The price of procrastination

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SolarAndWood

SolarAndWood

Minister of Fire
Feb 3, 2008
6,788
Syracuse NY
Can't put this totally on Irene, but I can't believe what a difference a few weeks makes with splitting. I had a dozen large, 36", black oak rounds that I hadn't split before Irene showed up. Few other distractions and didn't get to them until today. The splitter blew through them when they were fresh, I had to cut a groove with the saw and break out the sledge and wedges today. The tall fat wedge on the splitter is usually an asset as it usually takes less than an inch of travel to blow the split up. Today it was a liability.
 

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Thanks for posting. I did not know that delaying would lead to more difficult work. I have a large Maple in the backyard that I wanted to call a tree service to cut into rounds and split myself. Now I know to do it when I have the time. How long do you have with hardwoods to split after its down before it gets tough?
 
SolarAndWood said:
The splitter blew through them when they were fresh, I had to cut a groove with the saw and break out the sledge and wedges today.
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Thanks for the bad news. :lol: I've got some Black that's been sitting a couple of months. I just split the rounds down far enough so that I could lift them into the trailer. The wood was standing dead though, so I don't know if it already would have been tough, even splitting it immediately. It sounds like you are talking about green wood...

Uncle said:
I did not know that delaying would lead to more difficult work.
Click to expand...
Not sure, but I think it would vary among different species; Some might be easier to split when they're dry...
 
Uncle said:
How long do you have with hardwoods to split after its down before it gets tough?
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Initially, I split them within a few days of the trees being dropped and bucked. 3-4 weeks later the splitter had nothing, the maul bounced and the wedges bounced until I cut a 6 inch groove in the round. I haven't experienced this before and I've let stuff sit months.
 
Woody Stover said:
Thanks for the bad news. :lol:
Click to expand...

If it helps, the splitter had no problem with them after I halved the rounds.
 
You have found out what I learned a long time ago, really sucks when you are hand splitting, just a short period of time and the wood becomes harder to split then when it gets dryer it splits better again.
 
Woody Stover said:
SolarAndWood said:
The splitter blew through them when they were fresh, I had to cut a groove with the saw and break out the sledge and wedges today.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the bad news. :lol: I've got some Black that's been sitting a couple of months. I just split the rounds down far enough so that I could lift them into the trailer. The wood was standing dead though, so I don't know if it already would have been tough, even splitting it immediately. It sounds like you are talking about green wood...

Uncle said:
I did not know that delaying would lead to more difficult work.
Click to expand...
Not sure, but I think it would vary among different species; Some might be easier to split when they're dry...
Click to expand...

i don't even THINK of splitting hickory when its green. red oak on the other hand is a dream.
 
SolarAndWood said:
Can't put this totally on Irene, but I can't believe what a difference a few weeks makes with splitting. I had a dozen large, 36", black oak rounds that I hadn't split before Irene showed up. Few other distractions and didn't get to them until today. The splitter blew through them when they were fresh, I had to cut a groove with the saw and break out the sledge and wedges today. The tall fat wedge on the splitter is usually an asset as it usually takes less than an inch of travel to blow the split up. Today it was a liability.
Click to expand...

It would be nice if you had interchangable wedges.

Narrow and sharp for those logs

Wide to pop fast

Multi for soft wood.
 
Dune said:
It would be nice if you had interchangable wedges.

Narrow and sharp for those logs

Wide to pop fast

Multi for soft wood.
Click to expand...

All of the above are on the upgrade list. Haven't decided if those upgrades are going to happen on this beam/4.5" cylinder setup or if I am going to step up to 6" and a big pump. It is already heavy enough that it gets moved around with the tractor, so no real downside in going bigger. My guess is the 4.5 cylinder would have had no problem with those rounds with a skinny wedge as my overweight out of shape self was able to do it with sledge and wedges.
 
I do most of my splitting when my rounds are frozen, so they split well. This year I had some health issues and did not finish until late spring. the rounds were some kind of elm and the old splitter just chewed through them! I feel your pain.
 
I think it does matter on the splitting if the wood is cut during the warm months. We cut during the cold months and just stack it up and wait until snow melt to start the splitting. It works for us and the splitting goes just fine.
 
