Recourse for pellets that won't burn?

LRRifleman · Nov 4, 2011

Hello!

This post is not intended to give you your daily obligatory laugh, nor is it intended as comic relief ... there is a thread of logic behind it.

Background: This past summer, I had the opportunity to purchase (via lay-away) multiple tons of pellets at a good discount ($4.29 a bag) at Tractor Supply. Having purchased Lignetics there last year, it was reasonable to presume Lignetics would be provided this year. Low and behold, when I paid off the lay-away last weekend and picked up the pellets, the pellets that were available were "Nation's Choice", which from earlier posts were comparable to Inferno and Stove Chow. Not knowing any better at the time, the pallets were broken down and the pellets stored in my shed.

Current experience: I have burned (or tried to burn) 2 or 3 bags of Nation's CHoice so far this week. The pellets are burning (not a vigorous flame, but burning) at night when I go to bed. When I wake in the morning, the stove is out ... due to either "clay-like" chunks of pellets clogging the auger, or failure of the pellets to "slide" down the tapered feed bin of my stove. I have tried changing the damper setting, air mixture, and auger feed trim to improve the flame, but without any appreciable level of success.

Available recourse?: I know that when you buy something that is broken, you can typically return it. When you buy a new car that will not run and lives in the shop, you can gain relief under the lemon law. What recourse do we have when we buy pellets that just won't burn? I know the easiest avenue is not to purchase them again, but what about the money expended for the current fuel? Or are pellets a product where the merchant or manufacturer can walk to the bank once they get your money because they do not have to stand behind/by their product?

Thanks!

jdempsey · Nov 4, 2011

I would talk to the manager at TSC. Explain your situation.

I would hope that they would work something out.

jtakeman · Nov 4, 2011

If all else fails? Mix them with something that does burn. Usually gets you through the junk brands we see people get stuck with.

Sure hope the TSC takes care of the issue!

kofkorn · Nov 4, 2011

Definitely try to return or exchange them. It's not unusual for someone to do that with a reasonably stand-up retailer. If that doesn't work, come back here and we can help you make the best of what you've got left.

I bought a ton of Nation's Choice at the end of last year and I'm still burning off the last few bags. They are by far the worst I've burned so far. I believe some investigation on this forum found that they are made by the same mill that makes Inferno's, which are usually regarded as one of the worst pellets available. To help with the Clay-like chunks, see what you can do to increase the air flow to the burn pot. I actually fashioned a little diverter out of aluminum flashing which directs more of the burn air through the pellets instead of over them. I don't know the settings on you stove, but anything you can do to increase the air flow to the pellets should help reduce the clinkers.

Stove Chow, on the other hand, is regarded as an upper mid level pellet that many people have been very happy with. I bought three tons of Stove Chow for use this winter.

Good luck. We're here to help.

DexterDay · Nov 4, 2011

Had a problem with AWF's last year. Couple emails and a phone call and I had a portion of my money back (via gift card) worth a shot to contact the company and express your concerns. Might get something out of it. Might not..... Either way. Only takes a minute.

Oh and pics of the burn pot and ash accumulation will go a long way.

LRRifleman · Nov 6, 2011

UPDATE: I stopped by Tractor Supply last night to share my dilemma and see what options they would provide ... I was totally surprised by their response! Apparently, they are having MASSIVE problems woth the "Nation's Choice" pellets they have sold to date. They were not surprised about my story. They are currently in the situation where they are breaking down pallets to discover the good bags of pellets for their customers. I was told, they want to make me happy, and all I need to tell them is how many bags of pellets are bad ... I am uncomfortable saying 100 bags of the 2 tons I bought are bad, especially since they are offering to replace the bags, without return! They are awaiting delivery of replacement pellets. This is in South Jersey ... it was also stated by the representative from TSC, that it looks like there is an impending shortage of pellets developing for this area!

jtakeman · Nov 6, 2011

LRRifleman said:
it was also stated by the representative from TSC, that it looks like there is an impending shortage of pellets developing for this area!

We are seeing the stacks dwindle here as well. By Spring things could be dicey!

SmokeyTheBear · Nov 6, 2011

j-takeman said:
LRRifleman said:

it was also stated by the representative from TSC, that it looks like there is an impending shortage of pellets developing for this area!

Click to expand...

We are seeing the stacks dwindle here as well. By Spring things could be dicey!

Plenty of pellets up this way.

They may not always be your favorite pellets but there are plenty.

PJPellet · Nov 6, 2011

SmokeyTheBear said:
j-takeman said:

LRRifleman said:

it was also stated by the representative from TSC, that it looks like there is an impending shortage of pellets developing for this area!

Click to expand...

We are seeing the stacks dwindle here as well. By Spring things could be dicey!

Click to expand...

Plenty of pellets up this way.

They may not always be your favorite pellets but there are plenty.

