Splitting the Splits

soupy1957 · Mar 27, 2011

Truth be told, in spite of all the different techniques I've played around with for starting a fire, (top down, bottom up, dryer lint, Super Cedars, Fatwood, newspaper, wood shavings, etc....), I've not really "personally" had much of a difficulty getting a fire going.

Call it a second sense about it, or just plain "years of experience with fires" (outside, and now inside), whatever it is, there is a common sense to getting a fire going, that is made up of a few basic elements.

If nothing else:

A) the right materials
B) start small, build up
C) pay attention to the fire
D) get a proper draft
E) maintain (control) your temps

In the last few weeks, I've noted that the local Lowe's, where I'd buy those $4.00 bags of kindling (yes, I don't swing the axe much anymore), to build up my own preferred way of starting a fire, has not been ordering any more of the pallets of those bags of product.

That, plus the fact that I ran out of the Super Cedars, and the Fatwood I ordered hasn't shown up on my doorstep yet (although I'm expecting it any day now), forced me to go outside with my long-handled axe, and split some splits.

The thing that I noted was, (and of course the splits I'm splitting are aged, dry and ready to fire up), that the 5 sheets of balled up newspaper and a tee-pee style layout of the split splits, has worked out just fine. No special additives, no extra matches, no added paper, .................it just "works."

In the end, it's all about "how" and with "what" of course. I'm just throwing in here a brief commentary about the lack of need of additives to get a fire going, and how that was re-enforced with me lately. I realize I'm preaching to the choir here, since there are so many of you "seasoned" wood burners here, but I figured since I was feeling a bit better lately (thanks for all the prayers gang), I'd give you another blurb to tease me about.

Hope ya'll are having a wonderful "weekend!"

-Soupy1957

crackshot · Mar 27, 2011

I didnt know you were sick, i hope all is well. great post!

Backwoods Savage · Mar 27, 2011

For sure, building a fire doesn't take a whole lot of knowledge or skill. It actually is quite a simple thing. But sometimes even simple things can be improved on and that is why we ended up buying some Super Cedars. Do we need them? No, we got along just fine for many, many moons paleface! But the Super Cedars just make the simple thing even simpler. Another big plus is that now the little wife can start a fire very simply.

For some reason your post made me think of all the times when we've been camping and watching folks try to get a fire going. Some do it quite fast and others struggle while still others never seem to get it. One I recall was a young lady who had 2 kids with her staying in a tent. We were on the shore of Lake Superior late in the month of June. For those unfamiliar with that area of Michigan, one does not go camping there without some heavy clothing no matter the time of year. Well, this time it was pretty chilly (frost at night) and this poor lady just could not seem to get a fire started. I noticed her and told my wife I guessed I'd have to go get her fire started. At about the same time she starts heading our way to ask if I could get her a fire going. I tried to explain a little of it to her but she just didn't seem to be grasping anything. Sure enough, the next day I had to start another fire for her. It would have been nice to have some Super Cedars back then but we didn't have anything like that. Only some matches and what we found in the woods and maybe a little paper but we didn't have much of that so just used what was there. So no, one does not need a whole lot to start a fire, even outdoors. Starting a fire indoors is even easier than outdoors.

raybonz · Mar 27, 2011

I always bring wax paper cups for camping.. We use them to drink from and they make great firestarters too.. Gonna try them in the stove sometime but I can get a fire going pretty easy usually..

Ray

snowleopard · Mar 27, 2011

Hey, Soupy, good to hear that you're on the mend, and hope that your wife is feeling better as well. Been some rocky roads to walk this winter, yes?

I've taken advantage of the warm weekend to get some outside chores done, chief among them cleaning up around the wood storage areas and chopping block, and sorting the burnable-nows from the burn-me-next-years and the toss-me-back-in-the-woods-from-whence-I-cames. Been picking over as I go for a few weeks--no fun--but now I'm set. Yesterday I went out for some kindling, grabbed a tire a-la Mr. Leveraxe, and put 4-5 nice dry straight-grained splits in it. Chop-chop-chop, rotate wood, chop-chop-chop from the opposite angle, had a weeks worth of kindling in a leisurely five minutes work, including putting the tire up and moving the kindling inside.

Ask me if I feel spoiled rotten.

