Have One 250 Propane Tank: Now What?

Call a big propane dealer , tell them that you are looking for a scrapped out 500 gallon propane tank . Tell them exactly what you are going to use it for . I think if you call a few dealers you may be able to get to the bone yard that actually scraps these things . Of course expect all the valves out and the threads all peaned because the tank was taken out of propane service . Now if you get to the niddy griddy , try your own add in the lists and if yours is decent shape and paint post a pic and try to trade for a 500 any condition as long as it doesnt leak , I bet it doesnt take too long for the phone to start ringing . There are alot of rusty tanks out there that are still very good with a quick coat of paint .

Hodgdon Bros. Ascutney VT ask for Dusty. There is another place that has been mentioned on this forum in NH or VT try search bar.
Rob

As listed in a previous post. Gates Salvage Yard. I called a few weeks ago they do have some. 802-472-5794

Birdman said:

I am going to try a few more spots around here ( Central NH ). If those don't work out... I may make the trek to Gates in VT.

I read quickly an old post about cleaning out a used propane tank. Hydrogen peroxide and water? Is that the best way?

On another note: Once I clean out the tank what do I do next to it ? Is there a step by step process some one can give me?

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Once cleaned, your next step is to figure out what ports can be utilized and where you need additional ports. That will depend on your storage piping layout. Do you have someone to do any welding? Are you self installing or do you have an installer? This would be a great time to bring anyone else in who will be involved in the process to get their input.

Since you plan to add more tanks, I would suggest planning on hooking the tanks up in series to one another. This will likely mean incorporating a T in the return line from the tank that will eventually go to the other tanks and some extra shutoff valves...

Birdman, If that tank had propane in it and you just opened the valve to let the pressurized gas out it still has enough propane in it to get your name in the paper. If you can get the gage out or one of the largest fittings out at the top that's big enough to get your garden hose down into you can fill it with water. That will drive out all the propane gas. It is then disarmed.

Hydrogen peroxide is good but you'll likely need a lot of it since the stuff at the pharmacy is pretty low concentration. Chlorine bleach works well and is affordable. I've read that Oxyclean (the laundry additive, some kind of perchlorate) works well, too. You may not get the smell completely out but the gag factor will be gone.

After that remove the water and start plumbing and/or welding.

Birdman said:

I do have a friend who is an awesome mechanic and welder. He is my go to guy as far as teh welding goes. My plan is to get a 500 gallon tank and combine it with the 250 I have already. The 250 tank I have now has 4 ports on top.

How does the water flow into these tanks? I am really raw on this. I did read some stuff on this site.... but not sure I get it. Does thewater go into the tank via a pipe that goes down to teh bottom of the tank... something about diffusionh of the hot water into the tank to make stratifying better? I want to just prep my welder dude on waht I might need

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You want to charge to the top and return from bottom. When drawing you want to draw from the top and return to the bottom. Sounds like you have plenty of top ports, but will need a port on the bottom. You can either cut one in and have your welder attach a fitting or you can run a dip tube from one of the top ports to the bottom of the tank. You will want to use the remaining ports for things like temp probes and perhaps a pressure gauge. Remember you will also need to install the correct amount of expansion based on your total storage capacity.

Plumbing to the bottom looked like a PITA so I used dip tubes for my returns. I did bore one hole in the bottom for a boiler drain, just in case.

As far as the top goes I believe you need 7 ports:
Wood boiler feed
Wood boiler return
Oil boiler feed
Oil boiler return
Pressure relief valve
Tridicator
Aquastat (if applicable)

Plus a drain on the bottom if you want.

I also just got a 1000 gallon tank and am wondering how many holes i need. My gasification boiler will be outside in shed along with the tank or tanks. I would like to get another 1000 gallon tank. Why do i need holes for the oil boiler which is inside house? How do i plumb the two tanks together? Would like to get these all ready to go.

