First fire

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Snowy Rivers

Minister of Fire
Feb 7, 2010
1,810
NW Oregon
Well troops, the weather did get a lot colder and the house was 65 this morning with the prodigy on low .

Decided to fire the new stove up for it maiden burn.

All went well. A quick shot with the propane torch on a few pellets to get things up and going and it was off to the rodeo.

Here is a piccy with the little fire going

Snowy
 

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Looks good,did you get the paint straightened out.
Andy
 
Thanks guys

The paint is what the paint was.

Just painted the base and let the rest go for now.
The majority of the stove looks good, just the base was scratched up from time and use.

Snowy
 
Congratulations Snowy,

Nice looking hearth with stove and all in place. Great job.

Plenty of workspace around the stove... a wise feature for future cleaning.

Also, the relative long flue will enhance the overall efficiency of the stove. It's a heat exchanger in itself, with some extra cooling fins on the flue pipe perhaps the overall efficiency might even be enhanced further, but perhaps the flue can be cooled down too much leading to condensation. I have no idea.
My flue pipe is very short and I'm sure that too much heat is led out in the masonry chimney. Perhaps some cooling fins mounted on my flue might enhance efficiency?

Bo
 
Not sure about the Whitfields, but I tell folks that buy stoves from us to use a surge protector. I didnt notice one in the photo
 
Congrats on the newest addition to your pellet stove collection....looks good!

Oh, and I agree with Franks about the surge suppressor......cheap insurance.
 
Looking good snowy, She looks right at home there!

X3 on the surge suppressor.

Keep it clean and stay warm!
 
Thanks guys.

Had a real Buggaboooo this morning with the first fire.

Kept smelling a faint smoke smell, just enough that ya knew it was there.

Did not have time in the AM to mess with it so I shut it off and headed out in the big rig.

Got time this afternoon to look things over and here is what I found.

Stove was fine as I had burned it out in the shop area and there was no smell of smoke coming out the heat air tubes.

The Pellet Pro says "Sealer not needed"

DON"T believe that crap.

I refired the thing and turned the lights off, crawled under the pipe with a pocket sized LED flashlight and had a look see.

Both joints at the elbo to the straights showed wips of smoke and the appliance adapter which is inside the back cover was really leaking between the inner and outer layers.

OK I used high temp metal tape on the seams at the elbo and the pipe end of the adapter.

The area where the adapter goes onto the quick connector needed to be filled with silicone to be smoke tight.

Here is a sketch of the how to make it work.

The instructions did not say anything about filling that space with sealer.

WELL IT IS NOW and no more smell of smoke coming out of the beast either.

As far as a surge protector goes, unless you spend the price of a good stove on the protector they wont do much.

Good friend works for the local power company and he advised me that during bad weather etc. to unplug the computers and sensative stuff.

He further explained that the surge protectors that ya buy at the store (little strips) are basically less than worthless.


I have personally seen two high end TV's go away that were plugged into these type units.

The UPS units for computers are great but I really can't justify that sort of $$$$ for a $200 stove.

Yesssss I am enjoying the fire now that I dont have to smell the nuts cooking. :)

Snowy
 

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Snowy, this is what I did to eliminate some of the smoke. The rest of it was from the T....I ended-up wrapping all the T seams w/ aluminum furnace tape.....smoke problem gone.
 

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Yup good old High performance furnace tape.

Iritates me that, I followed the directions supplied with the pipe and it leaked like a sieve.

Every 1/4 turn joint leaked as did the adapter.

The smoke was really leaking from between the inner and outer pipe at the appliance adapter.

If I ever do another one of these I will squirt the area in that adapter full of silicone before I assemble things.

Installed 3 self tapping screws through that stainless pipe and into the quick dosconnect collar to keep it tight even though it was sealed with High temp black.

I installed a 10-32 allen screw through the quick connector and into the exhaust fan outlet. The outlet and quick connector were a very snug slip fit ( very happy about that)

So all in all its good to go now.

Got a tiny little fire burning on the number 2 setting and the blower down near low.

This is a perfect setting, not too much noise and the room air delivery is not real hot but nice and toasty.

Mid 30's out tonight heading down to near or slightly below freezing.

Snow by Morning they say.


Snowy
 
Just finished dinner and it's snowing now.

Will not be a whole lot but likely just enough to really foul the morning commute for the poor souls that have to drive to work.

Went down and screened out 2 6 gallon pails of nut shells and packed upstairs.

Got the Advantage runniing smooth as silk on the number 2 setting with the fan down near low.

Its a perfect setting without a lot of noise and the house is very cozy.