Same Here. I was at Lowe's yesterday and they have many tons, as well as Wally-world. TSC same thing. Local pellet shops doin' well on deliveries too.

LRRifleman · Nov 6, 2011

@ Smokey ...

If I may ask, what brands are typically available up your way, and how much do they run a ton?
With the crap and rices they are charging for the crap here, I may take the car trailer and a weekened and run up to visit friends and pick up a ton or two!

Freddels · Nov 6, 2011

LRRifleman said:
UPDATE: I stopped by Tractor Supply last night to share my dilemma and see what options they would provide ... I was totally surprised by their response! Apparently, they are having MASSIVE problems woth the "Nation's Choice" pellets they have sold to date. They were not surprised about my story. They are currently in the situation where they are breaking down pallets to discover the good bags of pellets for their customers. I was told, they want to make me happy, and all I need to tell them is how many bags of pellets are bad ... I am uncomfortable saying 100 bags of the 2 tons I bought are bad, especially since they are offering to replace the bags, without return! They are awaiting delivery of replacement pellets. This is in South Jersey ... it was also stated by the representative from TSC, that it looks like there is an impending shortage of pellets developing for this area!

How will you know how many are bad without opening the bag and trying to burn them? Are they replacing "bad" bags of Nation's Choice with just different bags of the same brand?
Honestly, I'd want the whole load replaced with something better.

Tractor Supply needs to address this with their supplier for any and all defects.

LRRifleman · Nov 6, 2011

Hi!

I understand where you are coming from about TSC replacing the pellets! I trusted past performance with them, and got burned for over $400! I appreciate their taking my word, and they understand I am hesitant to open bags before I need to (try) to burn them ... and they have no clue what other pellets they will be getting ... they say they are hoping for a truck or two soon ... TSC is currently working with the maker's of "Nation's Choice" to work out how they will be "creditted" for the bad pellets!

The folks at TSC also know I am disabled, and it would be difficult for me to return 2 tons ... they have suggested just returning empty bags!

SmokeyTheBear · Nov 6, 2011

LRRifleman said:
@ Smokey ...

If I may ask, what brands are typically available up your way, and how much do they run a ton?
With the crap and rices they are charging for the crap here, I may take the car trailer and a weekened and run up to visit friends and pick up a ton or two!

I haven't looked at the tags so I don't know what brands, just gone by the places with the trailer loads of pallets stacked in the store lots, some under cover and some not, all have been wrapped (how well I don't know).

$194, $197, $209 per ton. I don't yet have the room to start my replacement so I have just been noting the prices and quantity when going by all of the local hardware/feed stores (an advantage from chicken keeping)/big boxes etc ...

The common ones carried by the places are, Maine Choice, Maine Woods, NEWP, I can't speak about what the current flavor of the day at the local Lowes and Home Depot (I haven't set foot in them in a couple of months). There is one place we go by in our travels that has Infernos.

There are a couple of pellet houses that have Oakies, Barefoot, Cubex and one of them had Ligs. Up here currently pelletsales.com has several other brands available for delivery including LGs and their re branded ones.

Ambiance is available but they are asking way to much for it the last time I looked it was almost the same as Cubex was.

You might get a better selection at BT or another pellet house on the way back from here.

LRRifleman · Nov 6, 2011

@ Smokey!

Thanks ... being a novice to the pellet stove and the various brands ... I guess it would be easier to ask, what brands should I avoid like the plague as opposed to what are the more reliable brands!

imacman · Nov 6, 2011

LRRifleman said:
... I guess it would be easier to ask, what brands should I avoid like the plague as opposed to what are the more reliable brands!

Obviously, the Nation's Choice you have, plus Infernos and Instant Heat are both junk too.

3650 · Nov 6, 2011

if they want empty bags, sounds to me they are on the fringe of telling you youre sol.

here are a few i dont like...ohp, greenway, pennington, heat resource. the first burn i did in my harman was penningtons and i thought they were good because the harman burns anything quite easily, then i realized they have a huge amount of clumpy ash and clinker build up compared to a quality pellet like somerset. all i burn now is somersets, well after i finish the last five bags of penningtons that is.

cold front · Nov 6, 2011

imacman said:
LRRifleman said:

... I guess it would be easier to ask, what brands should I avoid like the plague as opposed to what are the more reliable brands!

Click to expand...

Obviously, the Nation's Choice you have, plus Infernos and Instant Heat are both junk too.

Instant heat is not junk! Burns well, not too much ash, NO fines or dust. The only down fall for some people maybe the lower heat. I don't care my house is around 1200 square and it's 70 know matter what I burn and no matter what it is outside. Instant heat is also a fairly local manufacture who has been in business for about 5 years so, the product is constantly improving.

I like supporting the local guys they employ the people in your communities. Also since the Addison plant has cranked up capacity the last year or so the price of all pellets brands have drop $25-$40 bucks per ton in my area!

