Install Igniter into Englander 25-PDVC/55-SHP10

first thing i would do is call my shop at 800-245-6489 , i'll be inat 8 am on monday and i'd be happy to help you get that stove straightened out. when you call in ask for me by name "mike" ok? with a few questions and some suggestions as to what to do im sure we can have that stove up and running or at least i'll be able to tell you what is causing your problems so you can decide on fix or sell.

bookpile said:

I bought a house last November that had an Englander 25 installed in the basement. After struggling to heat the house with it last winter.......

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First of all, I hope you don't mean you literally are trying to heat the whole house with a small 25 PDVC....even at it's best, it's not a big BTU stove. And pellet stoves are not WHOLE house heaters, unless you buy a pellet boiler or furnace.

Secondly, it's not clear from your post on this either, but did you mean that you just finished the basement, and it was NOT finished last winter? If so, not too many stoves will heat from an unfinished basement.....you end up heating the cold concrete/blocks.

Third, since this stove was in the house when you bought it, did you COMPLETELY clean the stove & exhaust pipe before using it last winter?? And I don't mean just vacuuming the burnpot/firebox....I mean removing both blowers & cleaning them & installing new gaskets, cleaning every nook & cranny of fly ash, removing & cleaning the burnpot, cleaning the ENTIRE exhaust pipe, etc, etc.

Any or all of these would result in sub-par performance from ANY stove.

bookpile said:

I bought a house last November that had an Englander 25 installed in the basement. After struggling to heat the house with it last winter, my wife and I both despise that stove. It was such a pain to get lit and stay lit every day.

We now have an Accentra insert installed upstairs so that won't be a problem, but the basement is finished and I would like to heat it occasionally. Before I toss this thing on the curb is there anyway to install an auto igniter in it? I'm not sure it would be worth it anyway, as often times if you turned the stove past 5 for any length of time, it would go out and just continue to pile up pellets in the burnpot, so when you opened the door they would cascade all over the floor.

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If you "toss this thing to the curb" let me know because I will gladly take it off your hands.

Steve

bookpile said:

I bought a house last November that had an Englander 25 installed in the basement. After struggling to heat the house with it last winter, my wife and I both despise that stove. It was such a pain to get lit and stay lit every day.

We now have an Accentra insert installed upstairs so that won't be a problem, but the basement is finished and I would like to heat it occasionally. Before I toss this thing on the curb is there anyway to install an auto igniter in it? I'm not sure it would be worth it anyway, as often times if you turned the stove past 5 for any length of time, it would go out and just continue to pile up pellets in the burnpot, so when you opened the door they would cascade all over the floor.

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Don`t blame the stove.
For starters it`s a small stove that wasn`t designed to heat an entire house from a basement. And a larger stove would cook you out of the finished basement anyway when trying to heat the upstairs.
Apparently the stove also needed some attention , probably a result of neglect from the previous owner.(or yourself?)
If you neglect the Accentra you`ll be despising it too.

Best way I've found to light them is: Put a handful of pellets in the burn pot, turn the stove on, use a propane torch to get the pellets started then slowly close the door.

bookpile said:

After struggling to heat the house with it last winter, my wife and I both despise that stove. It was such a pain to get lit and stay lit every day.

I never said that I have any issues with the stove putting out enough heat to heat the house, because I don’t.

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Am I missing something here? Book...please tell your boss you need a few days off....with pay!

I think his struggle was lighting and keeping it lit. Once lit it did fine keeping the house warm.

I also vote for the propane torch lighting technique. Much less hassle's. I had to use it most of last season while trying to figure out my ignitor issue!

bookpile said:

Mike, I see that you're associated with England Stoves and I'd be happy to talk to you. I'll be working 12 hour days this week so I'm not sure if I will get a chance to call but I will definitly be in touch.

As to everyone else, I never said that I have any issues with the stove putting out enough heat to heat the house, because I don't. We have a small Cape Cod with a finished basement. We don't use the 2nd floor and it's just my wife and I so all the other bedrooms are closed off as well. When the stove was running I didn't have any heat issues. I burned 2 1/2 tons of pellets last year and about 200 gallons of oil.

