Need to find combustion fan for enviro empress in vermont on Super Bowl Sunday

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fletchtb

Member
Jul 31, 2006
57
Fletcher, Vermont
So I woke up to a house full of smoke at 2:30am because the combustion fan on my 4-year old enviro empress failed and the stove shut off when the vacuum switch released. Everything is fine at the house. We are just going to need to heat the house with propane until I can replace the fan.

My dealer is closed on Sundays and so is the other local enviro dealer. Anyone know if there is another make of stove that uses the same fan that might have a dealer who is open on Sunday?

I live in Franklin County, VT and can easily get to just about anywhere in VT, Northern NY (like Plattsburgh), or even Quebec.

Thanks for any advice you may have. I am going to go back to bed now and will check back when I wake up.
 
any one that sells greenfire and vista flame... same mfg co, so the blower should be the same.
 
HMM smoke in the house.
sounds like a direct vent installation.

Are you sure the motor is NOT working? I never seen on stop completely.
can you check to see if power is getting to it.
the empress board has two fuses. one for the auger and ignitor
and one for the blowers.
check the fues.
also check the wires and limit swiches.



Unfortunately that stove needs the C frame type motor and I think Enviro is the only one still using them.
I think it is because the motor is smaller for clearance issues
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Summit - Thanks for the idea on alternate brands to find an open dealer to buy from. Unfortunately, I was not able to find an open dealer in the area.

Rod - Thanks for your comments too. Yes I have a direct vent installation. When I woke up last night, I don't believe the exhaust motor was running (I don't remember hearing it). Light #2 was flashing (indicating the vacuum switch had released. As I was going to get my flashlight, the motor kicked on again and the embers flamed up until the pellets in the burnpot burned up. I then left the stove off for the remainder of the night. This morning I pulled out the exhaust fan/motor and gave it a thorough cleaning (I had not cleaned it since just before the heating season began), hoping that it would get me through the day. When I put it back, plugged the stove back in, and turned the stove on, the auger worked, but the fan never came on. The stove then shuts down because there is no draft.

I have noticed that the burn pot has been filling with pellets and I need to shut the stove down daily to prevent pellets from overflowing. In the previous 3 seasons, I have had little trouble running the stove 24x7 for 6-7 days without needing to shut the stove off. So I have been thinking that this fan was on its way out, but reluctant to shell out $200+ for a replacement. I have been pulling out the draft pull a little more each time in hopes of providing more airflow to the burnpot. I do not have an OAK, but I have never had a problem getting air into the stove. My house is pretty drafty. I am pretty good about cleaning behind the fire brick every couple of tons. And 2 weeks ago I did clean out my direct vent in hopes of improving the airflow. I live in Northern Vermont and run this stove on either Level 4 or Level 5 all winter long (24 hours a day), so it gets heavy use. I burn about 7 tons a season.

One other thing worth mentioning, is that last week the ignitor on the stove went. After a cleaning the stove would not start up again. It was blowing the F2 Fuse within about a minute of startup each time. I went through a handful of fuses confirming that the auger motor was fine (emptied the hopper and ran the stove, took out the motor and ran it on its own, put it in th new auger motor I have on standby, etc...). I disconnected the ignitor and the fuses stopped blowing. I have been lighting the stove manually since Tuesday.

Overall, I think the exhaust motor is shot. Let me know if you disagree or if you have any other suggestions. I don't have a voltage meter (if that is even the right tool) to confirm that there is power going to the exhaust motor.

Again, I appreciate your input.

Thanks,
Todd
 
I would just add that the wires seem fine to me, and I am not sure what to look for on the limit switches.
 
fletchtb said:
I would just add that the wires seem fine to me, and I am not sure what to look for on the limit switches.

well you can try dirrect current to the stove. Find some kind of old cord with a plug and connect it to the blower wires.
to see if the blowers work.
 
fletchtb said:
.....I think the exhaust motor is shot. Let me know if you disagree or if you have any other suggestions. I don't have a voltage meter (if that is even the right tool) to confirm that there is power going to the exhaust motor.....

Remove the motor, and make up a "test" cord from an old lamp cord. Connect to the motor leads, & plug in to 120v and see what happens. If it runs, then you know the problem is not the motor.

If it DOES run, but runs slowly, try putting some oil (3 in 1) on the bearings and spin by hand some, and then use the test cord again.....might help it.
 
Thanks Rod and macman for the cord tip. It confirmed my worst suspician, that I am an idiot... With the cord from my old DirectTV box, I was able to see that the fan still works. A quick consult of the Enviro Empress Technical manual confirmed that I connected one of the wires to an ignitor wire (since my ignitor is currently disconnected). With the correct wires now connected to the exhaust fan, the stove is now working the way it was before the event on Saturday night.

I still think I have a problem with the fan (and I haven't oiled the bearings yet, but I will do that next chance I get). Right now, the draft pull is more than 1/2 way out and does not really seem to be having much effect on the flame. In years past, it seems that I would have pretty much blown the fire out with this much draft, but it is hardly having an impact.