Shut the little Prodigy down and cleaned it. All ready for when the weather warms up a bit.

Daughter and Son inlaw came over to visit and take care of their horses.

Grand son took no time at all to warm his little hands by the fire.

I am very pleased with things right now. Got my tummy full and life is good.

Going to try and get a partial load of shells in the big rig soon and refill some of my empty barrels.

Unless something unforseen happens, the plan is to run the new stove through the night.

With all the smokey issues taken care of this should be a fine eavening.

best to all

Snowy
 
Snowy did you say you have PelletVent Pro, and you still have leaks?

I had numerous leaks on my basement install using the PelletVent pipe (not the Pro), and was going to go with PeleltVent Pro, but instead decided to go with Excel pipe.

Personally I'd be fuming if my Pro pipe was leaking. I too was under the impression you don't need silicon or anything like that for the Pro, and am surprised you had a leak.

Perhaps the leak at the stove adapter was travelling up the pipe cavity and leaking at other joints. According to Duravent the inner pipe does the sealing and the outer pipe is just a heat shield that does not seal.

IMHO, Excel is very good pipe.
 
Well this was the Pro series pipe and it had leaks at every joint.

They were small but they were there.

The instructions claim "You do not need to silicone the joints, but you can if you like"

There is an internal O ring that is supposed to seal the joints BUTTTTTTTTTTTT the best laid plans me thinks.

The use of an O ring is great, BUTTTTTTT we are still talking sheet metal here and its not going to be the same as a machined part. Small variations in the shape can and will allow small leaks.

The pro pipe is laser welded instead of the bulky/ugly crimp seam.

The real issue was the appliance adapter.


I would use the simpson again, but now with the current experience I would just do a couple things different and not go through the SNIIIIIIIiiiiiiiiiiiiiiFFFFF test to figure it out.

Maybe I will send Simpson an email and call a little smack
.
All in all, its a chimney vent and the bottom line is simple, Seal it and it will do fine and you will be happy.

I used the HVAC Hot Pipe tape at the main joints and that is a very neat way yo do it.

If you need to remove it, simply warm the stuff up good and peel it off.

I had the option of 3 different pipe systems but decided on the simpson as this was the brand that the wholsaler gave me the best price on.

The others were more $$$$ and one brand he could not sell me as it was "DEALER ONLY STUFF"

I bought my stuff through my trucking company and used the company name.

Wholsaler was more than happy to take my $$$$ and was very good to deal with.
Close too (10 miles) and he carries everything in stock.

He gave me the materials at 48 cents on the dollar based on retail.

so slightly less than 1/2 price.

The Stove bright paint was $8 a can instead of the usual $14++

All is well

Snowy
 
UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE

First full night was a grand success. WE filled the hopper with shells at around 10PM and went to bed.

I was a little nervous about running the stove all night as it had not had a full days run while being watched from time to time.

Being a used stove, there is always something that can go sour. But that said, a new one can too.

Fire tray is still fairly clean even after being run since about 4 yesterday afternoon.

I am used to having to do a quicky stir of the fire tray's every 6-8 hours (Nut shell thing) but this Advantage is really doing a good job on the stuff.

I am thinking that a good part of this was the mods I made to the fire tray.

The rows of smaller holes in the added filler plate in the tray are not all that big so the air velocity is a bit higher through the pot and is keeping things clean.

Originally the grate allowed the heavier ash to fall into the ash pan below, with the mods I made not much can fall through but instead is blown out and falls around the perimeter of the fire box.

Will be a snap to clean though. Once it's cool a quicky sluuuuurp with the shop vac and it will be all ready to go again.

As soon as this little last gasp of winter is over I need to remove the fire brick and patch the center section right around the drop tube.

This part has eroded over the years (94 model) and needs a little loving.

Good old furnace cement will make short work of the issue.


House is 70F spot on this morning and its 29F outside and snowing.

Was really great to get this oportunity to give the new stove a good "road test" before the warm weather gets here.

My focus now is going to be to gather some repair parts for the Advantage and the Prodigy before next season.

Nothing worse than needing a part and not have it when its cold outside.

Had that happen some years back when the ignitor on the quad burnt out.

Had to start is manually with a propane torch though the trap door under the pot. AAAAAAARG
 
I am now glad I went with the Excel on both my installs. I have never needed silicone or foil tape, and the stove adapter seems like a better design. Plus I can replace all my seals, but given their thickness I suspect it will be a long time before that ever happens. Yes, it was expensive pipe but I sleep well knowing I am likely to never have a problem.

