Quadra Fire Santa Fe - multiple problems after sitting for the summer - one "snap disk bad," maybe a

Hi, I've looked through the manual and the pinned advice here, and am making some progress. The blower wasn't running because "snap disk #1" failed while sitting unused for the summer. I confirmed that by putting a jumper wire in place of the disk. Okay the blower runs. But the augur still doesn't turn. I've checked the vacuum line, and tried putting a jumper in place of the vacuum switch, and the hose seems fine, the switch makes a nice click when blown into, and the jumper makes no difference to the augur.

The manual suggests that it's possible snap disk #2 is defective. (These things just like to go bad while the stove's on vacation?) Unfortunately it doesn't describe where snap disk #2 lives. The service parts flyer just shows it floating in free space - obviously it's from somewhere down in the middle of things, but there's no indication of just where. From this parts catalog it looks like it's a "high limit" fuse. Where's that likely to be put? On the exhaust? Anyone know just where to find it?

The other thing the manual says to suspect is the control box. Hopefully it's not that, as those are spendy.

There must be other possible causes for the augur not turning. It's not obviously jammed - removed all the pellets on top and put some back in to no effect after checking that. The exhaust pipe is freshly cleaned out.

Annoying that more than one thing has gone bad while the stove sat idle. Was working without a hitch into last spring. It's been through a couple of winters now.

Nice to learn it has a reset button on it. Now ... to find it. Could that be behind the plate on the right side that snap disk #1 is on? Guess it might have to be.

It's the convection blower that's not going unless I jump snap disk #1. Is that a blower that isn't on until it warms up anyway? Maybe that disk's not bad then. "Snap disk" is a new term to me. I was thinking it was a sort of fuse.

Thanks for the quick advice.

Ah "disc." I'd tried to search the manual for "disk." Quadra-Fire spells it both ways. "Disk" is usually the American spelling, "disc" the English one, and "compact disc" has the English spelling since Phillips in the Netherlands prefers English English.

Manual says if I replace the thing I need to replace a gasket. Now, if it does have a reset button in this model, does getting that far also require a new gasket?

Maybe I should understand the theory. If the combustion blower is running, which it is, does that mean snap disc #2 is okay? Is that disc to turn off the combustion blower?

If that's the case, what should I be looking at?

tjnamtiw said:

Alright, I'm confused for sure now that I see your other posts and reread your initial post! You initially said that the 'blower' wasn't running until you jumped snap disk #1. That snap disk directly controls the 'CONVECTION BLOWER' that blows hot air through the tubes and into your room. There's 110 volts to it waiting to get to the blower when the snap disk #1 gets hot enough.

Click to expand...

Okay, I was simply confused on that one. My stove sits back in a corner, and since I can hardly start the thing without having it connected to the stove pipe, and never poked around in the wiring and motors before, there's a learning curve here, and limited visibility. Apologies.

Then you say that the auger isn't turning so one imagines that you have no fire in the pot to get the stove hot. So I'm confused why you are worrying about the convection blower not running when you have no fire.

Click to expand...

Because Quadra-Fire wasn't good enough to write a section of the manual explaining what each of the parts do, and how they inter-relate. It's obviously a pretty simple device. But I'm still working out the sense of it. Is there a theory section on this board I've overlooked?

Snap disk #2 like Smokey said is there as a safety in case things get too hot. If you look behind the slanted tube that the pellets slide down, you will see the snap disk with the colored wires that I told you about. There's a third disk back there, #3 that is an ultimate safety in case the fire gets into the auger tube and is heading to the hopper. It is mounted on the auger tube.

Click to expand...

Okay, to get behind the slanted tube it looks like I need to pull the whole back off, now that I've found the section under "disc" in the manual. And it looks like I'm supposed to have a combustion blower replacement gasket at the ready? Least that's what it says.

What symptoms are you trying to troubleshoot???

Click to expand...

Aside from my symtomatic ignorance, the presenting problem is the augur isn't delivering any pellets. I've removed all pellets from the bin, vacuumed both ends with a strong vac, put some pellets back in, and still no delivery. The control box blue light will blink six blinks in a couple of sequences, whatever that means. Probably normal? Signals it's "calling"? But no pellets. Pressure switch seems to check out, and shorting it doesn't fix it, so can rule that out for now.

Now, if snap disk #2 has a couple of wires, are those coming from someplace more accessible where I can jump them and see if that restores service? Also, is this a snap disk with a reset button on it, or is the only course if it is the culprit a replacement?

Thanks again for the help.

j-takeman said:

Make sure the auger is OK. Unplug the stove and get an old lamp cord(if this has a 120v motor) and supply power to the auger motor. Or you could use a meter to see if power is supplied on start up.

Click to expand...

Okay. Need to figure out how to get to the augur motor, and if I can get there while the unit's still attached to the stove pipe. I take it the motor won't power unless there are pellets in the hopper, so disconnected from the stove pipe, to power it, guess I'd need to divert the pellets from the burn cup or disconnect the igniter?