I think that I'll burn selectively the rest of this burning season, setting the good kindling-makers aside, and when fire season is over, I'll fill a few cardboard boxes with kindling chopped and ready to go, and pop them in the garage for next winter.

fishingpol · Mar 27, 2011

Glad you brought this up Soupy, there is still much to be learned here. When I have a pretty large split in the stack, I bring it in and re-split it right of center. The smaller split will be for starting and the rest is now a regular size split. I do this on 3-4 large pieces and I end up with 3-4 smaller splits for top down start, which I am converted to now. It's funny how little things like that make a difference. When you notice these little nuances, you are keen to burning and stove habits, and not just throwing anything in hoping it burns.

oldspark · Mar 27, 2011

Did not know you were felling bad, us oldies have to take care of our selves, so hope you get better.
Now that I have learned the tunnel of love method I hate the tee pee way.

joefrompa · Mar 27, 2011

Feel better Soup.

I used 2 super cedars and 1 firestarter (paraffin style) that came with my stove this winter. None of them worked well, so it's either because all of my wood was questionablly seasoned or I didn't use them right.

So, probably 20-30 times this winter, I went outside with my fiskar's and cut small splits and used chips and little stuff as fine kindling. It was annoying, but mainly because I didn't do it ahead of time. With a good stack of kindling, my fires always started off strong. It was only when I tried to shortchange the kindling that my fires sputtered to life.

begreen · Mar 27, 2011

I try to have an abundance of dry kindling on hand. It makes for a happy wife if nothing else. A great source is any millwork or cabinetry shop. They usually have nice dry scrap by the garbage can load. Cut it up into stove sized bits and you are ready to go. However, I will admit, that when the inside kindling box is empty and it is a cold rain, like this morning, that I do take shortcuts. I started a fire today with 3 largish splits, the dregs at the bottom of the woodbox, and god bless em, a Super Cedar. Took 3 chunks to finally get it going good, but it saved me having to head out in the rain before coffee.

Note to self: Time to reload the kindling box.

Take care Soup. Good to hear you are on the mend.

gyrfalcon · Mar 28, 2011

This periodic kindling discussion is another one that baffles me slightly. With a small stove, I have to start fires from scratch every morning. Since I have no woodlot, I have to purchase my wood c/s/d. Yet I have no kindling problem at all. The delivered wood has vast quantities of small kindling-size "splits," and lots and lots of smaller splitting debris. Because I have such a small stove, I have to further split down a lot of my firewood, so more splitting debris, more small kindling-size pieces that come off the splits I'm working on. (Of course, my aim sucks, so I may have more of those than the rest of ya.)

I long ago lost patience for fussing with newspaper, so I just use a quarter of a Super-Cedar with 3 to 6 small (ie 1 or 2 inch) "splits" to start my fires, or throw some of that nice dry splitting debris onto even a few live coals that are left, and off she goes in short order.

I have superb draft, which helps, but maybe the key is that I'm not trying to fill up the stove to the brim and then light it up? I start small with a few small pieces, then go get my coffee, and when that's going well in 5 or 10 minutes, add some more, let that get engaged, then fill 'er up. Takes maybe half an hour before I can put in a full load, so if I were rushing out the door late to work, it'd drive me nuts. But I work from a home office, so no big deal.

But I do wonder if folks who are having trouble starting fires are maybe trying to start off with too much wood in the stove. Air is the key to fire, and the more stuff you have in the stove, the longer it takes to ignite, no?

agartner · Mar 28, 2011

A few years ago I'm camping with the family, and for the campfire, I did the whole "top-down" thing. My older daughter sees me building up this fire - big logs on the bottom, mediums in the middle, top it off with some kindling and paper, and right on top - one of those sawdust fire starter thingies. This was, mind you, well before I knew the magic of the super cedar. Daughter looked at me like I was absolutely bat-crap crazy - "Dad - that'll never ever light". Said "not only will it light, I'll use one match, walk away, and by the time dinners' done, we'll be ready to roast marshmallows". She didn't believe me at all. Struck the match, lit the fire starter thingy, walked away and we cooked dinner.

And you guessed it - smores for dessert.