As for cleaning, I cleaned the stove and flue completely (except for the blower) as soon as we moved in. I disassembled the entire flue and cleaned it two more times throughout the winter. Admittedly I did not know you were supposed to take the blower out and will do so before this winter. Also the stove was manufactured in August 2000, so I do not know the maintenance history before last Nov.

All that being said, the lack of auto ignition is a serious reason why we dislike the stove. That is why I asked the original question about installing one as we are considering selling it and getting something else. Gio, I will blame the stove for not having the auto ignite feature, feel free to stop by and show me how proper maintenance would cause an igniter to appear any time you want to. On a serious note, I see you have the same stove. When you light it initially and the door is open, do you have stove turned on or off? I find if it is off quite a bit of smoke comes into the house. However, if it is on, the auger often pushes too many pellets down and smoothers the fire.

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Heh,heh,heh. You got me there on the igniter ! I don`t really know if the older Englander 25 had auto ignition but Mike would surely know. Actually my little Harman P38 (6 yrs old) also lacks auto ignite but I certainly don`t despise it , I love it. Come Nov 1st I light it and it runs 24/7 til I shut it down to clean it , every 3-4 weeks maybe a bit more. It`s also in the finished basement .
Obviously the Englander needs a more frequent shut down and cleaning since it has no ash pan but it shouldn`t be too much of a hassle either. A quick scrape of the burn plate and vacuum the ashes every couple days don`t take long. My 25 PDVC out in the rear workshop/garage gets lit up and run daily but I don`t use the auto igniter. It does in fact work fine but I disconnected it anyway because I can get the stove up to temp much faster by turning the stove on and immediately placing a cup of kerosene soaked pellets in the burnpot and light em with a match and leave the door barely cracked open for a minute. I never have a flare up or smoke coming out. Kerosene is less than 3.00 a gallon. (I know it`s not recommended but I know what works best for me)
My stove exhaust fan runs automatically when the stove is turned on to expel the smoke/gases but if the door is left open for too long I believe the stove should stop feeding pellets . I don`t get smoke coming out the door.
Don`t be afraid to call Englander service as they will walk you thru the whole operation and trouble shoot it with you. They know the controller and what it should or shouldn`t be doing. Best thing is it`s free. Few if any other company does this .

If you are getting a lot of smoke in the house on startup you might want to check the exhaust piping (ventpipe) for proper sizing and installation. Good luck.

When you speak with Mike, have him go over the feed settings with you. You stove shouldn't be going out unless you want it to.

bookpile said:

Mike, I see that you're associated with England Stoves and I'd be happy to talk to you. I'll be working 12 hour days this week so I'm not sure if I will get a chance to call but I will definitly be in touch.

As to everyone else, I never said that I have any issues with the stove putting out enough heat to heat the house, because I don't. We have a small Cape Cod with a finished basement. We don't use the 2nd floor and it's just my wife and I so all the other bedrooms are closed off as well. When the stove was running I didn't have any heat issues. I burned 2 1/2 tons of pellets last year and about 200 gallons of oil.

As for cleaning, I cleaned the stove and flue completely (except for the blower) as soon as we moved in. I disassembled the entire flue and cleaned it two more times throughout the winter. Admittedly I did not know you were supposed to take the blower out and will do so before this winter. Also the stove was manufactured in August 2000, so I do not know the maintenance history before last Nov.

All that being said, the lack of auto ignition is a serious reason why we dislike the stove. That is why I asked the original question about installing one as we are considering selling it and getting something else. Gio, I will blame the stove for not having the auto ignite feature, feel free to stop by and show me how proper maintenance would cause an igniter to appear any time you want to. On a serious note, I see you have the same stove. When you light it initially and the door is open, do you have stove turned on or off? I find if it is off quite a bit of smoke comes into the house. However, if it is on, the auger often pushes too many pellets down and smoothers the fire.