Did you leave it plugged in all summer?

Click to expand...

No. Could that make a difference one way or the other?

Bkins said:

On my quad Mt Vernon when the stove and pellet feed has been cleaned it often takes 4-5 pushes on the reset botton before pellets are primed in the augar system. You should be able to hear or see if the augar is running shortly after pushing the rest button.

Click to expand...

Tried that, many times. The augur's not running. Not a bit.

Even though its a PIA your going to have to get the covers off and see what is working or not. I know your trying hard but its sounds like your hesitant to really dig in.

Click to expand...

Hesitant to take stuff apart to the degree that I need to order a new gasket to put it back together. Also, want to go in one step at a time since if that's where the fix is, no point going farther

Just about everything in the stove has a way to be checked out as to whether its working or not. The control box is the one item that can be hard to pin point.? When your thermostat calls for heat and the stove turns on what exactly happens?

Click to expand...

The exhaust/combustion blower starts. The control box blinks 6 times blue, pauses, blinks 6 times blue again. Not much else. When I put my hand on the augur motor I don't feel any action there.

Have you poked a tooth pick into the connection for the rubber hose on the augar tube? Do this carefully and make sure you don't break the tooth pick. Also take off the rubber hose between the vac switch and the augar tube and make sure it has no fines or blockages in it. This is a somewhat common place to have trouble because of the fines in the pellets.

Click to expand...

Didn't poke with a toothpick. But checked the tube. And as I understand it when I shorted around the pressure switch without improving things, that's proof that the pressure line and switch can't be the problem.

We have seen some leave them connected. Power spikes from electric storms can kill components pretty easy. Even with surge suppressors installed. Safe bet to just unplug them.

Click to expand...

The computer-grade UPS it was plugged into was turned off for the summer.

You only need to see if it turns with power for a few seconds. Use the power strip with a switch to turn it right off. If it just sits there and hums. You have you problem solved. If it turns on its own, Reconnect every thing and re-fire it. Sometimes they may get stuck from sitting. I don't think you need to disconnect anything just a short second or 2 of on time to see if it spins shouldn't dump that much fuel. If you hot wire the auger, That's all that going to get power, Leave the stove unplugged while doing that!

Or connect a meter and see if it getting power from the controller. No power something else is bad, Power and you have a stuck/dead auger motor.

Click to expand...

Putting my hand on the augur motor, I don't feeling it trying to do anything. Unfortunately there are 4 lines going to it, connected by a wiring harness plug with something looking like a capacitor across two of the lines. I'm not sure which to juice or measure - or if it's 120 V at that point.

If the augur motor is stuck, should it at least give a strain against the stuckness? Or does the total lack of any action there indicate either its burned out, or the controller isn't feeding it - in which case guess I'm back to figuring out if it's safe to connect 120 to it, and by which of the four wires connected at the wiring harness plug. I guess the other thing would be to pull the motor off and see if I can power it on the bench. Maybe it becomes more obvious where to apply the power then.

futureboiler said:

did you pull the control board out and reset it? make sure its unplugged.

Click to expand...

There's a reset for the control board aside from the reset button available on the back in normal use? Please tell me more.

Bkins said:

Were you able to find the resetable snap disc and if so did it reset? What are you trying to take apart that might need a gasket?

Click to expand...

No. According to page 36 of the Santa Fe manual, to get in far enough to replace snap disk #2 requires replacing the combustion blower gasket. And a lot of disassembly to get that far. I'm suspecting if it does have a reset button on it that requires getting that far in to it too.

If your just trying to test a motor you don't need to take it out of the stove. Just make a lamp cord extention cord and hook the 2 wires up and plug it in.

Click to expand...

Makes sense. If I can be sure it's a 120 V motor and figure out which of the four wires the hot and neutral should connect to. Okay, the neutral should go to the two white wires. Still, that leaves two more, and that odd capacitor across the plug.

Was this stove left plugged in over the time it was not in use? Does your owners manual tell you what the 6 blue blinks indicate on the control box?

Click to expand...

It was plugged into a computer-grade UPS that was turned off. The 6 blue blinks according to the manual mean that it's been turned on. Doesn't say more than that.

Looks like I need to figure out how to juice the motor, and if the motor does work, it's most likely the control board?

SmokeyTheBear said:

Remember some of the quads have auger motors that have funny habits like running backwards and switching directions. That capacitor appears to be the hallmark of such things. Make certain your manuals are for the correct stove.

What two wires can screw up pales compared to 4 plus an additional device. What ever happened to KISS?

Click to expand...

Okay, the augur motor works. Putting live current on the white and black pins of the unplugged line starts it. (And also is a significant shock-or-short danger, but I got away with it.)

Does that pretty much mean I'm looking at a control box gone bad, or is there still a possibility that it's snap disc #2 or something else?

Looking more closely, the incoming plug just has three lines - two white on the same plug pin and the black. Then the plug on the motor side has to capacitor over to a red line from the black, possibly to give it an extra jolt to start? No matter. It can start. So the question is why it's not being asked to.