25 pdvc englander endless problem

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86 toy

Member
Feb 5, 2009
134
Mifflinville PA
i have posted on here before concerning a dirty burn with my stove no matter what kind of pellets i burn and it's starting to get to be a pain. i have been on the phone with englander alot. the last time i called they sent me a new control board and a combustion blower and their was no real change. now my warranty has expired so i'm not sure what to do. here is the problem i have.
after about 3-4 hours of burning the pellets start to pile up in the burnpot it turns into this mound of glowing red pellets and clogs everything up i have completely disassembled the stove and cleaned it including both blowers and behind the plate. i completely took apart my exhaust and brushed it out and ran the leaf blower on it so i know it's not because of an ash problem and i also forgot to mention that this has done this since the stove was new last january. i have only burned 2.5 tons thru it since new and i'm now out of ideas. my exhaust is out the back of the stove 12" and thru the wall to a cleanout t then up 3ft to a 90 with a cap and my outside air is hooked up. here are some pics of what my burnpot looks like after about 10 hours with the stove on heat setting 4 bottom 3 are at 3-9-1. the pics were taken after the stove was in shutdown for about 5 minutes and you can still see how much is built up. does this look normal to you guys? i'm burning barefoot pellets
 

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Have you tested your gaskets?

And how are the air holes in the burn pot?

Can you describe the color of the ash deposited on the wall of the fire box above the burn pot? The color is hard to make out in the pics.
 
Toy, I remember you having an issue with dirty glass, but not with the problem you have now. So even though you said you cleaned the stove, it sure sounds ike a lack of burn air to me. And you put in a new combustion blower, so I doubt that's the problem.

Even more evidence of lack of burn air is the fact that you changed your factory button settings from 6-4-1, to 3-9-1, which effectively increases the amount of burn air, and decreases the amount of pellets, but you say that hasn't changed anything?

To me, even though you didn't post a burning pic, that mass of partially burned pellets also indicates lack of air.

EDIT: Have you made sure that the OAK is completely clear?
 
EDIT: Have you made sure that the OAK is completely clear?



And the large holes in the burnpot under the wear plate? Maybe remove the burnpot?
 
Also looks like a big clinker. Possibly cutting off air.If I don't scoop 'em out this year every ten hours or so, they get really thick and hard.
 
holes in the wear plate are clear i clean them with a drill bit. the first thing englander did was sent me a burnpot gasket and yes i have checked my outside air screen and it totally clear. changing my lba to 9 was one of englanders ideas i honestly think if the stove is working properly the lba shouldn't have to be maxxed out at 9.
as for the color of tha ash above the burnpot it is grayish brown directly above the fire but everywhere else in the stove is black

i have the stove pulled out from the wall right now to totally tear it down again and clean it. i'll try to get a couple burn pics when i get it back running

edit: i smoke tested the stove and found no leaks
 
86 toy said:
holes in the wear plate are clear i clean them with a drill bit. the first thing englander did was sent me a burnpot gasket and yes i have checked my outside air screen and it totally clear. changing my lba to 9 was one of englanders ideas i honestly think if the stove is working properly the lba shouldn't have to be maxxed out at 9.
as for the color of tha ash above the burnpot it is grayish brown directly above the fire but everywhere else in the stove is black

i have the stove pulled out from the wall right now to totally tear it down again and clean it. i'll try to get a couple burn pics when i get it back running

edit: i smoke tested the stove and found no leaks
Click to expand...

I was talking about the holes in the side of the burnpot under the wearplate. Almost nickel sized.
 
86 toy said:
but everywhere else in the stove is black ......
Click to expand...

Yet ANOTHER indication of a very rich burn (lacking sufficient burn air).

When you open the ash traps to vacuum out behind the firebox, first take a small hammer & bang on the back steel wall of the firebox a few times....watch to see if clumps of crud fall down. If so, keep tapping (banging) all around the back wall until nothing else comes down....THEN vacuum out the ash traps.

When you removed the combustion blower to clean it last time, was there a heavy build-up of soot & carbon on the vanes (fins)? Did you scrape/wirebrush them clean, and make sure the gasket was in good shape?

Is the heat sensor attached securely to the exhaust housing, and plugged in to the control board?
 
macman said:
86 toy said:
but everywhere else in the stove is black ......
Click to expand...

Yet ANOTHER indication of a very rich burn (lacking sufficient burn air).

When you open the ash traps to vacuum out behind the firebox, first take a small hammer & bang on the back steel wall of the firebox a few times....watch to see if clumps of crud fall down. If so, keep tapping (banging) all around the back wall until nothing else comes down....THEN vacuum out the ash traps.

When you removed the combustion blower to clean it last time, was there a heavy build-up of soot & carbon on the vanes (fins)? Did you scrape/wirebrush them clean, and make sure the gasket was in good shape?

