Downdraft Gasifier to run internal combustion engine

errrr a ya need a supply of smoken wood ................ a furnace burns up the smoke ...............where are we getting to use the gas from to burn ?
Might as well just generate hydrogen from water to run the engine.

Its quite a bit more complicated than that, but, yeah it actually works. Check out

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/WoodGas/

there are about 10 guys on the group driving on woodgas, and probably 10 more with combined heat & power (CHP) for home.
HOWEVER, the devil's in the details, and its really easy to gunk up an engine with tar if not done properly.
Wayne Keith in Alabama is the master of this, with his 90 mph woodburning Dodge Dakota.
And no, this is not an april fool...

Might be worthwhile to learn this technology in case our economy collapses. Worth nothing it may be easier to make your own ethanol using heat from a gasification boiler for the distillation process since many cars & trucks today will run on E85. The boiling point is between 173.3 degrees (alcohol) and water (212) so in theory it should work. A wood gas powered generator powering a home with solar/wind/battery/inverter setup would be interesting to see in operation.

This is a great idea. Another neat thing to do would be to build a wood gasification steam boiler to run a steam engine. Just like the old days with steam locomotives only no black smoke. Imagine how clean we could run a steam engine these days.

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

How about a wood boiler running your AC? There are several systems on the market that run absorption chillers from evacuated tube solar collectors. A wood boiler could easily drive this refregeration cycle,temperature wise. Maybe heat your pool and run an AC load from the "off-season" boiler.

www.energysolutionscenter.org/resources/PDFs/GT_W03_Small_Absorption_Chillers.pdf

hr

How many miles per cord?

My father ran his fishing boat on wood during WWII. They cut thirty bushels of wood into 3" cubes then made a trip. I think the Combined heat and power option is most practicle for most of us. I envision using wood chips rather than chunks, to save labor and use a waste product. An ideal system would use the grid as a battery, storing extra power generated during the heating season, then using back the electicity the rest of the year, resulting in a very low electric bill. Long before I would convert a car to woodgas, I would drive an electric car, asuming I was generating an abundance of electricity at hyome.

Fred Seton is working on a generator that attaches to the back of a wood fired stove.

Here is a link to a company that does large scale wood gas to electricity

http://www.nexterra.ca/

One thing to keep in mind is that it takes quite a bit of horsepower to chip up wood to the appropriate size and quantity required to run a wood gas unit.

If the gas conditioning is anywhere off spec, the wood gas has quite a bit of water and acid compounds in it that can raise heck with the engine components and engine oil, on old pre WW2 vehicles, the oil system was pretty open and leaky so the contaminants got diluted when new oil was added but with a tight modern oil system, there is a good chance that the bearings are going to have a heard time.

Also note the majority component of wood gas is carbon monoxide, definitely not something that should be taken for granted.

webie said:

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

Click to expand...

If your downdraft boiler can use thermal oil rather than water as the heat transfer fluid then you can use a thermal oil steam evaporator to power your turbine and heat your home.

renewablejohn said:

webie said:

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

Click to expand...

If your downdraft boiler can use thermal oil rather than water as the heat transfer fluid then you can use a thermal oil steam evaporator to power your turbine and heat your home.

Click to expand...

I would think you'd be talking about a lot higher temp and pressure than a typical wood boiler is rated for. Any steam plant I've ever been in was running about 10X the test pressure for regular boilers.

Until my stack of well seasoned splits can be used to drive the air conditioner, beer cooler and high definition TV the summer season has nothing to offer me.

heaterman said:

renewablejohn said:

webie said:

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

Click to expand...

If your downdraft boiler can use thermal oil rather than water as the heat transfer fluid then you can use a thermal oil steam evaporator to power your turbine and heat your home.

Click to expand...

I would think you'd be talking about a lot higher temp and pressure than a typical wood boiler is rated for. Any steam plant I've ever been in was running about 10X the test pressure for regular boilers.

Click to expand...

Temperature is the only difference with water your in the range 80-100C whereas thermal oil is 200-230C pressure should be atmospheric in both cases. Its the difference in temperature between 230C and 100C which allows steam to be generated on demand. In the UK I have approval from the manufacturer of the Dunsley Yorkshire boiler to use thermal oil instead of water. I asked the same question of Woodgun and gained a negative response. Its the steam evaporator not the boiler which works at upto 24 bar pressure.

renewablejohn said:

heaterman said:

renewablejohn said:

webie said:

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

Click to expand...

If your downdraft boiler can use thermal oil rather than water as the heat transfer fluid then you can use a thermal oil steam evaporator to power your turbine and heat your home.

Click to expand...

I would think you'd be talking about a lot higher temp and pressure than a typical wood boiler is rated for. Any steam plant I've ever been in was running about 10X the test pressure for regular boilers.

Click to expand...

Temperature is the only difference with water your in the range 80-100C whereas thermal oil is 200-230C pressure should be atmospheric in both cases. Its the difference in temperature between 230C and 100C which allows steam to be generated on demand. In the UK I have approval from the manufacturer of the Dunsley Yorkshire boiler to use thermal oil instead of water. I asked the same question of Woodgun and gained a negative response. Its the steam evaporator not the boiler which works at upto 24 bar pressure.

Click to expand...

renewablejohn Ok so we are all talking this is possible correct ?
Now the real world question since you guys across the pond seem to be way greener than us yanks over here . Do any of you do such a thing on a homeowners scale . By this what I am saying is generate electricity and heat from wood and how do you do it if you do ?
thanks
Webie

You could generate steam by installing tubes in the lower chamber. It would take modifying the lower door to accept the tubes or tube, depending whether you used a one or two pipe system.

webie said:

renewablejohn said:

heaterman said:

renewablejohn said:

webie said:

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

Click to expand...