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a 2000 model does not have an igniter nor can the stove be easily modified to accept one. the igniters were initially install in our stoves in 2004. that said if the ignition system is the "make or break" as to keeping the unit or replacing it i'd say get the unit cleaned up maybe do a repainting and look to sell it.

as for lighting , with the manual start units i use gel or even a plumbers torch , what you want to do is start the gel on the pellets in the pot and turn the unit on leave the door cracked for a couple minutes so the exhaust doesnt overpower the flame in the gel once you see the pellets themselves start to ember up ease the door closed and she should pick up and burn.

also to the OP if you wish to "kibbitz" about the unit by e mail or PM feel free to contact me that way, its not quite as quick to get all your info to you but im fine with working that way if you are

Auto ignition, a deal breaker or not?
Obviously the benefits of having an auto igniter in one`s pellet stove is convenient , time saving , and can even save fuel/heat depending on how the stove is used especially during the shoulder seasons when temporary run times are intermittent and common. You`d be hard pressed to find a late model pellet stove without one . It`s probably the most important feature that purchasers demand.
For those who own a stove without an igniter , there is usually no choice but to follow the manufacturer`s recommended method to start the pellets (usually alcohol gel) , but gel isn`t always ideal in all stoves and at up $8+ for a pint it becomes an added expense.
Some experienced users have experimented and developed alternative methods that they consider to be an appropriate and reasonably safe method to start pellets burning quick and easy but don`t expect any manufacturer to endorse anything but what`s recommended in their users manual as they rightfully have to act responsible to protect themselves from litigation.
The bottom line is it can indeed often be a real pain in the axx starting a stove without auto ingition , consequently finding a better method suited to you and your stove can go a long way to significantly reduce the time and hassle it takes to get the pellets going. Auto ignition has become much less of an issue once I settled on a method that worked best for my stoves.

I have been heating my ENTIRE 1800 ft 2 level house w/ my $375 , returned to Lowes as too small 25-PDVC since 05. After first season have always used a pushbutton propane or MAPP torch, whatever I have around, and have usually only shut off the stove for half hour, on Saturday, when the sun comes around. Use my shop vac with the hose and the line cord through the patio door. I will be replacing the combustion blower this year, as I broke an impeller blade off carelessly cleaning it last year. I rode out the season by breaking off the opposite blade, to keep it in balance. Other than the fact that this lovely little stove is a bit noisy, being right in my living room, and when I get home from work it is in the mid seventies in my downstairs, I have no complaints. Remove and clean cat and dog from room air blower twice per burn season, and do the combustion air blower too! Lube the so called "sealed " bearings with Teflon Lube pen oiler. Let them soak up what they want. Spin them by hand while you watch the game. repeat as required.

breklaw said:

I have been heating my ENTIRE 1800 ft 2 level house w/ my $375 , returned to Lowes as too small 25-PDVC since 05.

Other than the fact that this lovely little stove is a bit noisy, being right in my living room, and when I get home from work it is in the mid seventies in my downstairs, I have no complaints.

Remove and clean cat and dog from room air blower twice per burn season, and do the combustion air blower too! Lube the so called "sealed " bearings with Teflon Lube pen oiler. Let them soak up what they want. Spin them by hand while you watch the game. repeat as required.

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Nice deal, I got mine for 400, beat me by $25.00

Mine is a bit noisy as well but hey I'm concerned about the heat, and also have no complaints except for the cheap Lower auger motor going on me

Thanks for Sealed bearing Lube tip, I'm going to do this before I fire the stove up

Nice stove by the way, any more tips send them my way, and good luck with the stove this season.

breklaw said:

I have been heating my ENTIRE 1800 ft 2 level house w/ my $375 , returned to Lowes as too small 25-PDVC since 05. After first season have always used a pushbutton propane or MAPP torch, whatever I have around, and have usually only shut off the stove for half hour, on Saturday, when the sun comes around. Use my shop vac with the hose and the line cord through the patio door. I will be replacing the combustion blower this year, as I broke an impeller blade off carelessly cleaning it last year. I rode out the season by breaking off the opposite blade, to keep it in balance. Other than the fact that this lovely little stove is a bit noisy, being right in my living room, and when I get home from work it is in the mid seventies in my downstairs, I have no complaints. Remove and clean cat and dog from room air blower twice per burn season, and do the combustion air blower too! Lube the so called "sealed " bearings with Teflon Lube pen oiler. Let them soak up what they want. Spin them by hand while you watch the game. repeat as required.

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where do you buy the teflon lube pen oiler ?

Bookpile,

My thoughts were the same the minute I read your post. Make sure that stove is clean from stem to stern, check with Mike on proper exhaust blower setting especially since this is a basement install, and try some different techniques for your manual start.

I think once you get over the hump you won't want to part with that stove.