I was recently given a 1991 Jotul 8TDC with a blown cat. Its going in a tree house (1000 sq feet), and am wondering if I can run it without the cat. The other thing I was thinking about is the other series #8 are non cat and could be converted over. The refractory housing is melted and looks like it can be replace with the non cat housing. Are there more then ones to skin a cat? Or do I just need to poney up and get a cat and housing, (something I can't afford now but would like heat). Thanks all!
New to forum, Hello! Converting a Jotul cat to non catalytic
- Thread starter spacecase
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BrowningBAR
Minister of Fire
spacecase said:
1. I want to see pictures of this Tree House
2. Pony up and get the cat and housing.
TROY COOK
New Member
I think the stove will work,But You kind of loose the burn time without using the Cat,Even on a new cat stove you loose efficiency of the stove when you burn it without the cat. Non cat stoves have air tubes for secondary burn and baffles witch gets you more performance and longer burns... I would like to see this Tree house also
certified106
Minister of Fire
RAMSAY said:I think the stove will work,But You kind of loose the burn time without using the Cat,Even on a new cat stove you loose efficiency of the stove when you burn it without the cat. Non cat stoves have air tubes for secondary burn and baffles witch gets you more performance and longer burns... I would like to see this Tree house also
Hmm... Not sure I would agree that Non cat stoves have better burn times than cat stoves but that's just my opinion. The stove would still burn wood without the cat but do it in a less efficient manner with a lot more air pollution. I would definitely like to see pictures of the tree house as it now has my curiosity piqued for sure.
shawneyboy
Minister of Fire
spacecase
Welcome to the forum an so you know it didn't happen unless you have pictures. So we all want to see your tree house.
Welcome to the forum an so you know it didn't happen unless you have pictures. So we all want to see your tree house.
Backwoods Savage
Minister of Fire
Welcome to the forum spacecase.
Of course you can burn that stove without the cat but as others have stated, you won't get as much heat from it. We sometimes burn our stove without the cat but that is only early fall or late spring when we don't want much heat. We'll turn the cat on most times though as it burns cleaner and longer with the cat burning.
Of course you can burn that stove without the cat but as others have stated, you won't get as much heat from it. We sometimes burn our stove without the cat but that is only early fall or late spring when we don't want much heat. We'll turn the cat on most times though as it burns cleaner and longer with the cat burning.
grommal
Feeling the Heat
I think RAMSAY was trying to say that the burn tubes and baffles help a noncat stove get longer burn times than you'd get without them, not that noncat gets better burn times than a cat stove. If you run your cat stove without the cat, you basically will have a stove without any secondary combustion technology at all, and should expect lots of smoke and creosote from a smoldering burn OR short burn times if you burn it hot enough to avoid the smolder.certified106 said:RAMSAY said:I think the stove will work,But You kind of loose the burn time without using the Cat,Even on a new cat stove you loose efficiency of the stove when you burn it without the cat. Non cat stoves have air tubes for secondary burn and baffles witch gets you more performance and longer burns... I would like to see this Tree house also
Hmm... Not sure I would agree that Non cat stoves have better burn times than cat stoves but that's just my opinion. The stove would still burn wood without the cat but do it in a less efficient manner with a lot more air pollution. I would definitely like to see pictures of the tree house as it now has my curiosity piqued for sure.
TROY COOK
New Member
What I was saying is that Cat stoves without using the Cat. would not meet the performance of a modern non cat stove used at It's full potential... Is that better ?certified106 said:RAMSAY said:I think the stove will work,But You kind of loose the burn time without using the Cat,Even on a new cat stove you loose efficiency of the stove when you burn it without the cat. Non cat stoves have air tubes for secondary burn and baffles witch gets you more performance and longer burns... I would like to see this Tree house also
Hmm... Not sure I would agree that Non cat stoves have better burn times than cat stoves but that's just my opinion. The stove would still burn wood without the cat but do it in a less efficient manner with a lot more air pollution. I would definitely like to see pictures of the tree house as it now has my curiosity piqued for sure.
certified106
Minister of Fire
RAMSAY said:What I was saying is that Cat stoves without using the Cat. would not meet the performance of a modern non cat stove used at It's full potential... Is that better ?certified106 said:RAMSAY said:I think the stove will work,But You kind of loose the burn time without using the Cat,Even on a new cat stove you loose efficiency of the stove when you burn it without the cat. Non cat stoves have air tubes for secondary burn and baffles witch gets you more performance and longer burns... I would like to see this Tree house also
Hmm... Not sure I would agree that Non cat stoves have better burn times than cat stoves but that's just my opinion. The stove would still burn wood without the cat but do it in a less efficient manner with a lot more air pollution. I would definitely like to see pictures of the tree house as it now has my curiosity piqued for sure.
