Chimney Fire, Damaged s/s chimney on OG FP -- How to convince wife to go w/ Stove or Insert?

  • Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.

    We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.

    We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
Status
Not open for further replies.

TreePapa

Minister of Fire
Dec 24, 2008
612
Southern Calif.
Yeah, I haven't been on this forum in a while. Work got bizzy and I had no more spare time. Sorry for the long post.

Anyway, it's been a couple years since I had the chimney swept. I was intending to have it done before we started using the FP this year but (famous last words, right?). And yup, we had a chimney fire. Not too bad, fortunately -- I think it burnt out the available creosote and went out. Sorry, no pics.

I have 3+ paragraphs of details, but I'll put them in a reply to the post. My main question is this: the flue is damaged and must be replaced. So how do I convince my dear wife that we should go with a woodstove or insert, rather than just rebuilding / replacing the s/s Class A 12" flue? Either way is gonna cost $$$. Some of which may be covered by homeowner's insurance.

There are 2 issues w/ a stove or insert: 1) my DW doesn't like the idea. She wants to have the open FP for aesthetic reasons. 2) the room (den) where the FP is located is maybe 150 sq. ft., give or take. One 32" door to the rest of the house. One operable window (and about 60 sq. ft. of fixed windows). We live in sunny so. calif. where the lows rarely go below 40 (F) and extremely rarely below freezing. Today it we had a high of 80 and lows in the 50's. Have not turned on the furnace and wouldn't have a fire in the FP if it were safe to use.

I need to find a stove or insert that my wife will like, will look good in the FP, and won't cook us out of the room! I like the Jotul F 3 CB. For a small stove it accepts relatively large splits (18"), has "open door viewing" option, and short leg option, so it just might fit in the FP and not stick out over the hearth. On the other hand, even a fraction of its 42,000 btu capacity could bake us straight out of the den on all but the coldest of nights, while the layout of the house almost assures it won't do much to heat the rest of the house.

Any other suggestions? Any suggestions on convincing my dear wife?

Peace,
- Sequoia
 
Short sidetrack to describe the event: we had a nice fire going in the FP. I picked up an armful of 1/4" to 1/2" sticks off the driveway that I hadn't finished cleaning up from a standing dead apricot tree a friend cut down for us. I put the whole armful on top of the fire. At once. It burned real hot. Then "Woosh" or "Roar" and we knew something wasn't right. I went outside and saw sparks coming out of the chimney cap. Then we saw flames on the chimney cap. Not coming out of the chimney cap, but burning on the outside of the cap. Prolly from deposited creosote, maybe also 'cuz it got so hot that the sealant on the drip ring started to burn?

We called 911 from the house phone (still had to give address). Fire Dept. was here in about 6 or 8 minutes. By the time they got here, the chim fire was out, no sparks and no burning chim cap. Fire in the FP still going nice. Firemen checked the cap found it damaged (basically, the damage was to the seal between the cap and the drip ring). They looked down the flue and saw "nothing of immediate concern". They used infrared (I think) thermometer to check the walls (okay) and climbed up in the attic but just look over at the chimney chase and prolly pointed the IR thermometer at it.

They left and told us we didn't need to extinguish the fire, but all present agreed we shouldn't add any more fuel. We let the fire burn out, and closed the damper the next day. I called a chimney sweep co. for an inspection and they came out this morning. That's when we got the bad news: apparent damage to the 12" Class A s/s chimney pipe above the OG masonry FP. There were at least two places where there appear to be gaps at the joints between sections. I got up on the roof and looked. Gaps look too small to put a finger through, but perhaps big enough to fit a "pipe cleaner" (remember those). Also, instead of a bond beam and anchor plate (as req'd by L.A. bldg. code), the chim pipe appears to just be cemented into place. I'm purty sure it was a permitted install, but I'd better find that permit.

We didn't have the "Grate Wall" in place this year - removed it for cleaning, never got to putting it back. I've been trying real hard to use only nice dry wood. I got a cheap moisture meter from harbour freight and most of my wood reads 8 to 15 percent (I'm in so. calif, split wood seasons nicely here). I've also been judiciously using a small amount of my fatwood stash for fire starter / fire booster. Sometimes when the fire is going nicely, you can't see the smoke from the chimney. Obviously, other times you can and obviously, creosote was deposited.

The chimney sweep co. is supposed to call me Monday (ish) w/ quotes (one for rebuilding chimney, one for lining chimney to accept stove or insert).

Peace,
- Sequoia
 
One more reply to my own post and I'll let someone else take a turn (I hope).

I'm wondering if I will even be able to "get away with" installing a lining in the existing s/s chimney if the original install does not meet current codes, specifically the lack of the bond beam where the Class A meets the masonry. And by "get away with" I mean both will the bldg. dept. accept it and more importantly, will it be safe? I'm hoping I can just have a 6" liner installed and then have the gap filled with liner insulation. I know we'll need a block off plate, and prolly need to wrap the section of liner that is in the smoke chamber rather than filling the chamber w/ insulation (how would one get insulation in w/ both end blocked anyway?).

The worst of both worlds would prolly be to have to remove the existing chimney and install a proper bond beam and 6 in. Class A chimney for a stove or insert (that still might piss off my wife, cook us right out of the room, or both). At least, it would prolly be the most expensive alternative. Might actually be the best safety wise, except for the pissed off wife.

Peace,
- Sequoia
 
Hmmm . . . several days and no answers . . . bumping to the top so TP will get some answers to his questions.
 
It sounds to me that what you are looking for is a safe way to burn wood for the feel and look of fire vice heat value - Am I correct?

Not at all sure about the local codes, but looking for an insert that is designed to burn with the doors open is where I would look. Most inserts won't cook you out unless you are using the blower, and having open doors will keep things cool by pulling air from the room.

The hard part would be finding an insert that will work well in that configuration.

May be an idea to check out this fireplace site while you are at it : www.rumford.com - good info there on open fireplaces, chimney construction and earthquakes, that being the driver of your local code issues.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.