SmokeyCity · Mar 28, 2011

yeah, i never understood why people use so much store bought fire starters and such
I just fire up my acetylene torch and hold it against the log end for a bout a minute
It never fails on dry wood

Back to Nature!!

soupy1957 said:
Truth be told, in spite of all the different techniques I've played around with for starting a fire, (top down, bottom up, dryer lint, Super Cedars, Fatwood, newspaper, wood shavings, etc....), I've not really "personally" had much of a difficulty getting a fire going.

Call it a second sense about it, or just plain "years of experience with fires" (outside, and now inside), whatever it is, there is a common sense to getting a fire going, that is made up of a few basic elements.

If nothing else:

A) the right materials
B) start small, build up
C) pay attention to the fire
D) get a proper draft
E) maintain (control) your temps

In the last few weeks, I've noted that the local Lowe's, where I'd buy those $4.00 bags of kindling (yes, I don't swing the axe much anymore), to build up my own preferred way of starting a fire, has not been ordering any more of the pallets of those bags of product.

That, plus the fact that I ran out of the Super Cedars, and the Fatwood I ordered hasn't shown up on my doorstep yet (although I'm expecting it any day now), forced me to go outside with my long-handled axe, and split some splits.

The thing that I noted was, (and of course the splits I'm splitting are aged, dry and ready to fire up), that the 5 sheets of balled up newspaper and a tee-pee style layout of the split splits, has worked out just fine. No special additives, no extra matches, no added paper, .................it just "works."

In the end, it's all about "how" and with "what" of course. I'm just throwing in here a brief commentary about the lack of need of additives to get a fire going, and how that was re-enforced with me lately. I realize I'm preaching to the choir here, since there are so many of you "seasoned" wood burners here, but I figured since I was feeling a bit better lately (thanks for all the prayers gang), I'd give you another blurb to tease me about.

Hope ya'll are having a wonderful "weekend!"

-Soupy1957

KTLM · Mar 28, 2011

Reading the posts and a couple of thoughts. Going outside before morning coffee is a problem in itself. Also, maybe a start to a seperate thread but I'm guessing the average burner does not store their acytelene torch beside the stove. No offense intended Smokey. If you have a source, pallet wood is a fair alternative for starting.

SmokeyCity · Mar 28, 2011

OK well I was just kidding. I assumed everyone would catch that but I suppose it is believable after all.

KTLM said:
Reading the posts and a couple of thoughts. Going outside before morning coffee is a problem in itself. Also, maybe a start to a seperate thread but I'm guessing the average burner does not store their acytelene torch beside the stove. No offense intended Smokey. If you have a source, pallet wood is a fair alternative for starting.

bogydave · Mar 28, 2011

I go camping allot. When someone new want to go, we get to where we'll camp &
I say "I'll get the tents, you get a fire going, matches are in the cook box"
Now you learn quite a bit about someone when you watch them start or try to start a fire
with what ever is around. Add rain, then you know allot about people fire building abilities.
Good Memories.

woodchip · Mar 28, 2011

KTLM said:
Reading the posts and a couple of thoughts. Going outside before morning coffee is a problem in itself. If you have a source, pallet wood is a fair alternative for starting.

When camping I like luxury. My idea of luxury is a thermos of coffee in the tent so I can wake up and have a drink whilst lighting the fire. Nothing worse than waiting for a pot to boil on the fire while what you really want to do is get the bacon and eggs cooking!

I'm lucky in that I work as a volunteer in carriage restoration on our preserved steam railway. I get plenty of offcuts and wood shavings as most wood has to be planed down by hand to match to old dimensions. Add that to pallets and chips from splitting, there never seems to be a shortage of dry kindling wood around. The trick is to have small dry bits, then there is no need for rolled up newspaper or anything. But the important thing is to keep it dry. I often go down the beach for a trip and have some dry kindling with me so if I want a fire, I can just find a few stones, put in some dry kindling and some driftwood, and have a little brew up in no time.

Back to indoors, I have tried the top down, as well as the bottom up.
But strangely, the thing that works quite well for my little stove is front to back.
The airwash tends to encourage the fire to burn front to back.
Which is quite convenient as it's easy to pop a big bit at the back, small stuff in front, and some kindling just near the door.
Bound to be different, being from this side of the pond !!!