Sorry I misunderstood what you were saying and I would definitely agree with your above statement. I personally would not burn a cat stove without a cat unless it was an emergency situation as there is to much loss of efficiency.
http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l587/2red4u/IMGP1110.jpg
http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l587/2red4u/IMGP1113.jpg
I was thinking of filling the empty void of where my cat once was with volcanic rock (the kind they use for grills). I would love to replace the cat Im the kind of person who like to fix something the right way. In order to do this I need to replace the cat housing, thats like 400 dollars. I have one of those old iron woodstoves that barley works.
Oh yes the principle of the tree house is low impact using recycled materials. Cost me under $300 to build. Its like the stove, compromise.
Something Americans need to learn to do. Thank you all for the reply and interest in the tree house.
http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l587/2red4u/IMGP1113.jpg
I was thinking of filling the empty void of where my cat once was with volcanic rock (the kind they use for grills). I would love to replace the cat Im the kind of person who like to fix something the right way. In order to do this I need to replace the cat housing, thats like 400 dollars. I have one of those old iron woodstoves that barley works.
Oh yes the principle of the tree house is low impact using recycled materials. Cost me under $300 to build. Its like the stove, compromise.
Something Americans need to learn to do. Thank you all for the reply and interest in the tree house.
TROY COOK
New Member
Awesome camp or tree house.I love it ! I would be careful with that void.I think getting something to fit air tight is key, Thick steel or cast plate?
Green Energy
Feeling the Heat
Three years ago my cat crumbled in my Dutchwest in late January. I continued to burn in it. (I had not yet gotten dry (<20% MC) wood religion). I was shocked to discover how much creosote I got in 4 to 6 weeks of burning without a cat. I also had evidence of a "minor" chimney fire (minor in that it did not become major).
So be careful with burning without a cat, i.e., keep the fire hot, do not turn down the air so that you loose the flames before coaling, sweep your flue after a 2-3 weeks or so of burning to see how your doing with creosote.
So be careful with burning without a cat, i.e., keep the fire hot, do not turn down the air so that you loose the flames before coaling, sweep your flue after a 2-3 weeks or so of burning to see how your doing with creosote.
http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l587/2red4u/IMGP1114.jpg
Thats my stove right now. The funny thing is I have run it for two years, keep checking for creosote but nun! The stove has a mind of its own, sometimes it just goes red hot around stove pipe. Needles to say I am always around when I am burning it it. I just wonder if the jotul would be better.
Thats my stove right now. The funny thing is I have run it for two years, keep checking for creosote but nun! The stove has a mind of its own, sometimes it just goes red hot around stove pipe. Needles to say I am always around when I am burning it it. I just wonder if the jotul would be better.
Looks like more than just the pipe got red hot on this stove. As you have found out, this box stove is hard to regulate. It is coarsely made, not well sealed and has a crude air control. Some would call them flat out dangerous to run. I can appreciate that you are trying to keep things cheap, but the approach is somewhat flawed. I don't think the Jotul is a good choice for you, especially in this application. It should go to someone that has the bucks to rebuild and get it running right.
For your setup a basic, stout, ~2 cu ft steel stove with good air control will suffice. If new, hover around Lowes and Home Depot toward the end of next month. They will be ready to close out stove inventory about then and you may be able to get a good deal on an Englander 13NC. Or watch craigslist for good deals on an older stove that doesn't need major parts. There are a lot of them going on the market now as people update to EPA stove to get the tax credit.
For your setup a basic, stout, ~2 cu ft steel stove with good air control will suffice. If new, hover around Lowes and Home Depot toward the end of next month. They will be ready to close out stove inventory about then and you may be able to get a good deal on an Englander 13NC. Or watch craigslist for good deals on an older stove that doesn't need major parts. There are a lot of them going on the market now as people update to EPA stove to get the tax credit.
"Stupid is what stupid gets" - Forest Gump, I always love that quote. In this case I am the "stupid" in that one, I know I must terrify folks on this forum but ultimately I am a poor Vermonter trying to keep warm. I'm thinking of taking the refractory housing and grate at bottom out and having them welded. There is a technique for welding cast iron call reverse welding with nickel rod. I would then get a cat next year and have a wonderful stove. This would be in the future, in hind sight I wish this was the non cat series 8. Stupid is what stupid gets!
Don't beat up on yourself. We're all learning here, even us old coots. If you were stupid, you wouldn't have come here and asked good questions.
In the meantime, be careful with that box stove. It could be at the end of life. Watch it like a hawk for cracks. And mind the clearances to combustibles which are supposed to be 36" all directions for this stove.
In the meantime, be careful with that box stove. It could be at the end of life. Watch it like a hawk for cracks. And mind the clearances to combustibles which are supposed to be 36" all directions for this stove.
Ok reviving an old thread. Thanks everyone for your imput. OK to go with convention wisdom I found this cat for 60 bucks, I can do that.
http://catcombustor.mybisi.com/product/8-8tdc-and-series-8-models-4-x-7-canned
Does anyone know what the melted 2 internal pieces are called or numbered in the picture? I will just order them I think.
http://catcombustor.mybisi.com/product/8-8tdc-and-series-8-models-4-x-7-canned
Does anyone know what the melted 2 internal pieces are called or numbered in the picture? I will just order them I think.
