New Homeowner-need help heating house w/ wood burning stoves

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remodelwarriors

New Member
Dec 23, 2009
2
Central MO
My wife and I bought our first home this past April. I'm having problems keeping the house warm. We have two wood burning stoves - a free-standing stove in the basement and an insert upstairs. I've attached two images, which give the layout of the main and lower levels.

The house is 3200 sq. feet, 1600 per level. The main level has a 2 car attached garage (I don't know the dimensions of the garage at the moment, sorry).
The red lines on the images are doors. We have a set of double doors leading out on a small deck from the master bedroom, and a set of double doors in the basement as well.
The blue lines on the images are windows.
The orange circles are the stoves - on the main level is the insert and the lower level is the free standing stove.
The brown line around the outside perimeter of the lower level indicates where the ground is burying or partially burying the foundation.

First, the downstairs stove. This stove seemed great when I first started using it, but I've come to hate it. It ate threw wood like crazy. There is not shutoff for the flue, and no S or J channel, so the hot air just goes right out. Even if I close down the air intake, the fire will roar to ridiculous levels. My dad believes the stove is old and the seams are cracked. It also doesn't burn very long or well...we plan on getting a new one after the first of the year.

However, even when using this stove the upstairs was cool - unpleasantly cool. And our bedrooms, located on the far side, were cold. We had a new HVAC system installed and I had them put a cold air return above the stove...however, it just didnt seem to pump that hot air anywhere.

A chimney repair company recommended that I cut a hole in the side of the house and put an insulated duct line running to the stove, to feed it air from outside. Is that going to do anything? I tried just opening a window across the room, but that didnt seem to do anything...the upstairs and upstairs bedrooms were still cold.

I had the idea of putting vents in the floor above the stove to allow the heat to move up to the main floor - is that worth doing? Perhaps putting one of these in - http://www.tjernlund.com/Retail/aireshare.htm

The basement ceiling is currently open to the frames (mold caused us to have to demo the entire basement), so I also thought about running a duct from above the stove over to the two bedrooms, and installing some kind of temperature controlled fan - once it reached a certain temp in the downstairs living room, the fan turns on and helps move the air to the far end of the house. However, I've read that moving cold air is more efficient, so I'm wondering if this would just be a waste of time?

Until we have our savings back in order (mold remediation was expensive), we're using the stove insert upstairs. It doesn't go through near the amount of wood downstairs does, and it keeps the rooms upstairs drastically warmer. The main living room will be at 75 degrees, bedrooms at 63-65.

Again, the bedrooms are just too cold...I'd like them a little warmer - not crazy warm, but warmer. I run the fan on the insert to blow the heat into the room, and have a box fan blow across the front of the stove down the hallway...still stays cold - better, but not where we want it. I have a few ideas:

The upstairs living room has vaulted ceilings. I have thought about cutting a vent in the wall up in the vaulted section, and running insulated duct work through the attic and down into the two bedrooms. Again, a temperature controlled fan would turn on when the temp was high enough. I've read conflicting opinions, so I'm wondering if folks think this is worthwhile?

After doing some research, I've read that its easier to move cold air than it is warm air. So, instead of trying to move the warm air from the living room with a fan, would it be better to reverse it and blow the cold air from the bedrooms (a return duct low for example) and blow that into the living room somehow?

Or would I benefit from doing all of this, making a whole air movement system throughout the house - almost a second HVAC with some fans and ductwork that pulls cold air from the bedrooms and pumps it into the living room?

Or, are there any other suggestions you folks would have?

Thank you much for any help or suggestions you can provide.
 

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My parents have a simular setup. With a pellet stove in a basement room that is not that open to the rest of the house. But it does the job and keeps the upstares to 65-70 with out any issues. Just one question though. Are you running the fan on your furnace?

They have set the thermestat to run fan only and turned the furnace off. Seems to work well for moving the air around. They also use a fan to blow the air out of the room that the furnace is in, into the rest of the house.
 
heat rises so if you have a cieling fan leave it running at low speed to keep the het down out of the rafters. I have cathedral ceilings in my cabin and there is a huge difference with and without the ceiling fan.
 
Yes, our air handler has a fan setting that we run, but it doesn't seem to get the air in the far bedrooms warm enough. That's why I was wanting a direct duct from the living room to the two bedrooms with a fan, so that it grabs the hot air up high and funnels it to the bedrooms.
 
I'm going to move this to the Hearth Room as its more appropriate there...