On the step by step, I would let soak with bleach over night or 24 hrs, a second rinse with bleach wouldn't be a bad idea. On the second you could add a bunch of Lemon Joy dish soap or Simple Green to help with the smell. As this foams out the top when filling you can scrub the outside of the tank with the over flowing soap and bleach. If tanks ore staying outside you wouldn't need to be so thorough.
There are a bunch of threads on welding propane tanks. Creating a leak proof, pressure weld on a propane tank ( hardened steel I think ) is quite a bit different, more difficult, than being a good, proficient welder. Don't ask !
As I recall trying to get a tank in NH is like getting one in MA very difficult if not impossible. Liability & Homeland Security are 2 reasons that come to mind. There are some very nice used tanks available. The rust is usually heaviest on the bottom so roll the tank over and take a close look. All will have some pitting but stay away prom tanks that have 2 and 3 layers of pits on them.
While chasing down tanks you can make an expansion tank from a 100 GALLON propane tank. Large expansion tanks can get expensive.

Nice install Maniac, what kind of boiler ? nice bar code.... I'll take 2 !
Rob

Rob, Can you tell us more on how to make expansion tanks? Can anybody tell me how much expansion do you need for 2000 gallon?
What city are you in ManiacPD? I am in Monmouth.

DaveBP said:

Hydrogen peroxide is good but you'll likely need a lot of it since the stuff at the pharmacy is pretty low concentration.

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For what it's worth, if you're looking for peroxide, I think I recall that swimming pool places may sell 30% hydrogen peroxide in gallon jugs for use for pool 'shock' treatment with the non-chlorine pool chemistry. Especially if you can find a place that sells a generic brand of the peroxide, I believe that it may cost less than you'd expect.

YMMV and be VERY careful with the stuff- a splash in the eye might leave you blind.

ManiacPD said:

Plumbing to the bottom looked like a PITA so I used dip tubes for my returns. I did bore one hole in the bottom for a boiler drain, just in case.

As far as the top goes I believe you need 7 ports:
Wood boiler feed
Wood boiler return
Oil boiler feed
Oil boiler return
Pressure relief valve
Tridicator
Aquastat (if applicable)

Plus a drain on the bottom if you want.

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Some of this depends on your piping scheme. You shouldn't need to hook the oil in to storage at all if you can heat zones directly from wood or storage. (the sticky is a good example of that) If you insist on hooking the oil in to storage, then you could tee off of the ports from the wood and save the need for two extra ports. Dip tubes are fine for the return water, but I would point out that if you are putting in a drain on the bottom any way, you could use that port as both the return and then put a drain in that line with an isolation valve between it and the wood. It will save time and money if you can find ways to just utilize the existing ports...

sparke said:

As listed in a previous post. Gates Salvage Yard. I called a few weeks ago they do have some. 802-472-5794

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+2 Gates had all sorts of tanks, propane, stainless, etc. of all shapes and sizes, when I was up there last fall for something unrelated.

I'm in St. Albans, about an hour north of Monmouth. PM me if you'd like to take a look.

The tank was new when I bought it. It certainly cost more but in the grand scheme of things I decided it was worth the money. The boiler is a late 1970's Memco, very antiquated and inefficient compared to the gassers but for $500 it easily paid for itself. I don't know if I could say the same at this point with an EKO or Tarm but maybe someday I'll buy one.

I enlisted the help of a friend who is a talented welder to put the fittings in. Weld-on the fittings, which are flat, on a curved, hardened steel tank was more than I wanted to tackle. We filled it with water, topped with air to 80 psi (2.5X max operating pressure), and left it over night to pressure test. No leaks.

Of course now it is boxed in with sheetmetal and insulated with unfaced fiberglass batts. Standby losses are around 1-2 degrees per hour. I am firing once a day right now, but when it was warm a few weeks ago I went two days on one burn. You can only imagine the losses I had at first with no insulation. My wood was dry for sure!

Do I wish I had a bigger 500 gallon tank? Yes and no. The Memco is maxed out in the dead of winter when it's -10F with 20-30 mph winds. I'm heating 3,000 sq. ft. on top of a hill and it takes a lot of Btus to keep it warm. I am unsure if I had 500 gallons and got behind for some reason I might not be able to catch up if it stays cold for several days in a row. With 250 gallons I can maintain providing I fire every it twice a day.

I've got about $5K tied up in the whole thing. It paid for itself two years ago when oil was $4.50/gallon. It's paying me now!

Here are some ideas for expansion.
www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/38938/
www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/19380/

Here's a story..... When I couldn't get a tank around Boston and was searching into Rode Island for one. My wife and I were planning to go to a wedding in VT mid summer. You guessed it. We went scrapping to Hogdon Bros on way to wedding in search of used tanks ! Wife who riding co pilot is saying, How come were going this way ?
Rob