!!

savageactor7 · Mar 28, 2011

Having well seasoned splits makes for easy starting fires too.

Loco Gringo · Mar 29, 2011

I learned to start top down this week and Ill never go back. Unless Im using Super Cedars. Boy those things can spoil a man. I also gather up trim pieces from carpenters I know. Dry pine is great for starting my fires.

SmokeyCity · Mar 29, 2011

Loco Gringo said:
I learned to start top down this week and Ill never go back. Unless Im using Super Cedars. Boy those things can spoil a man. I also gather up trim pieces from carpenters I know. Dry pine is great for starting my fires.

what exactly does it mean to start top down ?

you put kindling on top of the wood ?

KTLM · Mar 29, 2011

what exactly does it mean to start top down ?

you put kindling on top of the wood ?

I was ready to ask the same question. Not how I was taught to build a fire but what are the advantages?

fishingpol · Mar 29, 2011

Smokey and KTLM,

Try a search for this. But basically you put the larger splits on the bottom, Super Cedar or newspaper and then kindling over that. Any small kindling is fine on top. It really works, less smoke as the smaller fuel on top is being consumed first. The fire will burn down into the large splits and it is off. I don't know if it is quicker, but the kindling burns quicker and very thoroughly as it is on top and not covered by splits starving for oxygen. I leave the door closed with primary air open. The other thing is you don't have to open the door to add larger splits on top as you would a bottom-up. Build top down and light it and it's good to go. Add a split a while later when things are burning away nicely.

I was skeptical at first, but I am a believer now. Try it and joins the ranks! One thing about this site, it can help change burning behaviors and there are plenty of tips, time and labor savers.

SmokeyCity · Mar 29, 2011

if this works it is GREAT NEW since then we dont have to reopen the door and thus we get zero smoke possilbe

im gonna try my next cold start top down!

fishingpol said:
Smokey and KTLM,

Try a search for this. But basically you put the larger splits on the bottom, Super Cedar or newspaper and then kindling over that. Any small kindling is fine on top. It really works, less smoke as the smaller fuel on top is being consumed first. The fire will burn down into the large splits and it is off. I don't know if it is quicker, but the kindling burns quicker and very thoroughly as it is on top and not covered by splits starving for oxygen. I leave the door closed with primary air open. The other thing is you don't have to open the door to add larger splits on top as you would a bottom-up. Build top down and light it and it's good to go. Add a split a while later when things are burning away nicely.

I was skeptical at first, but I am a believer now. Try it and joins the ranks! One thing about this site, it can help change burning behaviors and there are plenty of tips, time and labor savers.

Wood Duck · Mar 29, 2011

SmokeyCity said:
if this works it is GREAT NEW since then we dont have to reopen the door and thus we get zero smoke possilbe

im gonna try my next cold start top down!

Yeah, the big advantage of top-down starting for me is that I can load up a fairly large load of wood, start the fire, and not open the door for couple of hours. That way I avoid the hassle of starting a small pile of kindling then trying to open the door and load more wood on top of the burning kindling without smoke getting into the room. With my stove, smoke gets into the room if I open the door before the wood is all coals.

joefrompa · Mar 29, 2011

Couple of hours!?!?! Man, once I start (using my bottom up method), here's my door opening:

1. Re-open at 5-10 minute mark to add larger splits on top.

2. Re-open at 30 minute mark to stuff firebox full (now that its good and hot)

3. Re-open at 90 minutes to re-stuff firebox full now that the stove top is at 500-600 (now I turn the air way down)

4. Re-open at hour 4 cause #3 is pretty much gone and I want to push the stove

rhetta · Mar 29, 2011

We used to go canoe/camping in the b.w.c.a. Pack light portage gear often , always went in late September.. fewer people..no bugs..but cold weather. My better half could always get a fire going first try even in the rain..and up there a fire is your heat and cooking source. He always carried birch bark and small pine splits in the bottom of a duluth pack for those wet times and it was like magic some times I thought he could be faster..but he 'd just say rather get it goin' the first time than start over. Now he spends alittle time each spring splitting popple into small splits and then intermingles them with his wood supply...I just shake my head but he says why spend extra cash on fire starter when its not really needed. Little does he know I've got a stash of fat wood hidden by the vacuum 'cause he's not goin' there.

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