Folks do swear by the Selkirk pipe. I would love to try that pipe just so I could form a well rounded opinion on all the pipe brands, but until I hit the lottery that ain't gonna happen.

Glad to hear some feedback on the Pro line.
 
All considered, I would use it again but I think the manufacture should be more careful about what is in their instructions.


Such is life.


Snowy
 
dac122 said:
I am now glad I went with the Excel on both my installs. I have never needed silicone or foil tape, and the stove adapter seems like a better design. Plus I can replace all my seals, but given their thickness I suspect it will be a long time before that ever happens. Yes, it was expensive pipe but I sleep well knowing I am likely to never have a problem.

Folks do swear by the Selkirk pipe. I would love to try that pipe just so I could form a well rounded opinion on all the pipe brands, but until I hit the lottery that ain't gonna happen.

Glad to hear some feedback on the Pro line.

Does the Excel have a corn/Multifuel rated pipe system?
 
I sent Simpson an email and told them about the issues and politely suggested that they need to either spell it out in the instruction booklet or make the product a little better.

The included statement that sealer was not needed was misleading.

I was certainly able to find and fix the issue easily enough but for many folks this could have been a real PITA.


I have not heard back from them so we shall see.

Feedback is the best way to improve a product that I know of. If folks out in the field are screaming, you need to listen.

Although some companies listen more to their engineers rather than the field guys.

Over the years, I have worked both in the field and as an engineer in manufacturing and have a great amount of respect for the input from the field service and installers perspective.

An unhappy customer is the worst thing you can have.

Now since this install was my own, it was no worse than a few colorful metfores and then on to fixing the issue.

A couple squirts of silicone and a few pieces of High Heat tape.

Now had this been a new install for a discriminating customer and their house got smokey, I am sure there would have been words.

I always hated the need to have to smear silicone all over every joint on the vent pipe.
It looks tacky and just very unprofessional.

Oh well, Toyotas seem to be tacky and unprofessional these days too, so whats a little smoke eh ???


Snowy
 
Snowy Rivers said:
I sent Simpson an email and told them about the issues and politely suggested that they need to either spell it out in the instruction booklet or make the product a little better.

The included statement that sealer was not needed was misleading.

I was certainly able to find and fix the issue easily enough but for many folks this could have been a real PITA....

Snowy, you raise a legitimate concern, IMHO.

When I had leaks with their PelletVent product I was told their Pro line was specifically designed to solve leak issues produced by high CFM blowers in newer stoves. Whether true or not I was given the impression I would have better luck with their Pro line, backed up by their own website saying the Pro line will produce less leaks because it is superior in "safety", "fit and finish" "with laser welded inner and outer wall".

Given the added price of Pro pipe comparable to Excel and Selkirk, their claims you will not need silicone or tape, and the lack of folks on this site complaining of leaks with Excel and Selkirk, I second your concerns and hope they are taken seriously.

For me the decision was simple as I was able to almost literally compare the Pro pipe to a previous install of Excel I had. Several deficiencies still stick in my mind: their small O-ring gasket; their non-replaceable gasket; how they join their inner-to-outer pipe at the male end; and the outer pipe still crimped and not laser welded (not sure if I recall that one correctly, but apologize if wrong).
 
jtakeman said:
Does the Excel have a corn/Multifuel rated pipe system?

Yes, the basic residential pellet venting "ExcelPellet" is rated for all agricultural fuels.

From Excel website: Laser welded stainless steel flue resists corrosion from all agricultural products including corn.

Mike -
 
The "Pellet Vent Pro" is laser welded on the inner and outer pipe.

The issue is not related to the welding but instead the sealing ring.

This is still a sheet metal item and as such the tollerances can not be held totally perfect.

This considered the incidence of internal leakage is a possibility.

A quick wrap of the joints with sticky backed metal tape will handle the issue.

My only complaint is that their instructions claim that no sealer is needed.

Oh well, this does not suprise me at all.

Never had any experience with excel so ???? can't comment there.

Just all in a days work.

I would not hesitate to recommend the use of the Simpson pipe but, just what steps to take to make sure that the install is trouble free.


Snowy
 
Snowy Rivers said:
The issue is not related to the welding but instead the sealing ring.

This is still a sheet metal item and as such the tollerances can not be held totally perfect.

This considered the incidence of internal leakage is a possibility.

...

Agreed, the issue is more with their seal than the welding.

The Excel pipe has a replaceable rubber seal, and is about a half-inch thick. If the thickness alone doesn't convince you, your confidence in a good seal increases as you have to really work the pipes together (or take them apart). A little water sprayed on the seal helps expedite the fit.
 
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