I know nothing about the company, but they are selling this cat at less than half of Condar or Woodman's prices which makes me wonder if something is not kosher. One has to wonder if there has been a compromise on quality at least.
For parts I would call Woodman's Parts Plus (NH (603) 522-8216) or call The Preston Trading Post (CT 860.886.1484) and see if they can help you.
Personally, I would consider getting a proper stove that you can safely enjoy. For the price of fixing this stove I would be looking something like an Englander 17VL or at least a good used stove that has not been abused and neglected like this poor 8TDC. The new stove will burn cleaner and safer for years to come.
http://www.overstockstoves.com/50tvl17--epa-certified-noncatalytic-wood-stove--1250171200.html
US Stove ASP1100B - http://www.dynamitebuys.com/store/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=6910
Century Whistler (not EPA) - http://www.northlineexpress.com/item/5DL-DB05152/Century-Whistler-Pedestal-Wood-Stove
Or at least pick up a used stove that is in good condition for the price of fixing the Jotul. This Resolute in Barre might be worth checking on if it is a Resolute I and has been well treated:
http://burlington.craigslist.org/for/2612845711.html
For parts I would call Woodman's Parts Plus (NH (603) 522-8216) or call The Preston Trading Post (CT 860.886.1484) and see if they can help you.
Personally, I would consider getting a proper stove that you can safely enjoy. For the price of fixing this stove I would be looking something like an Englander 17VL or at least a good used stove that has not been abused and neglected like this poor 8TDC. The new stove will burn cleaner and safer for years to come.
http://www.overstockstoves.com/50tvl17--epa-certified-noncatalytic-wood-stove--1250171200.html
US Stove ASP1100B - http://www.dynamitebuys.com/store/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=6910
Century Whistler (not EPA) - http://www.northlineexpress.com/item/5DL-DB05152/Century-Whistler-Pedestal-Wood-Stove
Or at least pick up a used stove that is in good condition for the price of fixing the Jotul. This Resolute in Barre might be worth checking on if it is a Resolute I and has been well treated:
http://burlington.craigslist.org/for/2612845711.html
raybonz
Minister of Fire
certified106 said:RAMSAY said:I think the stove will work,But You kind of loose the burn time without using the Cat,Even on a new cat stove you loose efficiency of the stove when you burn it without the cat. Non cat stoves have air tubes for secondary burn and baffles witch gets you more performance and longer burns... I would like to see this Tree house also
Hmm... Not sure I would agree that Non cat stoves have better burn times than cat stoves but that's just my opinion. The stove would still burn wood without the cat but do it in a less efficient manner with a lot more air pollution. I would definitely like to see pictures of the tree house as it now has my curiosity piqued for sure.
+1 If anything the exact opposite is more likely to be true or at the least a virtual tie but efficiency will dictate this..
Ray
Edit: I saw a later post after posting this one..
BG offered some solid advice and I fully agree with what he suggests you do.. I understand money is tight but safety has to be considered 1st..
I would put the Jotul up with Vermont Castings in terms of build. Good jolly look at the old stove that is anything but safe. The Jotul does not have collateral damage. I may even be able to have a welding shop "reverse" weld (process for welding cast iron) the two shields or what ever you call them. I definitively appreciated everyone's advice and in a perfect world yes this is not the most appropriate stove. But this is anything but a perfect world where compromises have to be made. Plus the darned thing is really heavy and I dont feel like moving it 
Anyone happen to know what part number they are or what they are called? (The melted bits on my Jotul)
Anyone happen to know what part number they are or what they are called? (The melted bits on my Jotul)
The original Resolutes were excellent stoves. There are still a lot of them running today.
Give the suggested places a call for parts info, they may even have the manual for your stove.
Give the suggested places a call for parts info, they may even have the manual for your stove.
Well it seems to me if this stove can heat a 2,000 square foot house with the cat it should be able to heat a 200 square foot house with out it. I really do appreciate every ones advice, I think a little VT castings or small Jotul would be perfect but I lost my job (printing business has been eradicated now). Vermont is a very hard place to live but it makes us strong. I definitively can't do things by the book anymore things have changed so much, I think this is what my project is ultimately about.
raybonz
Minister of Fire
spacecase said:
From what I have read here they are not good cats because of the way they are made they will clog up and you can't clean them.. It isn't a bargain unless it works.. Plus I also read that those who ordered them took forever to recieve them.. BG gave solid advice I would give it careful consideration..
Ray
North of 60
Minister of Fire
spacecase said:
Sorry that times are tuff for you,.......BUT unsafe things that you are setting yourself up for and inefficient ideas will not take pitty on you if all hell breaks lose. This is supportive advice and in no means being disrespectful.
Hoping you good luck.
N of 60
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