Splitting question

Country Gentleman said:

I would greatly appreciate your opinions on the following situation.

In December 2010 I realised that my supply was not going to last what was turned out to be a very cold and long winter therefore I ordered an additional two cords from my wood supplier at $160 per cord. Whilst he was there I asked him to give me an idea as to how much it would cost to cut and split a large oak that had fallen two months before and if it was financially worthwhile to do so for firewood. He explained how he would reverse his splitter right next to the tree. As I paid him for the delivered wood, he wrote out a quote for $170 for the fallen oak. He estimated it's yield to be approximately two cords. Although I would need to wheelbarrow the wood up a steep slope out of the woods and accross my property to the wood stack, I decided that this was worth doing to be able to use wood off our property and also considering the cost vs the amount of firewood. I had planned on paying him $250 for the work.

This past Saturday two of his men arrived to begin cutting and splitting. I told them about the quote and asked if this still sounded about right, they concurred and began work. On Monday we received a telephone call stating that his men had worked 10 hours and that the bill was $600 for the cutting and splitting of a tree that produced about two and a half cords. I pointed out that, had I known how much would be charged, I would never had agreed to having the tree cut and split because I could have had more than three and a half cords delivered at that price right beside my wood stack. I offered to pay the same cost that the wood would have cost had ot been delivered and dumped beside my wood stack however he then pointed out that the $170 was just for cutting the tree and he believed the yield to be SIX! cords from this large oak and if I was reluctant to pay that much he would come onto my property to remove the wood whilst still charging $170 for the cutting. My best estimate is that there is 2.5 to 3 cords.

I'm trying to decide what to do in fairness to all parties. Any thoughts?

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What does the estimate say on it? I maybe even open a small claims court on him asap! let the judge decide, doesnt sould like a deal that you made!

Country Gentleman said:

$170. It seems that he didn't estimate the cost of splitting.

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I would do only what was agreed.....If an extra 425.00 bill came my way that came out of left field, I would tell it to the judge......He would make it fair. If you really feel he made an honest mistake Pay the man!

A 2.5-3 cord tree is big. 6 cord is a HUGE tree. Historical trees in old towns that turn my head are 6 cord trees.
$170 for cutting up a 2.5 cord tree is a lot of money. If he can CSD a cord for $160, then I would think $170 is in line for the work quoted.

Adios Pantalones said:

A 2.5-3 cord tree is big. 6 cord is a HUGE tree. Historical trees in old towns that turn my head are 6 cord trees.
$170 for cutting up a 2.5 cord tree is a lot of money. If he can CSD a cord for $160, then I would think $170 is in line for the work quoted.

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I agree. CS was done on site and D was not necessary (mobilizing field crew and splitter was). Did it really take 10 hours? Did they remove/chip the brush, too? Something doesn't sound right.

Country Gentleman said:

PeteD said:

Adios Pantalones said:

A 2.5-3 cord tree is big. 6 cord is a HUGE tree. Historical trees in old towns that turn my head are 6 cord trees.
$170 for cutting up a 2.5 cord tree is a lot of money. If he can CSD a cord for $160, then I would think $170 is in line for the work quoted.

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I agree. CS was done on site and D was not necessary (mobilizing field crew and splitter was). Did it really take 10 hours? Did they remove/chip the brush, too? Something doesn't sound right.

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Thanks for the reply. They did not remove or chip the brush and he stated that he charges $60 per hour for splitting AFTER the work was done. I would estimate 8 hours at the very most.

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Honstly if hes stuck 600 I would let a judge hear it....Just saying anyone showing a 175.00 est. and then wanting 600.00 just out of the question. I can see someone being off 20 percent other than that I need someone smarter than Him or I to make a fair call........425.00 isnt fair at all.

You said he wrote out an estimate before the work began...did the estimate say "cut and split oak tree?"