Is the heat sensor attached securely to the exhaust housing, and plugged in to the control board?
Click to expand...

i beat on the stove with a hammer every time i clean out the ash traps

the last time the combustion blower was removed it was replaced with new gaskets


the heat sensor on my stove is attached to the back of the firebox in the area of the burn pot.. and yes it is securely a new one came with the control board and i installed it.

i'm ready to just sell this thing and buy a nice multi-fuel stove that will burn anything i dump in the hopper..lol

i can't bun this stove over heat setting 5 for more than 3 hours without scraping the pot out.. it looks really nasty when i clean it out in the morning affter burning 8 hours
 
Try running it w/out the OAK.
 
But think of the money you saved! Luckily the folks at Englander make every effort to keep their customers happy. Best of luck to you.
 
I'm curious of the status of your stove?
 
Topshelf said:
I'm curious of the status of your stove?
Click to expand...

well i talked to mike at englander for at least a half hour the other day trying to figure out the problem i'm having. currently i am burning another brand of pellets to see if it works any better. i get lots of heat with the barefoot pellets but i get those massive clinkers in the pot that clog everything up after about 4-6 hours (i have to open the door and clean the burnpot at least 4 times a day to keep it clear). right now i'm burning some pellets from tractor supply that are left over from my last ton and i don't get the burnpot clogging clinkers with these but they produce alot of ash. i know that barefoot makes a great product and their pellets burn very hot but in this stove they clinker very bad. mike said that those pellets could be so dense that this stove may not have the ability to get enough air to them. one thing that cannot be explained is why i have all the black soot in the fire box (except for right above the fire) wich indicates a rich burn and why it"s heavier on the right side and almose non existant on the left. i wish i knew someone with one of these stoves so i could go and see it burn in person to know if this is just a characteristic of this model or do i really have a problem.
 
86 toy said:
Topshelf said:
I'm curious of the status of your stove?
Click to expand...

well i talked to mike at englander for at least a half hour the other day trying to figure out the problem i'm having. currently i am burning another brand of pellets to see if it works any better. i get lots of heat with the barefoot pellets but i get those massive clinkers in the pot that clog everything up after about 4-6 hours (i have to open the door and clean the burnpot at least 4 times a day to keep it clear). right now i'm burning some pellets from tractor supply that are left over from my last ton and i don't get the burnpot clogging clinkers with these but they produce alot of ash. i know that barefoot makes a great product and their pellets burn very hot but in this stove they clinker very bad. mike said that those pellets could be so dense that this stove may not have the ability to get enough air to them. one thing that cannot be explained is why i have all the black soot in the fire box (except for right above the fire) wich indicates a rich burn and why it"s heavier on the right side and almose non existant on the left. i wish i knew someone with one of these stoves so i could go and see it burn in person to know if this is just a characteristic of this model or do i really have a problem.
Click to expand...

A door gasket or door alignment issue can cause the soot issue you are seeing.

This also amounts to an air bypass as far as the burn pot goes, some air gets sucked in through the bad door seal, this results in less air going through the burn pot.
 
you're cleaning the burn pot 3 or 4 times per day and that seems a lot.
I have to clean mine DAILY and seems to be the norm for these stoves, which seem to be 'picky' btw.

Looking at your pictures it looks very close to my stove before a full day of burning, these stoves don't seem to push out the ashes over the plate.

Good luck.....

.
 
I have a similar stove as yours, and it also has to be cleaned daily. I noticed I have the same problems with the Barefoots (having to clean the pot atleast 3 or so times a day because of ash "puck" buildups). I was having similar problems with many of the other pellets as well. My stove is just extremely picky. The best pellet I have burned in my stove so far is the Somerset Pellets. I run them on 6-4-1 or 6-5-1 and I don't have to clean the pot out for atleast a day. Even then, there is almost no build-up at all. I recommend you test them out (if they're available near you). I got mine at Lowe's. Trying calling all the Lowes stores in your area and see if anyone stocks them. If so, get a few bags to test out. If that doesn't work, you can definately rule the pellets out as the source of your problems. Good luck, buddy!
 
86 toy said:
Topshelf said:
I'm curious of the status of your stove?
Click to expand...

well i talked to mike at englander for at least a half hour the other day trying to figure out the problem i'm having. currently i am burning another brand of pellets to see if it works any better. i get lots of heat with the barefoot pellets but i get those massive clinkers in the pot that clog everything up after about 4-6 hours (i have to open the door and clean the burnpot at least 4 times a day to keep it clear). right now i'm burning some pellets from tractor supply that are left over from my last ton and i don't get the burnpot clogging clinkers with these but they produce alot of ash. i know that barefoot makes a great product and their pellets burn very hot but in this stove they clinker very bad. mike said that those pellets could be so dense that this stove may not have the ability to get enough air to them. one thing that cannot be explained is why i have all the black soot in the fire box (except for right above the fire) wich indicates a rich burn and why it"s heavier on the right side and almose non existant on the left. i wish i knew someone with one of these stoves so i could go and see it burn in person to know if this is just a characteristic of this model or do i really have a problem.
Click to expand...