PJPellet · Nov 7, 2011

cold front said:
imacman said:

LRRifleman said:

... I guess it would be easier to ask, what brands should I avoid like the plague as opposed to what are the more reliable brands!

Click to expand...

Obviously, the Nation's Choice you have, plus Infernos and Instant Heat are both junk too.

Click to expand...

Instant heat is not junk! Burns well, not too much ash, NO fines or dust. The only down fall for some people maybe the lower heat. I don't care my house is around 1200 square and it's 70 know matter what I burn and no matter what it is outside. Instant heat is also a fairly local manufacture who has been in business for about 5 years so, the product is constantly improving.

I like supporting the local guys they employ the people in your communities. Also since the Addison plant has cranked up capacity the last year or so the price of all pellets brands have drop $25-$40 bucks per ton in my area!

I've had good luck with Instant Heat pellets too. I'd like to get a few ton for next year but I don't have any room in the barn left.

RiddleMasterMorgon · Nov 7, 2011

LRRifleman said:
Hi!

I understand where you are coming from about TSC replacing the pellets! I trusted past performance with them, and got burned for over $400! I appreciate their taking my word, and they understand I am hesitant to open bags before I need to (try) to burn them ... and they have no clue what other pellets they will be getting ... they say they are hoping for a truck or two soon ... TSC is currently working with the maker's of "Nation's Choice" to work out how they will be "creditted" for the bad pellets!

The folks at TSC also know I am disabled, and it would be difficult for me to return 2 tons ... they have suggested just returning empty bags!

If you want to be fair with them try again with some bags from the middle of one crate. If they dont work either, they can choose to haul your stack back and do whatever they please with it or leave it with you. I n either case I would ask for getting two more tons of whatever they will have. If you want to be really nice you can offer to pay the extra delivery (which is usually a local guy and the delivery was not bad I take it).

You might end up with 4 tons which might enable you to mix the bad bags in until the crap is gone. Threatn them with badmouthing both TSC and pellet maker/brand all over the internet and that usually gets things going - this forum here reaches a lot of people

As for Instant Heat, not a bad bad pellet (it doesn damage your stove), nut not a good heat pellet either.

Worst case scenario, you buy anothe rton of top notch pellets and start mixing 1:1 or 1:2 - depending on how bad they are, you can use them as compost for the garden or de ice your driveway with them...just kidding, hope TSC gives you two tons as replacement.

pastera · Nov 7, 2011

cold front said:
snipped...

Instant heat is not junk! Burns well, not too much ash, NO fines or dust. The only down fall for some people maybe the lower heat. I don't care my house is around 1200 square and it's 70 know matter what I burn and no matter what it is outside. Instant heat is also a fairly local manufacture who has been in business for about 5 years so, the product is constantly improving.

I like supporting the local guys they employ the people in your communities. Also since the Addison plant has cranked up capacity the last year or so the price of all pellets brands have drop $25-$40 bucks per ton in my area!

Sorry - They are JUNK
They won't light properly in my stove if the stove is cold unless I preheat the pellet grate with my torch, they are the only pellets that do this.

Once lit, they produce so little heat that my stove, which normally overheats the room on low with these outside temps, needs to be turned to medium. "Instant Heat" more like 'Where's the heat!'

The one plus is they have very few fines in the bags.

I'm all for supporting local companies but won't buy crap just because it's local - can just about spit to the Inferno plant from my house but won't give them my money after driving past the hammer mill busting up what appears to be a mix of industrial pallets and construction debris.

cold front · Nov 15, 2011

Aaron Pasteris said:
cold front said:

snipped...

Instant heat is not junk! Burns well, not too much ash, NO fines or dust. The only down fall for some people maybe the lower heat. I don't care my house is around 1200 square and it's 70 know matter what I burn and no matter what it is outside. Instant heat is also a fairly local manufacture who has been in business for about 5 years so, the product is constantly improving.

I like supporting the local guys they employ the people in your communities. Also since the Addison plant has cranked up capacity the last year or so the price of all pellets brands have drop $25-$40 bucks per ton in my area!

Click to expand...

Sorry - They are JUNK
They won't light properly in my stove if the stove is cold unless I preheat the pellet grate with my torch, they are the only pellets that do this.

Once lit, they produce so little heat that my stove, which normally overheats the room on low with these outside temps, needs to be turned to medium. "Instant Heat" more like 'Where's the heat!'

The one plus is they have very few fines in the bags.

I'm all for supporting local companies but won't buy crap just because it's local - can just about spit to the Inferno plant from my house but won't give them my money after driving past the hammer mill busting up what appears to be a mix of industrial pallets and construction debris.

Maybe your stove is junk...cause it burns fine in my stove

Recourse for pellets that won't burn?

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