As far as wheelbarrowing, I have a tow strap and hook the two ends to the axle, forming a long loop. Then someone can wrap the loop around their chest and walk up the hill, while I push and guide the wheelbarrow.

Am I understanding this right, he charged more because the tree was bigger?

couple things
1) if you have a written estimate, hes out of luck and tell him you'll have him arrested if he sets foot on your property, set up a game camera.
2) if you dont have a written estimate, tell him that you decided to have the court decide, usually in small claims like this they'll have the two parties sit down with a mediator.

Pay him the 170...that's what was agreed. If he persists advise him that the remaining will only be payed if ordered by a court.

Regardless, file a claim with the BBB.

Maybe the splitter doesn't know what a true cord is (128 cu ft) and you are getting charged for 6 face cords?

lukem said:

Pay him the 170...that's what was agreed. If he persists advise him that the remaining will only be payed if ordered by a court.

Regardless, file a claim with the BBB.

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BBB Is a great point and a complaint to attorney General......Can be done on there web site. They seem to be pretty good to make it a very quick! As long as your right!

My bet is once you say your going to get the court involved, he'll decide trying to rip you off isnt worth the hassle and take the 170 and split (no pun intended, well sorta). what ever you decide to do, Ill look for a new wood dealer.

I believe you when you say he quoted you $170 but if you think about, that's a heck of a lot of work for $170!! Cutting up a huge tree, bucking it. That alone would be worth more than $170. And then to split it all, even if it is three cords and not six. That's a ton of labor, and gasoline, and wear and tear on his equipment. And the tree is worth nothing until it is bucked up and split.
I think he screwed up, honestly, on his bid. An honorable man would stand by his bid and charge you only the $170 he quoted.
An equally honorable man might realize that a mistake has been made and strive to meet somewhere in the middle.

Kenster said:

I believe you when you say he quoted you $170 but if you think about, that's a heck of a lot of work for $170!! Cutting up a huge tree, bucking it. That alone would be worth more than $170. And then to split it all, even if it is three cords and not six. That's a ton of labor, and gasoline, and wear and tear on his equipment. And the tree is worth nothing until it is bucked up and split.
I think he screwed up, honestly, on his bid. An honorable man would stand by his bid and charge you only the $170 he quoted.
An equally honorable man might realize that a mistake has been made and strive to meet somewhere in the middle.

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Thats what it sounds like but it takes two to compromise, Id talk it out with the guy and ask him if its higher because there was more wood than he thought, then try to reason with him and meet somewhere in the middle, depends what kind of person he is, Ive tried that before with contractors and some wont admit they made a mistake so you have to play hardball.

Country Gentleman said:

$170. It seems that he didn't estimate the cost of splitting.

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Do you have a written estimate? If not, cut him a check for $170 and tell him to blow it out his @$$. In fact, do that anyway.

If he did indeed under-estimate the job, as much as it may hurt, he should stand behind the estimate. If he is someone you deal with regularly, and a decent guy, you can always find a compromise, but to come to you after the fact and triple the price is really shady. Sorry it took longer than you expected dude but you quoted me this price. He should have done a much better job estimating or gave you a time and materials estimate.

This is not how anyone I know does buisness. Imagine if you were to have a roof done, or some plumbing work done, or something like that, and after the fact you are given a bill for triple the written estimate

You can always tell them to blow it out their ass as well. Here is your estimate, here is the aggreed upon price, buh-bye. If he wants to persue it, he can take you to small claims court, doubtfull he would persue, and if he does you have the written estimate.

Shawn

What does the written quote specifically say? Does it say cut AND split? Does it mention how many cords? Did he actually look at the tree in question?
Again, is there is room for an honest misunderstanding? If not, I agree with the others that say to write him a check for $170. And get the wood up to your house as soon as possible. I doubt anyone is going to take your wood from your house and risk going to jail for it.

In your original post you wrote that your wood supplier mentioned he could 'reverse his splitter right up to the tree' or something to that effect. That indicates he was including splitting in the work he quoted. Pay him $170.