First off I'd point out that there are some Code issues with having HVAC intakes or returns within 10 feet of a stove or fireplace (supplies are OK) Likewise there are many reasons to be concerned about efforts to move air from immediately around the stove area to a sleeping room - if the stove has a problem (i.e. the door wasn't closed properly) this could result in pumping combustion gases into the bedrooms, which is a potentially deadly situation. Blowing cold air from the bedrooms towards the stove is somewhat safer (In either case, keep your CO alarms in good working order)

Beyond that it gets into one of those situation where you have to do a lot of experimenting, as every house is different... However it is worth noting that because the temperatures around the stove are far lower than what your HVAC system was designed to deal with, it USUALLY doesn't help a lot to use it, especially if any of your ducting goes through unconditioned spaces, as you will often lose most of the heat gained.

The other thing that is a useful approach is to get some incense sticks or equivalent and map out the existing natural airflows in the house - see which way the air is wanting to flow at the tops and bottoms of doorways, and in halls at ceiling and floor levels - you will probably find that your efforts to move the heat around will work better if you attempt to enhance the existing flows, rather than fight against them.

Gooserider
 
I'm in a similar process of deciding how best to move my air around. I've installed a FPX 36 elite woodburning fireplace and had it in service for almost a month now. I haven't finished my research or decision-making, but I'll share some observations.

First - on the use of the house HVAC blower without running the furnace. I find this to be pretty effective here, but it takes a LONG time to really even things out. I don't run it at night because the slight hum in the quiet house annoys me when I'm trying to go to sleep. So, I turn it on first thing in the morning, and I run it every day, all day. In the past, before the wood burning, it took hours before the house had fairly even temps. With the stove really cooking, the temps in the rest of the house do rise, but it takes hours.

Second - the comments about mapping out your existing air flow and finding ways to enhance it are exactly what I've been working on. With a candle flame I have learned a ton about where my air "wants" to go. In some cases it has been quite surprising. For example, I've learned that in one room what I thought were two heat supply ducts are really a heat supply and a cold air return. (Both have heat grates on them, and the duct work is hidden in built-in areas.) Imagine if I had tried to work against that existing flow. Also, in some spots the air flow is fairly strong - especially at the tops and bottoms of doorways. Who knew?

Third - it absolutely makes sense to me to move the cold air rather than the warm air. If the cold air is drawn out of a room, and there is a path for the warm air to get in there to replace it - it will.

-Speak
 
Whatever you do you will never get even heat throughout your whole house, it's just not possible with wood stoves since they are space heaters. I think you can do a little better though by placing a fan on the floor in that hallway pionted towards the stove room, this will push the denser cold air to the warmer room and force the warm air back up around to replace the cooler air in the bedrooms. This may give you a couple more degrees but it will still be warmer in the stove room.

If I had a large home like yours I think I would look into and EPA wood furnace for the basement that could be hooked right up to your duct work and produce even heat throughout, The PSG Caddy's are EPA and also have a fireviewing window with more of a stove look. There are probably others out the as well.
 
This is the problem with TRADITIONAL housing. I have been around the construction of new homes for nearly 30 yrs. I have a shop and build cabinets for these monstrosity's.
They keep making the same mistake over and over and over. NO SUPER INSULATED HOMES. They look nice and all and the utility companies love them.......... you're loss their gain. I used to live in one........

My house now has 10'' thick foam insulated walls....

To do it over again it would be a straw bale house on a frost protected shallow foundation (lots of thermal mass inside).

My rant for the day...........
 
Todd said:
Whatever you do you will never get even heat throughout your whole house, it's just not possible with wood stoves since they are space heaters. I think you can do a little better though by placing a fan on the floor in that hallway pionted towards the stove room, this will push the denser cold air to the warmer room and force the warm air back up around to replace the cooler air in the bedrooms. This may give you a couple more degrees but it will still be warmer in the stove room.

If I had a large home like yours I think I would look into and EPA wood furnace for the basement that could be hooked right up to your duct work and produce even heat throughout, The PSG Caddy's are EPA and also have a fireviewing window with more of a stove look. There are probably others out the as well.

+1 . . . At a certain point the wood furnaces and wood boilers just make a lot more sense . . . and that point seems to be when you start to look at heating larger homes with wood.
 
Todd said:
Whatever you do you will never get even heat throughout your whole house, it's just not possible with wood stoves since they are space heaters.

+2 You bought a fancy wood eating radiator and plunked it in one room. Where do you think the heat is going to be concentrated? You can use fans to help distribute. If that is not enough then you need to add an additional stove or go to a wood or pellet burning whole house furnace.

I actually prefer the heat distribution my stove provides as the living room stays the warmest, then the kitchen, and the bedroom is the coolest which is nice for sleeping. Of course every layout is different.
 
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