Insert Surround Trim and loss of heat

prajna101 · Nov 3, 2009

I have a Lopi Answer inserted in a masonry fireplace connected to a flex liner all the way to the top of the chimney. I sealed off the top of the chimney and put some minimal effort into a block plate at the bottom. I know that latter was not needed, but I figured it would help.

I have been happy with the heat output but I have not had a surround installed. I have no blower yet. We heat about 50% of our needs with our woodstove.

Last weekend I installed a surround to seal up the fireplace and make it look nicer. Which it did. BUT, we have noticed that it does not get as warm in the house. Is this my imagination? Or does the surround lessen the heat output. The surround does get pretty hot and without it, there is quite a bit of heat from the sides of the stove. Am I now losing that heat from the sides? and stove pipe?

I am thinking that I may cut the surround differently this weekend. Perhaps I will cut 1 inch wider around the stove and install some grate material. Perhaps even a small fan to circulate the air in the fireplace around the stove.

My questions are: Does the surround make it less efficient? Does my solution make sense?

Todd

gpcollen1 · Nov 3, 2009

The design of most inserts accounts for this heat loss and there is not much that really radiates out through that 'jacket' on the insert. I run my Olympic without the surround and the sides of the stove do not really get too hot - not like the stove top does. So do you lose ANY heat with the surround on - yes. Is it significant - no, not IMO when you are burning a stove.

What you really need is the blower so you get some heat out of that thing...

Funk Brother · Nov 3, 2009

My take is that a surround, while nice aesthetically, is not necessary and *does* reduce the amount of heat coming into the room. Especially when the firebox/chimney are on an exterior wall. Here are a couple of threads you may want to check out: https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/13710/P15/
and
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/35328/P22/
also
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/23704/
I thought for a while about putting holes in the surround, but eventually decided to get rid of it all together. Looks vs. heat, and heat won. Good luck.

mellow · Nov 3, 2009

A blower is an inserts best friend, my surround is only warm to the touch, most of the heat is expelled through the blower vent. Stick a blower on that bad boy to get that heat moving out from the fireplace rather than up and in the fireplace. If you feel you are loosing that much heat you could wrap your insert with Kaowool to help insulate it.

thinkxingu · Nov 3, 2009

Hello,
A friend of mine has an Avalon insert and last year, when we lost power for a week, he had to take the surround off to get almost any heat out at all--in fact, with the surround on and no blower, it was essentially useless.

S

par0thead151 · Nov 4, 2009

thinkxingu said:
Hello,
A friend of mine has an Avalon insert and last year, when we lost power for a week, he had to take the surround off to get almost any heat out at all--in fact, with the surround on and no blower, it was essentially useless.

S

thats what a battery backup is for...
although a week is a long time to run on batteries. maybe a generator...

Lanningjw · Feb 10, 2010

I think that with the surround the bricks on my FP act as a heat sink with the surround in place. Inserts IMO look better with the surround. On the BK princess the insert comes out 13" onto the hearth pad.

I had a century insert and it did heat better with the surround removed. Looked more like a stove than an insert.

oconnor · Feb 10, 2010

I second the heat sink effect. In my case, with an internal chimney, my surrounding masonary holds lots of heat and is still warm in the AM when the fire is out.

I have wondered about a way to get better output from the stove by changing the way the surround is installed - something like changing the shroud so that I have a larger air space above the stove (tapered from 6 inches back to the original 1 inch), and raising the surround accordingly, then installing something to extend the legs of the surround to maintain the esthetics. Haven;t done anything yet, but I imagine the look when I sit back enjoying my coffee on Saturdays - I would love to run the blower less.

drdoct · Feb 10, 2010

I think that once you get the blower (which is horribly expensive but unfortunately needed) you'll be happier. I never had a surround because it didn't come with it and I wasn't going to pay that much money for one. My shroud gets pretty hot even with the blower going. When I get a wet split I'll put one or 2 back in the fireplace area to get them dry quicker. Go ahead and get the blower with the ugly cord and control box half way down it so you can't hide it anywhere. IMO it's the second worse thing LOPI does. The first being the burn tubes being held in place by that pin that drops into the ashes as soon as it gets hot.

iceman · Feb 10, 2010

well, i can say i get ALOT more heat from mine with the surround off... mine is an interior chimneythats 8 ft wideand at least 3 ft deep..... there is a gas insert in the other side .... when i take my surround off i have at least 6 inches from the top of the inserts shell... my fan is on the right side of the stove... so it only blows over 2 sides the rest is convection... with the surround removed and my blower turned down, with a fan 20ft away blowing towards the insert, it makes my house about 5 degrees warmer and much faster.....
i will be taking the surround to have a new one made that has mesh and will allow for more air movement

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Insert Surround Trim and loss of heat

prajna101

Member

gpcollen1

Minister of Fire

Funk Brother

Member

mellow

Resident Stove Connoisseur

thinkxingu

Minister of Fire

par0thead151

Feeling the Heat

Lanningjw

Minister of Fire

oconnor

Minister of Fire

drdoct

Feeling the Heat

iceman

Minister of Fire

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