I've found that whether dead or green,freshly cut or sat 6 months normal straight grained knot free Red/Black Oak splits about equally easy.Dont try that with dead White Oak rounds that sat from December to May like I did though.What normally the X25 or double bit axe blows through,it either bounced off or got stuck.Have to break out the big maul for most all White Oak,even the clear knot free stuff.Much more stringy,Hickory is easier for me than that.
 
I got most of the stuff of any consequence knocked down and some stacked before I ran out of motivation. Not sure what the deal is, but much harder splitting than fresh cut.
 

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SolarAndWood said:
Dune said:
It would be nice if you had interchangable wedges.

Narrow and sharp for those logs

Wide to pop fast

Multi for soft wood.
Click to expand...

All of the above are on the upgrade list. Haven't decided if those upgrades are going to happen on this beam/4.5" cylinder setup or if I am going to step up to 6" and a big pump. It is already heavy enough that it gets moved around with the tractor, so no real downside in going bigger. My guess is the 4.5 cylinder would have had no problem with those rounds with a skinny wedge as my overweight out of shape self was able to do it with sledge and wedges.
Click to expand...

My I & O 26 ton has a 4.5" cylinder and with the compond angle wedges they use, it routinely splits oak rounds over 24" that have been sitting in the "to do" pile for over a year. Wedge angle is very narrow (and sharp!) until about 2-3" back and then it fans out to "pop" the round.

6" cylinder! Yowza, that would have to be a big pump indeed to keep the cycle time reasonable!
 
It is definitely the shape of the wedge that is the issue, not the cylinder. They got about an inch into the wedge before it stalled and I could see the beam flex. I had the same problem with the sledge and wedge approach and had to noodle down a few inches. The beam is 8" with 3/8" flanges and seems about right for the cylinder.

I'm curious, with the I&O, if you go back 3", how wide is the wedge before and after the flare? How wide is the flare at maximum and how far back from the start of it?

A 6" cylinder and the pump, motor, frame, cord and tank would be an expensive project. I think a fraction of that money is much better spent improving this one. The 6" largely came from the desire to use something like Timberwolf's box wedge concept but on a bigger scale.
 
Solar - those are some large splits! Oak too - could take a decade to season!
 
Got Wood said:
Solar - those are some large splits! Oak too - could take a decade to season!
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Stacking them was like stacking bags of concrete :coolmad:
 

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SolarAndWood said:
Got Wood said:
Solar - those are some large splits! Oak too - could take a decade to season!
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Stacking them was like stacking bags of concrete :coolmad:
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That is one good reason to suspect it will burn fantastically! Enjoy it Solar. Heck, your body probably needs the good workout anyway. Grab a good beverage and have at it!
 
Backwoods Savage said:
Heck, your body probably needs the good workout anyway.
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lol I'm off to work to recover.
 
SolarAndWood said:
I got most of the stuff of any consequence knocked down and some stacked before I ran out of motivation. Not sure what the deal is, but much harder splitting than fresh cut.
Click to expand...

That is some nice looking firewood Solar, the splitter was just telling you it's time for a break!


zap
 
Hmm. I've never had oak get harder to split after sitting. Elm maybe, but not oak. I have some rounds that have been sitting all summer and they are popping pretty good.

I think you could make/buy a lot better wedge with some gradual flaring. Mine starts out sharp, then flares out after 3 or 4 inches and works fantastic.
 
I have found that this wedge design to work well in most cases. For the first ~2.5" it is a mild angle, similar to the angle you would find on an axe head, then it starts the aggressive angle after that.

Sorry for the crappy pic, but its the best I have to show the wedge:
 

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I am inclined to do something like that. My wedge is probably close to your max width before yours even starts the aggressive angle.

Incidentally, I was curious about how much of an under exaggeration you were suggesting on the weight of those big rounds after I nearly rolled the tractor yesterday. If my 1 cubic foot split is representative at 58 pounds, you are grossly under exaggerating as the round it came out of was 12 cu ft ;-)
 
SolarAndWood said:
If my 1 cubic foot split is representative at 58 pounds, you are grossly under exaggerating as the round it came out of was 12 cu ft ;-)
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Anybody that has fought them, knows. If they don't know, I don't want to discourage them. :lol:

I have a few "quarters" that I noodled for a specific reason that probably go over 200#.
 

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