Overall, I still need to try and figure out why the fan turned off to begin with on Saturday night. I now guess that the fan kicked on as I was about to inspect it following my smoke detector wakeup call because the temperature dropped enough on the limit switch attached to the fan assembly. How do I troubleshoot this further? Could a sign of failure be that it engages the switch at a lower temperature than it normally should?

Thanks again for all the good advice to this point.

Todd
 
draft issue
Check to make sure you have the burn pot in correctly and the ash pan and front door shut tight
that type of motor you normally dont see a slow down. it works or dont work.

If you are getting smoke in the house when the stove Defaults then it would be best to get some vertical rise in the pipe.
it is very common for POWER fail and or something on the stove fails. I dont like the Idea of Direct vent. I have personaly installed over 800 pellet stove and my installers have installed many more NO STOVE INSTALLED BY ME OR MY COMPANY WOULD NEVER BE DIRECT VENTED even if I lost a sale because of it.
 
it also would be a good idea to go out and by a simple Volt/Ohm meter to check wires and limit switches. Im sure you can find one for under $20
for quick test but dont help much with Neutral wire discontents is a NON CONTACT VOLTAGE STICK
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fletchtb said:
Thanks Rod and macman for the cord tip. It confirmed my worst suspician, that I am an idiot... With the cord from my old DirectTV box, I was able to see that the fan still works. A quick consult of the Enviro Empress Technical manual confirmed that I connected one of the wires to an ignitor wire (since my ignitor is currently disconnected). With the correct wires now connected to the exhaust fan, the stove is now working the way it was before the event on Saturday night.

I still think I have a problem with the fan (and I haven't oiled the bearings yet, but I will do that next chance I get). Right now, the draft pull is more than 1/2 way out and does not really seem to be having much effect on the flame. In years past, it seems that I would have pretty much blown the fire out with this much draft, but it is hardly having an impact.

Overall, I still need to try and figure out why the fan turned off to begin with on Saturday night. I now guess that the fan kicked on as I was about to inspect it following my smoke detector wakeup call because the temperature dropped enough on the limit switch attached to the fan assembly. How do I troubleshoot this further? Could a sign of failure be that it engages the switch at a lower temperature than it normally should?

Thanks again for all the good advice to this point.

Todd

You may have had a power failure or pellet feeding issue that cut off the fuel supply, the low limit switch was tripped and the stove went into shut down mode. Did I read it right that you had a fuse blow in the house that they appliance is plugged in to? If so, you most likely have a bare wire exposed some where in the back.

You can test your fan easy enough with a no contact tachometer, $55 on amazon.com, the fan should read slightly shy of 3000rpm on full current (115v), those are hardy fans and usually do not fail until they simply fail and will not turn at all.

Check your ash drawer gasket too.
 
smwilliamson said:
fletchtb said:
Thanks Rod and macman for the cord tip. It confirmed my worst suspician, that I am an idiot... With the cord from my old DirectTV box, I was able to see that the fan still works. A quick consult of the Enviro Empress Technical manual confirmed that I connected one of the wires to an ignitor wire (since my ignitor is currently disconnected). With the correct wires now connected to the exhaust fan, the stove is now working the way it was before the event on Saturday night.

I still think I have a problem with the fan (and I haven't oiled the bearings yet, but I will do that next chance I get). Right now, the draft pull is more than 1/2 way out and does not really seem to be having much effect on the flame. In years past, it seems that I would have pretty much blown the fire out with this much draft, but it is hardly having an impact.

Overall, I still need to try and figure out why the fan turned off to begin with on Saturday night. I now guess that the fan kicked on as I was about to inspect it following my smoke detector wakeup call because the temperature dropped enough on the limit switch attached to the fan assembly. How do I troubleshoot this further? Could a sign of failure be that it engages the switch at a lower temperature than it normally should?

Thanks again for all the good advice to this point.

Todd

You may have had a power failure or pellet feeding issue that cut off the fuel supply, the low limit switch was tripped and the stove went into shut down mode. Did I read it right that you had a fuse blow in the house that they appliance is plugged in to? If so, you most likely have a bare wire exposed some where in the back.

You can test your fan easy enough with a no contact tachometer, $55 on amazon.com, the fan should read slightly shy of 3000rpm on full current (115v), those are hardy fans and usually do not fail until they simply fail and will not turn at all.

Check your ash drawer gasket too.
FYI Just so you know if you ever have service call on one like this.
the fuse that blew was the one on the board that protects the board when the Ignitor goes out and shorts the circuit.
the older boards had two one for the Blowers and one for the ignitor/auger circuit all the newer board just have one fuse
Very common on the enviro stoves. when I get a phone call from someone that has an enviro and they say there auger is not working it it stopped after they first started it I know to bring an ignitor and fuse to the call. or if I know the homeowner is handy I will tell them to disconnect the Ignitor and replace the fuse and light is manually until I can get out to change the ignitor.
 
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