Country Gentleman said:

I would greatly appreciate your opinions on the following situation.

In December 2010 I realised that my supply was not going to last what was turned out to be a very cold and long winter therefore I ordered an additional two cords from my wood supplier at $160 per cord. Whilst he was there I asked him to give me an idea as to how much it would cost to cut and split a large oak that had fallen two months before and if it was financially worthwhile to do so for firewood. He explained how he would reverse his splitter right next to the tree. As I paid him for the delivered wood, he wrote out a quote for $170 for the fallen oak. He estimated it's yield to be approximately two cords. Although I would need to wheelbarrow the wood up a steep slope out of the woods and accross my property to the wood stack, I decided that this was worth doing to be able to use wood off our property and also considering the cost vs the amount of firewood. I had planned on paying him $250 for the work.

This past Saturday two of his men arrived to begin cutting and splitting. I told them about the quote and asked if this still sounded about right, they concurred and began work. On Monday we received a telephone call stating that his men had worked 10 hours and that the bill was $600 for the cutting and splitting of a tree that produced about two and a half cords. I pointed out that, had I known how much would be charged, I would never had agreed to having the tree cut and split because I could have had more than three and a half cords delivered at that price right beside my wood stack. I offered to pay the same cost that the wood would have cost had ot been delivered and dumped beside my wood stack however he then pointed out that the $170 was just for cutting the tree and he believed the yield to be SIX! cords from this large oak and if I was reluctant to pay that much he would come onto my property to remove the wood whilst still charging $170 for the cutting. My best estimate is that there is 2.5 to 3 cords.

I'm trying to decide what to do in fairness to all parties. Any thoughts?

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First, a warm welcome to the forum Country Gentleman.


A couple points stand out to me. First, it was an estimate; not a final price. Still, the final price was way too high compared with the estimate. Also, he did know about the splitting as he stated that at the start.

Another point is that it took 2 men 10 hours to cut up this tree and split it. Now I certainly am not the man I used to be, age an some body problems slows me down a whole lot. But 10 hours for that amount of wood seems a bit too much to me. If it were 3 cord then it means 1.5 cord per man and I highly doubt those men would have taken than long as no doubt they were experienced and also had the tools to do the job the easiest.

At $160 per cord cut, split and delivered, that amounts to $480! So how is it that this wood doesn't even have to be delivered but yet it cost $120 more!!


As stated by others, you can take this to court or you can just tell the man to kiss off. Because of the difference in cost, that is, you are being charged more for this wood and the other guy doesn't even have delivery costs involved.....I'd simply tell him he is way off base and pay the $170 or at most $200. Which means you can compromise a bit. After all, it was an estimate and maybe you would have given the guy a tip for doing the job. You have to decide there.



Now for one huge point. He stated that he would come to your property and remove the wood! I do hope both of you realize this would be illegal I would definitely notify him of this fact and also notify him that you would sue if he did come onto your property without your permission. I'm not a person to like sue suits but in this case I would without further thought. I would even go as far as to notify the authorities in your area (maybe county sheriff) about his threat. That way if this does go into the legal battle you have another feather in your hat by notifying them ahead of time.

The game camera or better yet, 2 or 3 game cameras (in case one is spotted and stolen on the spot) to get pictures of anyone getting the wood. It would also be best to set the camera on video mode to get video rather than still shots.


If it were me, I'd call the man and play a little hardball stating that he made a threat to you that would be an illegal act. I'd also state that he would be charging more for the wood than he would have had he delivered the wood. If you want to really compromise, you could offer an extra $100 but I would not go any higher than that but would also tell him that would be just to keep this out of the courts and not an admittance that the work was worth that much. After all, it should be an easy matter to get someone else to cut that tree down and still leave you 1/3 of the wood, or one cord. If you would have done this, you would have had a cord of wood with no money changing hands and both parties would have been happy.

We wish you well as this can be a tough situation to deal with.