occur around here, most of the available hardwood around here is fruit tree wood where people are tearing out an old orchard, stuff that I have used in the past, but again when it does become available it is almost always green and is about 50% knots and twisted branches which makes it much harder to split and stack compared to the straight grain pine or fir I deal with which splits easy into nice stackable size pieces. 
This spring a friend said I could cut up his walnut trees if I wanted them, I reluctantly agreed and I'm still dealing with a lot of big irregular pieces which are almost impossible to split. I find it easier to cut them up by cutting cross grain and that is hard on the saw teeth and somewhat time consuming, and again, the stuff will not be ready to burn till next year. In the meantime I still have to process it and store it in my the limited space I have available. Space that I could use to store wood I could be burning this season.
I get decent overnight burns with my stove and the pine and fir, I don't go through a terrible amount of wood in a season, the wood that I burn is free and readily available and it splits and stacks easy, I just can't see any reason to seek out and deal with the extra hassle of hardwood. Perhaps if I had unlimited space I might collect more of that fruit wood??? But then I would still have to deal with the annoyance of splitting that knotty, twisted stuff up into properly sized stuff that will fit into my stove and stack and store it for a couple years,,,, nah,, I don't think so. ;-P
 
Pine is fine. That's all I have around here with alot of dead standing courtesy of previously mentioned bark beetle. I de- bark religously and if ya pack the stove corectly you can get an all- niter out of it. WB to wood burning and welcome aboard...............
 
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