If your downdraft boiler can use thermal oil rather than water as the heat transfer fluid then you can use a thermal oil steam evaporator to power your turbine and heat your home.

Click to expand...

I would think you'd be talking about a lot higher temp and pressure than a typical wood boiler is rated for. Any steam plant I've ever been in was running about 10X the test pressure for regular boilers.

Click to expand...

Temperature is the only difference with water your in the range 80-100C whereas thermal oil is 200-230C pressure should be atmospheric in both cases. Its the difference in temperature between 230C and 100C which allows steam to be generated on demand. In the UK I have approval from the manufacturer of the Dunsley Yorkshire boiler to use thermal oil instead of water. I asked the same question of Woodgun and gained a negative response. Its the steam evaporator not the boiler which works at upto 24 bar pressure.

Click to expand...

renewablejohn Ok so we are all talking this is possible correct ?
Now the real world question since you guys across the pond seem to be way greener than us yanks over here . Do any of you do such a thing on a homeowners scale . By this what I am saying is generate electricity and heat from wood and how do you do it if you do ?
thanks
Webie

Click to expand...

Yes we do generate electric on a commercial basis using steam but we consider this to dangerous for domestic use which is why we have designed a slightly lower temperatures hydro turbine system but still using thermal oil from the boiler to produce the pressure. The thermal oil can also be heated by solar during the summer so you can generate all year round 3-12kw on demand. Our first domestic installations are scheduled for later on this year once destructive testing and certification has been completed.

Eventually, I want it all... a gasifier wood boiler (But I have to finish the house first..... well, at least the tubing is in the basement slab already, so that's a start..... later one, I need to pour a slab and tuning on my first & second floor.... than finish the fisrt and the second floor..... untill this is done, I'm leaving in my new basement. Then, I will consider a wood boiler... But right now, I'm heating with a wood stove in the basement,... I love it, but I have to much wood manipulation... so now I'm thinking of building an attach garage to the house to put a boiler in. So I can have rack of wood build up... stak my green wood in there... let it season outside, then take the tractor to move that rack in the barn... than eventually take the tractor to bring that wood right too the boiler in the garage.... that would eleminate a lot of wood manipulation..... Ok, after this is done, I want to put solar panel on the house, a grid-tie in system with a battery bank, something like a Xantrex XW-6048 inverter..... THAN, I would love to build myself a generator, right now, I'm leaning toward a Lister gen set.... but I'm getting more and more interested in a kind of wood generator..... maybe steam with a dc gen set to recharge the battery.... maybe a engine run by wood gas...... I don't know... but I guess by the time I'm there (I'm figuring maybe 10 year to get there in my list) the of the shelf wood gasifier gen set will be available with a good offer, good price, great improve technology...... once I'm there, maybe I will have a full electric car with a full elkectric Bad Boy Buggy that I will use to cut the wood that will recharge my battery on the cart..... But then, I will probablly need a bigger wood lot.... still.... it's a lovely project and it's interesting, but for now, I 'm working 3000 hout a year and «i have a second baby on the way, and still living in the rv or the hgouse basement...... but eventually, I will have a gasifier of a kind..... PROJECTS, that's what keeps us alive......

renewablejohn said:

webie said:

renewablejohn said:

heaterman said:

renewablejohn said:

webie" date="1270667742 said:

How about this for a concept . A downdraft boiler for creating Steam use that to power a turbine for power and the heat for your home . Do it in a contained reclaiming inviroment .

Click to expand...

If your downdraft boiler can use thermal oil rather than water as the heat transfer fluid then you can use a thermal oil steam evaporator to power your turbine and heat your home.

Click to expand...

I would think you'd be talking about a lot higher temp and pressure than a typical wood boiler is rated for. Any steam plant I've ever been in was running about 10X the test pressure for regular boilers.

Click to expand...

Temperature is the only difference with water your in the range 80-100C whereas thermal oil is 200-230C pressure should be atmospheric in both cases. Its the difference in temperature between 230C and 100C which allows steam to be generated on demand. In the UK I have approval from the manufacturer of the Dunsley Yorkshire boiler to use thermal oil instead of water. I asked the same question of Woodgun and gained a negative response. Its the steam evaporator not the boiler which works at upto 24 bar pressure.

Click to expand...

renewablejohn Ok so we are all talking this is possible correct ?
Now the real world question since you guys across the pond seem to be way greener than us yanks over here . Do any of you do such a thing on a homeowners scale . By this what I am saying is generate electricity and heat from wood and how do you do it if you do ?
thanks
Webie

Click to expand...

Yes we do generate electric on a commercial basis using steam but we consider this to dangerous for domestic use which is why we have designed a slightly lower temperatures hydro turbine system but still using thermal oil from the boiler to produce the pressure. The thermal oil can also be heated by solar during the summer so you can generate all year round 3-12kw on demand. Our first domestic installations are scheduled for later on this year once destructive testing and certification has been completed.

Click to expand...

Hey Renewablejohn, do you have any link, info so we can follow the progress on those 3-12 kw..... seems like an interesting product... what is the company ? Ect....
Thanks

Fi-Q

We have set websites up in the past only to be hit by spam so now I will just post to my wall on Victory Gasworks site were Ben is doing a great job of pushing forward the boundaries of gasification and electric generation.