So, you say the pellets from TSC don`t clinker and clog like the Barefoots. That could be part of the problem but I have to ask if Mike mentioned that your stove might be set in a higher heat mode (a,b,c) than the d mode that it should be in? ("heat mode" not to be confused with heat settings)
I could actually see traces of black smoke exiting the vent , dirtier glass, and soot build up in the stove when I set mine to heat mode c. I reset it to heat mode d and the burn is clean. C mode produces more heat (more pellets fed at equivolent feed rates than in d mode) but the maximum combustion air isn`t enough to match the higher fuel rates in c mode. The stove is designed to burn in heat mode d .
 
Gio said:
86 toy said:
Topshelf said:
I'm curious of the status of your stove?
Click to expand...

well i talked to mike at englander for at least a half hour the other day trying to figure out the problem i'm having. currently i am burning another brand of pellets to see if it works any better. i get lots of heat with the barefoot pellets but i get those massive clinkers in the pot that clog everything up after about 4-6 hours (i have to open the door and clean the burnpot at least 4 times a day to keep it clear). right now i'm burning some pellets from tractor supply that are left over from my last ton and i don't get the burnpot clogging clinkers with these but they produce alot of ash. i know that barefoot makes a great product and their pellets burn very hot but in this stove they clinker very bad. mike said that those pellets could be so dense that this stove may not have the ability to get enough air to them. one thing that cannot be explained is why i have all the black soot in the fire box (except for right above the fire) wich indicates a rich burn and why it"s heavier on the right side and almose non existant on the left. i wish i knew someone with one of these stoves so i could go and see it burn in person to know if this is just a characteristic of this model or do i really have a problem.
Click to expand...

So, you say the pellets from TSC don`t clinker and clog like the Barefoots. That could be part of the problem but I have to ask if Mike mentioned that your stove might be set in a higher heat mode (a,b,c) than the d mode that it should be in? ("heat mode" not to be confused with heat settings)
I could actually see traces of black smoke exiting the vent , dirtier glass, and soot build up in the stove when I set mine to heat mode c. I reset it to heat mode d and the burn is clean. C mode produces more heat (more pellets fed at equivolent feed rates than in d mode) but the maximum combustion air isn`t enough to match the higher fuel rates in c mode. The stove is designed to burn in heat rate d .
Click to expand...

stove is in "D" mode
 
nectardan said:
I have a similar stove as yours, and it also has to be cleaned daily. I noticed I have the same problems with the Barefoots (having to clean the pot atleast 3 or so times a day because of ash "puck" buildups). I was having similar problems with many of the other pellets as well. My stove is just extremely picky. The best pellet I have burned in my stove so far is the Somerset Pellets. I run them on 6-4-1 or 6-5-1 and I don't have to clean the pot out for atleast a day. Even then, there is almost no build-up at all. I recommend you test them out (if they're available near you). I got mine at Lowe's. Trying calling all the Lowes stores in your area and see if anyone stocks them. If so, get a few bags to test out. If that doesn't work, you can definately rule the pellets out as the source of your problems. Good luck, buddy!
Click to expand...

how is the heat with the somersets compaired to barefoot? i go through a half a bag less a day with barefoot compaired to the tsc brand because i can run the stove 2 heat settings lower with barefoot and get the same heat output. but the tradeoff is having to scrape out the pot so much with the barefoot
 
86 toy said:
SmokeyTheBear said:
86 toy,

Do you have a multimeter?
Click to expand...

yes sir i do but it is at work.. what do you have in mind?
Click to expand...

Checking the voltages going to the stove and to the combustion blower. One never knows what one may find.

Also is there anything at all on the same circuit and if so what?
 
SmokeyTheBear said:
86 toy said:
SmokeyTheBear said:
86 toy,

Do you have a multimeter?
Click to expand...

yes sir i do but it is at work.. what do you have in mind?
Click to expand...

Checking the voltages going to the stove and to the combustion blower. One never knows what one may find.

Also is there anything at all on the same circuit and if so what?
Click to expand...

i'll check it out tomorrow after work

edit:
i'm not really sure what else is on that circut. this house is very old(100+ years) and has been rewired by a previos owner. but i can say it wouldn't suprise me if the entire dining room recepticles are on that circut wich has a fishtank, and my computer plus i think the light and cailing fan are also on it ..lol never thought of a voltage problem... thanks smokey
 
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