Gurgle/gurgle in my pipes

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EForest

EForest

Member
Dec 8, 2007
173
North Central CT. (on the border)
A strange thing happens every time i burn in the Switzer 1050 with storage turned off. i'm hoping a hydronic guru here can help with this puzzling situation. My system consists of a 1050 gallon Gary Switzer 3 pass boiler and two 1000 gallon used propane tanks refiitted to store additional heat. when i piped the system i added a valve to bypass the heat storage allowing return directly into the switzer and another valve to turn off flow into storage. The bioler and tanks are side by side and valves are in same pipe with tees as needed. Normally my system has return into lower propane tank thru bottom then upper tank at opposite end and finally into switzer boiler tank bottom. When i close valve to storage and heat only boiler during low heat demands the system seem to take in a lot of air. As each of my 3 heat zones call for heat the pipes gurgle as the air passes thru. eventually it all quiets down but the entire process can take over 3 hours in shoulder months. None of this happens when I heat all 3000 gallons to 220* during normal heating. The return line from top of top propane storage tank to Switzer has no valve to block expansion. I have often wondered if that is the problem. My system also uses a 500 gallon propane tank for expansion.
the system is awsome except when the gurgle wakes you at 5am and you hoped to sleep till 6. Tanks guys!!
 
Just a couple of things come to mind . First I have storage so as to run more easily in the shoulder season as I can fire hard and run off of storage , it sounds like you dont use your storage at this time . Why not ? Now I wonder if with a 500 gal tank for an expansion tank and excludeing your 2000 storage if you dont need to bleed some air from your expansion tank . At 220 degrees you are flirting with boiling your water you could be creating steam , with useing storage the water may not have gotten that hot but without it could be , you maybe just on the edge . What are you running for a circulating pump and are you mixing your return water , It could be if you are running a larger pump that when you bypass your storage you may have enough restriction to be causeing cavitation , doesnt sound likely but then with 220 degree water it doesnt take much to boil your water either .
 
I rarely burn without heating all tanks. Just on the days when I have no time to refill the firebox. One load brings the 1050 up to temp. It takes three loads to bring all three tanks up to temp. The mix pump is a grundfos 43-75. You make a good point about tank temp on boiler only burns. I always push it to 220* then but only 200-215* when heating all tanks. next time I'll stop at 210 and see what happens. And no I do not mix return water, it goes directly into bottom of boiler or lower tank. What difference would mixing return water do before entering the bottom of a 1000 gal tank? thanks for the input webie
 
The reason I was asking about a mixing valve is I have a termovar on my boiler and if I restrict the balanceing valve to much when I pretty cool return water temps I can here the water gurgle in that termovar valve > ithink the water is actually cavitating in there . How much does your pressure change between hot and cold with all the tanks and useing none of the tanks ?
 
You are definitely boiling the water. There's probably some hotter spots in the boiler than where the temps are taken. I've had oil boilers boil the water and cause gurgling even at a 190 degrees setting. I just backed them down and all was fine.
 
Webie,
Pressure will reach 18 psi when all tanks are hot but only 12-14 when heating boiler tank only. Drops to 5psi when system cools.

excellent point TBS, I should probably make 200* my target temp from now on.

thanks guys!
 
Pressure seems like it is fine I was just wondering if when running with out the storage that you might actually be pulling some air from your expansion tank , but I dont think so .
Just wondering when you are cold and first starting what kinda supply temps are you running to charge your storage tanks .
another dea here to make your system work bettter for you may be to install a mixer valve on your return . My supply water is held at a minimum of 165 and goes up from there . By adding a mixer I think you would get a better stratafication of your storage water . So even if you only had a 1-2 load burn the top of your storage tank ( tanks) be nearly at max temp for you .
 
Webie,
The Switzer boiler is a lot like the Garn but pressurized. There's no need to mix return water. Supply goes out the top and return into bottom. The mix pump is controlled by an aquastat that is normally set to 160*.
Thanks again for the input, it keeps the motor turning.
 
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